# Should Bush loan Obama Air Force One... **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 5, 2008, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320 "2008-11-05T18:33:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/21 "2008-11-05T20:53:15Z")
Ahhh… an Air and a spare. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/22 "2008-11-05T21:24:41Z")
Senators fly on military aircraft anyway. He doesn’t need to do anything special here. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/23 "2008-11-05T21:38:51Z")
Don’t we have more important things to worry about? Obama is not president yet, he doesn’t need AF1. ---
**Author:** ![AtomicDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@AtomicDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AtomicDog)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/24 "2008-11-05T21:48:31Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > Don’t we have more important things to worry about? \< checking to make sure that I posted my OP in IMHO…yep. \> Isn’t Great Debates the forum for worrying about More Important Things? ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/25 "2008-11-05T21:50:04Z")
> [@AtomicDog](#): > > \< checking to make sure that I posted my OP in IMHO…yep. \> > > Isn’t Great Debates the forum for worrying about More Important Things? Yah, but the people are very tedious there. Ok, one word answer then: No. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Some\_FNG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/48db29/32.png) [@Some\_FNG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Some_FNG)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/26 "2008-11-05T21:59:07Z")
No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. He’s not yet entitled to fly on AF1, not should he use any military aircraft for personal reasons. If he really wants to, he can use a chartered flight to minimize his security risk but he should absolutely not use any tax-payer funded aircraft for this personal trip. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/27 "2008-11-05T22:03:13Z")
> [@](#): > > No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. Not to make too much light of it, But it would be an Epic PWNED moment, when they ask for proof of death, to whip out the New York Times, point to the headline and say “how’s that for proof byotches”. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/28 "2008-11-05T22:14:00Z")
> [@EpicNonsense](#): > > “Any plane the president flies in becomes “Air Force One,” and, in fact, there are two VC-25 jets-- the primary Air Force One and a back-up–kept primed and ready. The back-up jet even accompanies Air Force One on every overseas trip, just in case it’s needed.” Nitpick: When the President flies on Marine aircraft, that helicopter is designated Marine One. This is well known. When the President flies on a Navy aircraft, that plane is designated Navy One - which has happened exactly one time. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/29 "2008-11-05T22:14:17Z")
> [@Some\_FNG](#): > > No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. There’s no need for him to fly on AF1 because AF1 isn’t about safety alone, it’s about being in touch with the US Gov’t and being able to act at C-in-C. He doesn’t need that. But, as the President elect he does need safety for his travel and I’m sure the Secret Service will help arrange the proper transportation. ---
**Author:** ![Some\_FNG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/48db29/32.png) [@Some\_FNG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Some_FNG)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/30 "2008-11-05T23:00:47Z")
Then he can take a chartered flight with his SS detail in tow…:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/31 "2008-11-05T23:06:53Z")
> [@Some\_FNG](#): > > No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. OK, I’ll bite. Obama pays for his ticket on a commercial flight. His Secret Service detail will use tax dollars to fly aboard the same aircraft. But in order to do so, the commercial airline will have to involuntary bump a considerable number of passengers. Then there’s all the extra security precautions needed to be taken for the aircraft, including protection, inspections, etc. And all those passengers who remain on board will have to be doubly screened, all at tax payer’s expense. Of course, there’s all that extra goodwill the commercial airline will have to pay out to all those passengers who are involuntary bumped, reservations changed, plans disrupted, etc. It’s more cost effective and much better customer service to all potentially involved to use the Obama campaign plane, regardless of whether it’s paid with campaign funds, private donations, or even tax dollars. And if that’s not available, a military aircraft at taxpayer’s expense or not is fine with me. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/32 "2008-11-05T23:17:11Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Any airplane is Air Force One if the president is aboard. This is the designation used to identify the flight to air traffic controllers and the like. Not exactly… if for some reason, the President’s on a Navy plane, it’s “Navy One”, and if he ends up on an Army helicopter, it would be “Army One”. I’m also pretty sure that if for some reason, he was on United Flight 732 to London, he’d be on “Executive One”, which is the call sign for a commercial plane with him on board. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2008, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/33 "2008-11-05T23:34:23Z")
