# Should businesses be required to give Election Day off with pay? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 22, 2014, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921 "2014-12-22T16:28:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/81 "2014-12-24T04:24:28Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > Well, that certainly explains Farm and Oil subsidies and military spending… Social security, medicare… > [@Lightnin](#): > > While I like the idea of encouraging people to vote Why? Why does everyone act like this is a laudable goal? Have you _met_ [most people](http://www.newsweek.com/how-ignorant-are-americans-66053)? Why in God’s name would you want to drive these people _toward_ the polls?! > [@JohnT](#): > > And does this include the government? Are you kidding? You realize you’re talking about the cohort of workers who just decided to pay themselves for Friday under the reasoning that “Christmas is on a Thursday, so fuck it.”? > [@Velocity](#): > > I think the idea is that taking time off to vote can be perceived negatively by one’s employer. I think the idea of not needing a valid photo ID to vote can be perceived as an opportunity for fraud. My imagination doesn’t make it so. Do you have any citations of a worker being negatively affected by his decision to vote? > [@MrDibble](#): > > Huh, learn something new every day. And now I have so much more pity for the non-Federal American worker (and I already pitied them a hell of a lot, what with fire-at-will and no minimum annual leave) The lady who cleans the floors at my office has a better labour setup than the American office worker, it seems. You’re talking about mandatory time off. Most of us have time off as a perk, out of the goodness of the capitalist heart, not a government-declared benefit. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/82 "2014-12-24T18:30:18Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Part of the rationale against requiring an ID to vote is that it is in fact a burden to obtain an ID. But the thing is, I don’t agree it’s a burden to obtain ID anymore than it is for a person to take time from work to go vote. As I explain in my post, you have to consider two totally different classes of people. People who are affected by not getting enough time off to go vote are generally successful members of society. They’re holding down jobs. They have reliable transportation (either personal or public) that gets them around. They have at least some basic skills at negotiating a bureaucracy, since they probably have bank accounts and have to fill out at least some basic forms at work. Those people can find a way to vote outside of their work hours given pretty simple restrictions (ie, they can’t be scheduled to work the entire time that the polls are open). People who don’t already have a state-issued ID are almost certainly marginalized to some degree. Maybe they’re so old that they never needed one. Maybe they have a disability that means they can’t get around as easily. Maybe they’re only barely literate, and the thought of having to fill out the forms at the DMV is terrifying. Maybe they are so poor that the bus fare and the $12 application fee (or whatever it is) really are major stumbling blocks. When you consider who the various obstacles might actually affect, it becomes clear that they are different. What seems like a minor obstacle to people who are generally capable can be a major one to others. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/83 "2014-12-24T18:46:52Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Saturday folks, Saturday. What’s so complicated about that? No, it’s not perfect, that’s why you have early, postal, and absentee voting. Tuesday is not a magic day. Oy vey, are you kidding me? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/84 "2014-12-24T18:51:11Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Saturday folks, Saturday. What’s so complicated about that? This. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/85 "2014-12-24T18:51:58Z")
If they are too illiterate to fill out the forms at the DMV, how are they going to fill out the ballot? If they can’t afford the bus to the DMV, how can they afford the bus to the polling place? IOW, it is easy enough for them to vote but too hard to get ID. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/86 "2014-12-24T19:27:36Z")
> [@boffking](#): > > Low voter turnout is very common in the USA. What if we required all businesses (except for media/ journalism and emergency services) to close, and give their employees the day off with pay? I imagine that this would bring far more voters in. Since nobody celebrates Columbus Day, if there is a debate about too many holidays, we could get rid of that. Low voter turnout is very common in the USA because large numbers of registered voters do not give a shit about voting. They Do Not Care! Oregon has had vote by mail for may years. Your ballot shows up in your mail a couple of weeks before voting day, you have plenty of time to mark the thing, and then put a stamp on it and put it back in the mail or drop in off at several sites. And a full 1/3 of Oregon voters simply cannot be bothered to go to the trouble. So you want to give a paid day off to the 1/3 of the populace who do not give a shit? ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/87 "2014-12-24T19:34:36Z")
Oh, and that is 1/3 of registered voters, not 1/3 of the populace. So the paid day off would benefit not only those too lazy to vote but also those too lazy to register to vote. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/88 "2014-12-24T19:47:02Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Saturday folks, Saturday. What’s so complicated about that? No, it’s not perfect, that’s why you have early, postal, and absentee voting. Tuesday is not a magic day. [35% of Americans work weekends.](http://www.wisegeek.com/how-many-people-in-the-us-work-on-the-weekend.htm) ---
**Author:** ![rsat3acr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@rsat3acr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsat3acr)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/89 "2014-12-24T20:51:57Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > The companies the employees work for. > > One day, every two years. Wow, what a financial blow. Well there are primarys, run offs, off year elections etc. We have two or three elections a year here. We also have a two week window of early voting and vote by mail. The level of financial blow is relative. The business won’t just magically have more money to pay the employees, the cost will be passed on to the public. I for one don’t want that. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/90 "2014-12-24T21:14:36Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > If they are too illiterate to fill out the forms at the DMV, how are they going to fill out the ballot? Well, you get a sample ballot beforehand, and you could ask someone to help you with it in private, then bring it with you to make your vote. > [@](#): > > If they can’t afford the bus to the DMV, how can they afford the bus to the polling place? All my polling places have been within a short walk from my house. Rather than poke holes in my examples (which I will admit are not comprehensive), could you address my general point, which is that people without official ID probably don’t have it because they are part of a marginal group having a tough time making their way in modern society? Do you think there are a bunch of people out there who just don’t have official identification just for kicks? ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/91 "2014-12-24T21:19:15Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > If they are too illiterate to fill out the forms at the DMV, how are they going to fill out the ballot? If they can’t afford the bus to the DMV, how can they afford the bus to the polling place? IOW, it is easy enough for them to vote but too hard to get ID. > > Regards, > Shodan This. 100% Except replace “illiterate” with “conservative” because how dare we want some people to vote because we don’t like their views! If you want to vote, its easy enough for you to do it by voting liberal ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/92 "2014-12-24T22:18:13Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > [35% of Americans work weekends.](http://www.wisegeek.com/how-many-people-in-the-us-work-on-the-weekend.htm) But even more work weekdays. ---
**Author:** ![threeorange](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@threeorange](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threeorange)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2014, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/93 "2014-12-24T22:45:26Z")
The problem is that the polls are open only during hours that large numbers of people are working or commuting. So how about making Election Day an actual “election day” by keeping polls open for a 24-hour period? Then there would be very few people who would be unable find a window of time to cast a vote. ---
**Author:** ![Tread](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Tread](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tread)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2014, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/94 "2014-12-25T11:13:01Z")
> [@boffking](#): > > Low voter turnout is very common in the USA. What if we required all businesses (except for media/ journalism and emergency services) to close, and give their employees the day off with pay? I imagine that this would bring far more voters in. Since nobody celebrates Columbus Day, if there is a debate about too many holidays, we could get rid of that. Why do you think media/journalism and emergency services should not be allowed to vote? I presume my occupation would be included in emergency services, since I operate a power plant. Otherwise the polling places would have no lights. So why do you think my vote is less important than the principal at the local school? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2014, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/95 "2014-12-25T14:46:08Z")
> [@Tread](#): > > Why do you think media/journalism and emergency services should not be allowed to vote? > > I presume my occupation would be included in emergency services, since I operate a power plant. Otherwise the polling places would have no lights. > > So why do you think my vote is less important than the principal at the local school? Stop projecting. He didn’t say you aren’t allowed to vote, he said that some essential services shouldn’t grind to a halt because it is Election Day. How many times have you planned to vote, but the one thing that stopped you was your boss not allowing you to leave work between the hours of roughly 7am and 8pm? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2014, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/96 "2014-12-25T15:41:55Z")
> [@Tread](#): > > I presume my occupation would be included in emergency services, since I operate a power plant. I hear that Springfield has early voting, so I think you’re covered. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2014, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/97 "2014-12-25T16:52:24Z")
I found this study by the Census Bureau: [http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/p20-562.pdf](http://http://www.census.gov/prod/2010pubs/p20-562.pdf) It reports that of registered voters who didn’t vote in 2008, 18% didn’t vote because of schedule conflicts. Overall, 90% of those who were registered to vote actually voted. So, if we take 1 million people who were registered to vote in 2008, roughly 900,000 of them voted. In that same sample of people, about 18,000 people didn’t vote because they didn’t have the time. We’re supposed to establish a national holiday so 1.8% of registered voters can better manage their own schedules? ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2014, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/98 "2014-12-25T17:22:14Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Saturday folks, Saturday. What’s so complicated about that? No, it’s not perfect, that’s why you have early, postal, and absentee voting. Tuesday is not a magic day. Sunday’s better. Many stores are already closed. How about Christmas Day? Saturday has obvious problems. Even if they can be overcome with absentee ballots what message does it send? ---
**Author:** ![Tread](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Tread](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tread)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2014, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/99 "2014-12-26T01:05:09Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Stop projecting. He didn’t say you aren’t allowed to vote, he said that some essential services shouldn’t grind to a halt because it is Election Day. > > How many times have you planned to vote, but the one thing that stopped you was your boss not allowing you to leave work between the hours of roughly 7am and 8pm? I never indicated that OP said I couldn’t vote… I mentioned media and Journalism as not being able to… yes that was carrying the premise that people can’t vote since they are working, which is why OP wants everyone except them off. I asked why OP considered my vote less important, since their pan is to make it easier and offer others a full days pay to do what may take 10 minutes… yes it make take a few hours also, yet there is nothing in that plan to make it any easier for me. So if we are going to give say… a principal a full day off with pay, and I will have to work my full 12 hour shift … then it seems as if his plan values principal’s vote more than mine. OP’s premise seemed to be that people don’t vote because they are at work the day of election. IF that is the case, then a plan to fix that problem, while not addressing same for people such as myself that work a 12 hour shift, there would be huge inequities for people that society, or governing bodies creating the law, deem to valuable to be let off work. ---
**Author:** ![Tread](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Tread](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tread)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2014, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921/100 "2014-12-26T01:10:44Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I hear that Springfield has early voting, so I think you’re covered. 😃 **D’OH !** [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-businesses-be-required-to-give-election-day-off-with-pay/707921.md?page=4)