# Should college faculties seek political diversity? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 30, 2002, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301 "2002-08-30T14:44:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/41 "2002-09-03T06:22:37Z")
—However, note that the academic comparisons cited were mostly department by department, rather than in total. Simpson’s Paradox can only come into play if one is considering overall rates across departments.— As I noted, it could also work given several chairs within a department, the hiring of which is intermitant and usually independant of one another. —However, the liberal arts majors don’t have that many high-paying opportunities in the private sector.— Which begs the question of how many conservative students go into these fields to begin with. Further, while what you say is true about Literature factories, it is not very representative of what people do with humanities type majors: very often people go into grad schools for other things, needing only the college degree, and not a specific major (humanities majors are generally thought to be much easier than social sciences or natural sciences). Needless to say, there are lots of much higher paying jobs often to normal college graduates of any major than professorship (which, keep in mind, despite being fairly low on the pay scale, is also a very hard job to get: there are no guarantees at all, as well as requiring lots of extra work and poverty) ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/42 "2002-09-04T14:51:22Z")
Conservative activist David Horowitz has [announced](http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/horowitz.html) > [@](#): > > The Center for the Study of Popular Culture in conjunction with other interested organizations is therefore launching a “Campaign for Fairness and Inclusion in Higher Education.” Its agenda is to call on university administrations to implement the following five demands: > > 1. Conduct an inquiry into political bias in the hiring process for faculty and administrators, and seek ways to promote fairness towards - and inclusion of - diverse and under-represented mainstream perspectives; > > 2. Conduct an inquiry into political bias in the selection of commencement speakers and seek ways to promote fairness towards - and inclusion of - diverse and under-represented mainstream perspectives; > > 3. Conduct an inquiry into political bias in the allocation of student program funds - including speakers’ fees - and seek ways to promote fairness towards and inclusion of diverse and under-represented mainstream perspectives; > > 4. Institute a zero tolerance policy towards the obstruction of campus speakers and meetings and the destruction of informational literature distributed by campus groups. > > 5. Adopt a code of conduct for faculty that ensures that classrooms will welcome diverse viewpoints and not be used for political indoctrination, which is a violation of students’ academic freedom. Note that the 5 points are written in ways that are hard to oppose. Who could be against conducting inquiries, not destroying literature, or having diverse speakers? Whether this campaign will have any impact is anyone’s guess. ---
**Author:** ![ElJeffe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/958977/32.png) [@ElJeffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElJeffe)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/43 "2002-09-04T20:27:58Z")
> [@](#): > > ## quote: > > ## If all you ever hear is the liberal interpretation, you may grow to be oblivious that an alternate viewpoint even exists. > > Why do you assume that if the professor’s a lefty, that all (s)he’s going to present is the lefty viewpoint? If you’ve got evidence that these “lefty” professors are slanting the course material, please present it. I could give examples, but they would all be anecdotal. However, the anecdotes range from a decent variety of schools. In general, I don’t think the slanted viewpoint is going to be a conscious and maiicious effort on the part of the liberal teacher to exclude all references to conservative ideas. The real world doesn’t usually work that way - it’s more subtle. Teachers would tend to give more time to one side than another, due to their belief that one side is “more correct”, and thus more pertinent. Anecdotes the professor relates would tend to illustrate the liberal view. Little things. Over the course of a dozen classes, all taught by liberal teachers, things would tend to sink in. The liberal professors aren’t trying to intentionally indoctrinate kids (at least, not most of them - I’ve had some who did), but given enough time, the liberal POV will tend to be the only one the kids are exposed to. It doesn’t help that a lot of students really idolize these professors. If Prof. Plum feels this way, then maybe I should to. And look, Mr. Green and Miss Scarlet feel the same way - must be something to it. Jeff ---
**Author:** ![Mojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Mojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mojo)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/44 "2002-09-04T21:46:02Z")
> [@](#): > > Teachers would tend to give more time to one side than another, due to their belief that one side is “more correct”, and thus more pertinent. Anecdotes the professor relates would tend to illustrate the liberal view. This may be possible with the liberal arts, but how does this apply to the hard sciences? How does someone “slant” math? > [@](#): > > It doesn’t help that a lot of students really idolize these professors. This doesn’t jibe with my personal experiences at all. Professors were tolerated, maybe even begrudgingly liked, but never “idolized”. But that’s a state school for you- very few svengali liberal profs. Lucky I never had a Cornell West type teaching me or I might have been brainwashed. ---