> [@Some\_FNG](#): > > No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. He’s not yet entitled to fly on AF1, not should he use any military aircraft for personal reasons. > If he really wants to, he can use a chartered flight to minimize his security risk but he should absolutely not use any tax-payer funded aircraft for this personal trip. Just so long as he doesn’t deadhead in a jump seat on a FedEx cargo flight. Tom Hanks did that in a movie once, and it didn’t end well. > [@Mr.Moto](#): > > Nitpick: When the President flies on Marine aircraft, that helicopter is designated Marine One. This is well known. > > When the President flies on a Navy aircraft, that plane is designated Navy One - which has happened exactly one time. And when he rides in the Wienermobile, it is similarly designated Oscar Mayer One. The number of times this has happened is classified. ---
**Author:** ![ASAKMOTSD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@ASAKMOTSD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASAKMOTSD)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/34 "2008-11-06T00:39:12Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > And when he rides in the Wienermobile, it is similarly designated Oscar Mayer One. The number of times this has happened is classified. You saw that in [the Henry Ford](http://farm1.static.flickr.com/7/10506485_5d01ee7109.jpg?v=0) museum, right? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_fight\_the\_hypothetical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/59ef9b/32.png) [@Don\_t\_fight\_the\_hypothetical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_fight_the_hypothetical)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/35 "2008-11-06T00:48:54Z")
> [@Some\_FNG](#): > > No, Senator Obama should pay for a seat on a commercial flight just like everyone else does when there’s a need to get there now for a funeral. Regardless of his actual status, as future POTUS he deserves to be protected from the crazies. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Scrivener](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@The\_Scrivener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Scrivener)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/36 "2008-11-06T01:19:10Z")
I’ve seen the [Marine, I think] helicopter protocol once for Bill Clinton in New Jersey; there were four of them, and when Clinton left, two choppers went in one direction, with the other two peeling off in two other directions. The whole spectacle was supremely cool. ---
**Author:** ![Rico](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rico/32/3582_2.png) [@Rico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rico)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/37 "2008-11-06T01:42:52Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > And when he rides in the Wienermobile, it is similarly designated Oscar Mayer One. The number of times this has happened is classified. You mean that wasn’t the designation for Bush’s limo? Damn… 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/38 "2008-11-06T02:00:45Z")
_My presidential vehicle has a first name, It’s O-S-C-A-R. My presidential vehicle has a second name, It’s M-A-Y-E-R. Oh, I love to ride it every day, And if you ask me, why I’ll say… Oscar Mayer has a way with leaders of the U.S.A._ ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/39 "2008-11-06T02:48:53Z")
> [@EpicNonsense](#): > > Well ya, it’s a back-up also. But it serves as a decoy too. > > ETA: From History channel > > “Any plane the president flies in becomes “Air Force One,” and, in fact, there are two VC-25 jets-- the primary Air Force One and a back-up–kept primed and ready. The back-up jet even accompanies Air Force One on every overseas trip, just in case it’s needed.” Again, I’ve seen AF1 land many times. I’ve never seen another version of it arrive. I’d expect an E4 to accompany the President’s plane overseas. As to the OP. Obama gets Secret Service protection now so any plane he rents is effectively “President Elect one”. However, it’s still his nickle. Air Force One is not a limo to be lent out at taxpayer expense for funerals. It serves the President and if it is used by someone else then it is not available. Unlike a limo-pool there are finite numbers of them. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2008, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320/40 "2008-11-06T03:47:37Z")
> [@lieu](#): > > Ahhh… an Air and a spare. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-bush-loan-obama-air-force-one/471320.md?page=3)