# Should food stamps stop covering bottle deposits? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 25, 2015, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575 "2015-11-25T20:01:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/41 "2015-11-28T01:35:51Z")
as a man on Food Stamps- I don’t know what to say. All this time, I’ve been struggling to buy groceries when I should have been splurging on recyclable bottles and profitting! Again, selling the bottles and their contents would be much more profitable. Now, I shall return to watching Jungle Captive. The plot in the film makes little sense. It still makes more sense than the plot described in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/42 "2015-11-28T10:53:24Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > running coach pointed out already that the number is for all trafficking but this isn’t the right math, istm. The cost to the system would be for the whole product not just the deposit. I don’t think so. If they weren’t getting thrown out of the system for scamming, they would still be receiving food assistance. They’d just be spending it on food instead of their scam. I think that in a system this size, whether it’s military spending, road construction, or food stamps, there is unavoidably going to be some waste and theft. We can minimize it to some extent, but I’d prefer that we not make the system too draconian. I’m willing to accept some loss in order to ensure that we don’t damage people who really need the help. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/43 "2015-11-28T15:21:23Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > It apparently happened ONE TIME in 2011. And according to your story the water cost $6.00 and the scamsters got $2.40 back. That’s some big time scamming. > > If you think it happened more than one time, then where’s the cite? Both the articles you linked talk about the exact same case. From [here:](http://bangordailynews.com/2011/08/22/news/bangor/bangor-woman-records-couple-dumping-water-in-food-stamp-scam/?ref=inline) > [@](#): > > The water dumping the Bangor couple did on Saturday is a common occurrence, Edwards said. > > “This has been an ongoing problem,” he said. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/44 "2015-11-28T15:40:47Z")
> [@](#): > > In a ploy a number of the store’s employees describe as common, these men had found a way to turn their funds from the federally administered Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, or SNAP, into cold, hard cash, which can then be used to purchase items that do not meet the program’s guidelines. So here’s a way to solve this “problem”. Let people on SNAP buy whatever the hell they want with the funds and stop trying to micromanage their consumption patterns. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/45 "2015-11-28T15:40:57Z")
Incidents in Syria and Paris have been drowning out the real news. It’s good to see this important story is being covered. > [@Bricker](#): > > From [here:](http://bangordailynews.com/2011/08/22/news/bangor/bangor-woman-records-couple-dumping-water-in-food-stamp-scam/?ref=inline) So one family in Maine is allegedly pursuing this “scam.” I doubt they’re master criminals: there must be much better ways to profit reselling food stamp purchases. But now we’d better divert money from useless programs like police bodycams or public mental health and spend it on water bottling. Bottlers will be required to prepare bottles that are obviously cracked or flawed and non-returnable, and food stamp users will be permitted to only buy water in those bottles. The cost of deliberately flawing the bottles can be passed on to the freeloaders themselves. Win-win. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/46 "2015-11-28T16:16:50Z")
My local grocery often runs “buy 4 and receive a coupon for $3 off your next shopping order” promotions. When I was on Food Stamps, I would buy the four items with food stamps and use the coupon to buy something I couldn’t get with Food Stamps; i.e. soap & toothpaste. It’s a bitch being poor. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/47 "2015-11-28T16:22:11Z")
Wish people would quit saying that this isn’t real because there are more efficient scams. It’s not efficient but it’s damn quick and easy. I have no doubt a number of people use it. As I said above though, it’s best combatted with a little discretion at the store. No selling of 10 cases of water to a single customer using food stamps. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/48 "2015-11-28T16:32:19Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Again, selling the bottles and their contents would be much more profitable. Not really, no. The $2.40 is readily available at the retailer. There’s no question that a wiser course would be to sell the contents – after all, the new purchaser could ALSO return the bottles after consuming the water. But that course involves finding a willing buyer – eBay? Craigslist? – and being willing to take the time to advertise, attract a buyer, meet up with that buyer, and sell. The people in this scenario are motivated by the same thinking that makes payday loans and car title loans attractive: “I know the financial terms suck, but that’s outweighed by my immediate need for cash.” Consider, in fact, that your objection (“…would be much more profitable…” to do it another way) would if accepted mean that payday loan shops and car title loan shops would not exist, since it’s much more profitable for the consumer to avoid those kinds of predatory financial terms. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/49 "2015-11-28T16:35:22Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > So one family in Maine is allegedly pursuing this “scam.” I doubt they’re master criminals: there must be much better ways to profit reselling food stamp purchases. They’re not. They’re desperate and poor. We ought to be exploring how to extend better social support services to them. But that doesn’t mean we can deny that the particular fraud described here exists. Nor is it “just one family in Maine.” [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/2C7E61-1Yyg/hqdefault.jpg "WATER DUMPING FOOD STAMP FRAUD") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C7E61-1Yyg) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/50 "2015-11-28T16:37:48Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Do they even _sell_ milk like that in Maine? I’ve never seen milk for sale in a glass jug at a grocery store, let alone one where the bottle would be worth nearly as much as its actual content. Don’t know about Maine, but Oberweiss milk that is found commonly in Chicago area grocery stores has a $1.50 deposit on their glass bottles (1/2 gallon.) ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/51 "2015-11-28T16:56:29Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Consider, in fact, that your objection (“…would be much more profitable…” to do it another way) would if accepted mean that payday loan shops and car title loan shops would not exist, since it’s much more profitable for the consumer to avoid those kinds of predatory financial terms. Those businesses depend on people who have no good options available to them. A usurious payday loan is a terrible deal to be sure, but if the choices are that, going hungry, being evicted, or doing crime, it’s not the worst decision. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/52 "2015-11-28T17:03:31Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Those businesses depend on people who have no good options available to them. A usurious payday loan is a terrible deal to be sure, but if the choices are that, going hungry, being evicted, or doing crime, it’s not the worst decision. Exactly my point. In similar fashion the choice to empty water bottles to get the bottle deposit is something done by people with no better options available to them. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/53 "2015-11-28T17:06:56Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Exactly my point. In similar fashion the choice to empty water bottles to get the bottle deposit is something done by people with no better options available to them. Nonsense. Anyone with a load of newly-bought groceries always has other, more or less obvious options. Even cut-rate resale pays substantially better than the purported bottle-return “scam.” ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/54 "2015-11-28T17:34:36Z")
For Pete’s sake just quit. Standing out front or going door to door reselling your food stamp purchases isn’t anywhere near as easy or quick as the deposit scam even if it’s going to get you an extra $10. ---
**Author:** ![Monocracy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monocracy/32/4493_2.png) [@Monocracy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monocracy)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/55 "2015-11-28T17:37:10Z")
When I was working in a grocery store 20+ years ago in Massachusetts, bottle deposits were not covered by food stamps. You could pay for the product with stamps, but the deposit had to be covered with cash. I’m not sure why any state would let deposits be paid for with food stamps. I can see some people abusing the water bottle deposits. I just purchased a 35-pack of water for $3.49, making it 10 cents a bottle. A nickel deposit would give someone a 33% return when using this scam. Back in the day, when food stamps were paper money, some people would go store to store making small purchases to collect the change to build up enough for a pack of butts or whatever. It seems like a huge waste of time, but people would do it. The easiest solution would be to outlaw deposits on water bottles. I’d get behind that law. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/56 "2015-11-28T17:50:54Z")
I guess the argument against that is if someone is actually dead broke they couldn’t but any items that require a deposit. ---
**Author:** ![Celyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9dc877/32.png) [@Celyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Celyn)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/57 "2015-11-28T17:51:43Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > My local grocery often runs “buy 4 and receive a coupon for $3 off your next shopping order” promotions. > > When I was on Food Stamps, I would buy the four items with food stamps and use the coupon to buy something I couldn’t get with Food Stamps; i.e. soap & toothpaste. > > It’s a bitch being poor. That’s a bit worrying. What is the thinking behind not being allowed to buy soap and toothpaste, which are hardly luxuries, and are quite useful in terms of not being rejected by society at large, getting a job and all that stuff? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/58 "2015-11-28T18:19:02Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > For Pete’s sake just quit. Standing out front or going door to door reselling your food stamp purchases isn’t anywhere near as easy or quick as the deposit scam even if it’s going to get you an extra $10. Who says they have to go door to door? In Chicago, as you walk to Wrigley Field and Soldier Field, there are plenty of people selling bottled water, sodas, peanuts and other such food items which can be obtained by using food stamps. Is there abuse? Maybe, but I could care less about it since it’s on such a small scale. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/59 "2015-11-28T18:32:59Z")
> [@dalej42](#): > > Who says they have to go door to door? In Chicago, as you walk to Wrigley Field and Soldier Field, there are plenty of people selling bottled water, sodas, peanuts and other such food items which can be obtained by using food stamps. Is there abuse? Maybe, but I could care less about it since it’s on such a small scale. I didn’t say they had to go door to door. Right in the part you quoted I said “stand in front”, by which I meant in front of the store. But yes, an entrepreneurial scammer could go to other events and resell. But not everyone is an entrepreneur and all I am arguing against is the idea that the deposit scam isn’t profitable enough for anyone to ever do it. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2015, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575/60 "2015-11-28T19:09:55Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > We ought to be exploring how to extend better social support services to them. 😕 What’s your plan for that? I didn’t know you caucused with the Marxists. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-food-stamps-stop-covering-bottle-deposits/738575.md?page=4)