**Author:** ![Soup\_du\_jour](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@Soup\_du\_jour](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soup_du_jour)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2002, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/45 "2002-09-05T13:46:24Z")
I guess someone could slant math by doing different word problems… Left: “The question is: how many more Latino students must this university accept to achieve perfect cultural diversity?” Right: “The question is: How many employees should the CEO sack to achieve the highest profit margin?” See, it’s easy to slant math! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Banger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@Banger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banger)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2002, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/46 "2002-09-05T15:54:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mojo \* > **This may be possible with the liberal arts, but how does this apply to the hard sciences? How does someone “slant” math?** The focus of this thread seems to not be on hard science. A couple of posters indicated an opinion that hard science could be where the conservatives are, but the only numbers I have seen posted have been for English, History, Political Science, etc. > [@](#): > > \*\*This doesn’t jibe with my personal experiences at all. Professors were tolerated, maybe even begrudgingly liked, but never “idolized”. But that’s a state school for you- very few svengali liberal profs. Lucky I never had a Cornell West type teaching me or I might have been brainwashed. \*\* I went to a state school and saw a few of my professors “idolized”, so to speak. Of course, I was a philosophy major, which could have been a factor. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2002, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/47 "2002-09-05T20:28:54Z")
Here’s some specific evidence of discrimination in hiring. Also, note that the Professor Redding has proposed a remedy of affirmative action. > [@](#): > > …one (politically liberal) professor has proposed affirmative action outreach. Richard Redding, a professor of psychology at Villanova University, writing in a recent issue of American Psychologist, notes that of the 31 social policy articles that appeared in American Psychologist between 1990 and 1999, 30 could be classified as liberal; one as conservative. The key issue, as Redding rightly sees it, is not the preponderance of Democrats over Republicans, but **the liberal policy of systematically excluding conservatives. Redding cites an experiment in which several graduate departments received mock applications from two candidates nearly identical in all ways save one: one “applicant” disclosed that he was a conservative Christian. The professors judged the non-conservative to be the significantly better candidate.** [http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=2722](http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=2722) ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2002, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/48 "2002-09-06T14:49:43Z")
> [@](#): > > _Posted by december_ > Also, note that the Professor Redding has proposed a remedy of affirmative action. In noting this, am I expected to take this as two people having the same idea independently, or as evidence of a “sauce for the gander” campaign? > [@](#): > > Note that the 5 points are written in ways that are hard to oppose. Noted. Trolls do this too, though. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2002, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/49 "2002-09-06T15:35:29Z")
> [@](#): > > ## quote: > > ## Posted by december Also, note that the Professor Redding has proposed a remedy of affirmative action. > > In noting this, am I expected to take this as two people having the same idea independently, or as evidence of a “sauce for the gander” campaign? The former. Also, Prof. Redding is a liberal, so liberals on this board may give his view more credence than mine. > [@](#): > > ## quote: > > ## Note that the 5 points are written in ways that are hard to oppose. > > Noted. Trolls do this too, though. I always thought it was just the reverse – that trolls posted opinions in provocative, confrontational ways. ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2002, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/50 "2002-09-06T17:01:15Z")
> [@](#): > > _[december]_ > Note that the 5 points are written in ways that are hard to oppose. > _me_ > Noted. Trolls do this too, though. > _december_ > I always thought it was just the reverse – that trolls posted opinions in provocative, confrontational ways. Perhaps this is (generally) true now. The young are so crude. But when I were a lad, a troll would niggle and cover the niggling with a very broad spread of grand principles that were an effective cover story for careless readers. The political intent of a post may be disguised (to some degree) by a little drafting - in favour of child protection, fairness, patriotism, epidemidological rectitude or whatever. Or for something, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Mojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Mojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mojo)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2002, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/51 "2002-09-06T18:07:59Z")
From the Center for the Study of Popular Culture’s website: > [@](#): > > The fact that 83% of commencement speakers at our schools are going to be liberals, Democrats, or leftists is stunning! There is no balance of ideas there and this list is mirrored at universities all across our nation. It’s time we ended the forty-year reign of leftist academics on our campuses and restore common sense and free speech to our campuses – it’s time to TAKE BACK OUR CAMPUSES! “TAKE BACK OUR CAMPUSES” sounds more like the inflammatory rhetoric of someone wishing for a right wing **slant** as opposed to a call for more balance. And if you want an example of colleges where dissent and the free exchange of ideas aren’t tolerated, the worst offenders are the religious (and typically right-wing/republican) schools like Bob Jones, Oral Roberts, et. al. where they typically include a morality clause that can be interpreted as they wish. Sounds to me like Horowitz’s solutions all involve more government or bigger government. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/52 "2002-09-08T01:21:41Z")
It has been my experience that the more loudly people complain of bias in some institution, the less willing they would be to accept a truly unbiased version of said institution (vice an institution with the ‘right’ bias). And FTR, I hear a lot more complaints about the left-leaning tendencies of journalists (DEFINITELY not the same thing as left leaning tendencies of the media – unless reporters have some weird secret arrangement whereby they can fire the zillionaires they work for) than I do from lefties about the overwhelming majority of right-leaning people in the military. Or banking. Or leadership of big corporations (which I admit changed a lot during the Clinton years). Etc. To paraphase (and generalize) a previous post in this thread: if you are apalled at the ideological bias of reporters (or the miilitary): shut up, quit your job, and become a reporter (or enlist). Heads up – there will likely be a paycut. ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/53 "2002-09-08T01:46:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by F. U. Shakespeare \* > \*\*It has been my experience that the more loudly people complain of bias in some institution, the less willing they would be to accept a truly unbiased version of said institution (vice an institution with the ‘right’ bias). \*\* That’s quite an indictment of the entire civil rights movement. Is that what you meant? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/54 "2002-09-08T02:23:48Z")
Okay, if I understand correctly, the viewpoint of the liberals here is that a liberal bias exists in colleges, but only because people who want to be professors tend to be liberal. Explain then, the lack of diversity in college speakers, commencement address speakers, and guest lecturers. The imbalance of liberals to conservatives is about as great as it is among the faculty, even though they have all of America to draw from. And when conservatives do speak, they are often heckled, protested, and in general made to be as unwelcome as possible. As a conservative who went to a liberal college, I can tell you that it was not much fun. Most of campus life was shut off to me because much of it revolved around liberal causes. And my professors turned out to be extremely close-minded, and when they’d ask for ‘debate’ on an issue and you’d offer a conservative/libertarian viewpoint you’d often get dismissed or sneered at. At Berkeley, a conservative campus newspaper had its offices vandalized and all its issues stolen. Many campuses refuse to allow ROTC recruiting. In a country that is dominated by a great dialogue between two large political parties, essentially excluding one of them from academic life is destructive and just plain wrong. ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/55 "2002-09-08T03:07:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sam Stone \* > **Explain then, the lack of diversity in college speakers, commencement address speakers, and guest lecturers.** **2002 Commencement Speakers** MIT: James Wolfensohn, president of the World Bank, not known for its appeal to liberals. His [bio](http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/tt/2002/feb27/wolfensohn.html) doesn’t sound particularly liberal either. Yale: New York Governor George Pataki, a Republican. Harvard: Al Franken, definitely liberal. UC Berkeley: Jonny Mosely, an Olympic gold medal skier. No idea what his politics are. UCLA: Dov Seidman, founder of The Legal Knowledge Co. Given his [bio](http://www.lrn.com/about/corporate.html), could go either way. Ohio State University: President George W. Bush. Please. Princeton: eBay CEO Meg Whitman. Don’t know her politics, but CEOs tend towards the conservative, or the moderate with liberal social politics. Cornell: Danny Glover. Liberal. Dartmouth: Fred Rogers, famous television show host. Probably more liberal than not, but pretty innocuous, really. His show has never been political. Brown: Doesn’t have guest speakers at commencement. Columbia: David Stern, commissioner of the NBA. No clue. U Penn: Jim Lehrer, host of the NewsHour on PBS. Pretty liberal. Georgetown: Jonah Nolan, screenwriter of _Memento_. Who knows or cares what his politics are? USC: David Halberstam. Somewhat liberal. Vanderbilt: MLB Commissioner Bud Selig. I’ll go with conservative here. SMU: Kathy Bates. OK, very liberal. Texas A&M: Karen Hughes, former aide to Pres. George Bush. Do I have to say? I could keep searching, but I really don’t see this overwhelming imbalance. I think we need some cites, here. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/56 "2002-09-08T04:18:40Z")
So far, we don’t seem to have much that’s new in the way of actual evidence, as opposed to unsupported assertions and anecdotal reports, on the issue of whether colleges are actively **discriminating** against conservative candidates. The one possible exception is **december** ’s cited study of respondents reacting differently to the same c.v. depending on whether or not the applicant self-identified as a conservative Christian. I call that a “possible” exception because I think y’all ( **Izzy** excepted) have not yet really confronted the question of whether **certain** beliefs generally identified as “liberal” may in fact constitute a BFOQ—bona fide occupational qualification—based on the ideals that the college officially upholds. A couple of respondents objected—and I think with some reason—to my use of white-supremacism as an example of a belief that might be called “conservative”, but I notice nobody mentioned my other example, i.e., disapproval of homosexuality. If I’m on a search committee at a college that is explicitly committed to equal rights regardless of sexual orientation, and I don’t want to hire a candidate who openly opposes homosexuality and supports legal discrimination against homosexuals, am I just being bigoted and unfair to conservatives? Or do I have a justifiable reason for thinking that this candidate is going to be handicapped in his/her ability to serve my college’s mission? Similarly, if I’m on a search committee at a college that is explicitly committed to religious tolerance, and I don’t want to hire a candidate who openly adheres to a doctrine that everybody else has to convert to his/her faith or else they’ll burn in hell for all eternity, am I just discriminating against conservatives, or have I identified a genuine problem with the candidate’s qualifications? Now, if you want to argue about whether colleges **should** have goals and mission statements that openly espouse so-called “liberal” goals like gay rights and religious tolerance, go right ahead for all I care. Or if you have actual evidence that the **reason** college humanities departments are primarily liberal (a fact which I don’t think anyone here is even trying to dispute, **T-bone** ) is that the colleges are unfairly discriminating against conservatives **without** a BFOQ justification, let’s see it. But so far, most of the arguments seem to boil down to mere assertions that the mean old liberal establishment of academia is just refusing to hire conservatives because they don’t like conservatives. Prove it, sez I. These whinefests about how liberals are ruthlessly indoctrinating college students are especially irritating to me—particularly now in the midst of a very stormy electoral campaign season in my area—because I personally bend over so far backwards to **avoid** any conflict of interest between my responsibilities to my students and my right to express my own liberal political beliefs. I won’t canvass on campus, I won’t put up posters in the dorms or mention political events in my classes, I won’t do anything that might even look as though I’m taking unfair advantage of my faculty-member status to influence students’ politics. And this is the thanks I get. Hmmmph. **SS:** _As a conservative who went to a liberal college, I can tell you that it was not much fun. Most of campus life was shut off to me because much of it revolved around liberal causes._ This complaint, like the suggestions for “ideological affirmative action” coming from conservatives, sounds rather strange coming from a libertarian. I thought you folks didn’t care how many other people chose to adopt different “causes” from yours as long as you had the individual freedom to support your own. _In a country that is dominated by a great dialogue between two large political parties, essentially excluding one of them from academic life is destructive and just plain wrong._ “Excluding”? More hyperbole. If your complaint is just that the prevailing ethos on many college campuses tends to be liberal, well, sorry you felt left out, and I wholeheartedly urge you and your fellow conservatives to go into academia yourself and provide a countervailing conservative ethos. If you’re asserting that this imbalance is a result of colleges unfairly **discriminating** against conservatives, well, as **pld** says, we need cites. (And the fact that the first chance I get to come back to this thread is around midnight on a Saturday should give a clue about what “liberal” campus life is **really** like for professors. 🙂 Yeah, like I have the time to indoctrinate my students with liberal beliefs even if I wanted to! Have fun, and see y’all again probably after classes end in December!) ---
**Author:** ![december](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@december](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/december)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/57 "2002-09-08T14:04:25Z")
**pl** , it’s not clear how you chose these particular colleges. I presume you used some reasonably random method, like taking whichever ones you could easily find out about. I will quibble a bit with your classifications. There are only two definite liberals onh your list: Bush and Hughes. The politics of Selig and Wolfensohn and Whitman were SWAGs (scientific wild-assed guesses) on your part. ---
**Author:** ![pldennison](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@pldennison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pldennison)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/58 "2002-09-08T17:09:35Z")
december, I picked the Ivy League – generally perceived as highly liberal – plus several large, well-known colleges with high undergraduate enrollment. Nice Freudian slip there, BTW, calling Bush and Hughes “liberal.” If you’d like to go through the U.S. News college ratings and pick the top 50 colleges in the country or something, go for it, but it’s your assertion so don’t expect others to do your homework for you. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/59 "2002-09-08T17:37:52Z")
**Pldennison:** [http://www.yaf.org/press/05\_16\_02.html](http://www.yaf.org/press/05_16_02.html) From the article: > [@](#): > > A survey released today by Young America’s Foundation indicates top colleges and universities across the nation overwhelmingly choose liberal speakers for commencement exercises. > … > …only three well-known conservatives made the list of over 100 top schools. These include Secretary of Labor Elaine Chao at DePauw University; author Thomas Wolfe at Duke University; and author William Safire at Tulane University. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2002, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301/60 "2002-09-08T19:02:20Z")
Couldn’t be, could it, that education, by its very nature, tends to expand, or _liberalize_ one’s world view? Well, yes, it could. One of the reasons I support higher education so fervently. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-college-faculties-seek-political-diversity/126301.md?page=4)