# Should he clean her clock? \[Obama vs. Palin in debates\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 19, 2010, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169 "2010-11-19T01:20:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/61 "2010-11-19T13:25:31Z")
> [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > She’s sharpening her speaking skills while he continues to use teleprompters. > > Meaningless and pointless unless you think she’s speaking ex tempore - which of course she isn’t because that hardly ever happens. It is neither - the candidates do not use teleprompters in a debate. I suspect one of the dangers Obama would face in a debate with Sarah Palin is to behave the way the SDMB would like him to. In which case, not only would he lose the debate, he would be taken off the stage in a straitjacket and put on Thorazine. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/62 "2010-11-19T14:02:30Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Palin, when asked, couldn’t even name a couple of recent Supreme Court decisions, let alone talk about what they meant to the general populace. I would feel very sure that Obama could do so, and not only provide a precis of the decision that somebody like myself (that doesn’t come from the US, and doesn’t fully understand your constitutional position) can understand, but he could also discuss the nuances with a law professor. Obama actually _was_a law professor for 12 years. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/63 "2010-11-19T14:21:06Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It is neither - the candidates do not use teleprompters in a debate. > > I suspect one of the dangers Obama would face in a debate with Sarah Palin is to behave the way the SDMB would like him to. In which case, not only would he lose the debate, he would be taken off the stage in a straitjacket and put on Thorazine. > > Regards, > Shodan Obama looked comfortable in that format during the 2008 race. He would only need to repeat those performances by actually answering questions and explaining his policy views cogently. All we saw from Palin was homey platitudes and recitations. I think even conservatives would agree that she would have to do much better. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/64 "2010-11-19T14:22:25Z")
Sarah Palin is not a great speaker; she’s just popular. So’s Larry the Cable Guy. Do you want him delivering the State of the Union any time soon? ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/65 "2010-11-19T14:35:41Z")
Obama should pop the Glock. ---
**Author:** ![mo50](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@mo50](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mo50)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/66 "2010-11-19T14:46:06Z")
I think the left dismisses Palin at their peril. I recall thinking the same thing about Bush, & look what happened. The debates as currently constituted are a joke, nothing more than a glorified press conference. All Palin has to do is wink at the camera & voice the same two or three mindless, know-nothing plaititudes : “Small government”, “Don’t let the govenment come between you and your doctor” “Terrorists are bad”, etc. & the dumbed down electorate will lap it up. “She’s one of us” “Folksy & down home”, etc. Obama on the other hand can’t win, or really has to walk a tightrope. His message is more complex, & if he cleans her clock he’ll be called an arrogant, elitist, emotionless technocrat. If he lays back he’ll be called spineless, passive, gutless, whatever. (Who wants to take bets on if she tells him to “Man up”?) Unfortunately, in American politics you don’t have to be an intellectual/rhetorical heavyweight to be successful. Plus, we’ve only seen the beginning of the Citizens United decision’s effects on elections. I’d have to guess the right’s gonna spend like crazy promoting her in the coming years, only making her more formidable. :smack:: ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/67 "2010-11-19T14:49:13Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Obama actually _was_a law professor for 12 years. Yeah I knows 😃 His book is also a damn good read - the guy just impresses the hell outta me. I don’t have a dog in the fight over Palin and Obama so people can take that how they will. One guy from my own politics that I totally despise is Winston Peters (kiwis and some Australians will know him), but for all that I hate his politics I admire the guys intellect. I hate Palin’s politics and I see nothing to admire in her intellect, or anything else for that matter… ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/68 "2010-11-19T14:53:16Z")
I am confused. Is the OP maintaining that Obama is smarter than Palin despite his presidency? I don’t imagine Obama could face down the average US working class stiff. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/69 "2010-11-19T14:56:30Z")
> [@don\_t\_ask](#): > > I am confused. Admitting it is an important first step. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/70 "2010-11-19T15:06:21Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Palin on the the other hand, is getting paid to rally crowds and has a better track record getting people elected. Christine O’Donell, Sharron Angle, and the one that lost the Alaska Senate race are all wondering what the fuck you’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/71 "2010-11-19T15:06:55Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > As John Stewart said last night: “STOP MAKING ME FEEL SYMPATHY FOR THE PALINS!” He was talking about attacking the 16 years olds facebook posts and slagging Bristol for being on the dancing show. He said in the next sentence that attacks of the mother were fine. This thread is about the mama grizzly and not the kids so it’s off point. Palin has never impressed me I have to say. Her stump speech was ok but that’s just reading well. I have never seen her in any free flowing form were she was in any way impressive at all. Can anyone link to anything she’s done that wasn’t reading from a script that was in any way impressive or note wordy? ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/72 "2010-11-19T15:09:18Z")
> [@don\_t\_ask](#): > > I am confused. Is the OP maintaining that Obama is smarter than Palin despite his presidency? I don’t imagine Obama could face down the average US working class stiff. You know something? It’s because of people like you that we will never actually see a proper intellectual debate amongst candidates where the respective merits of policies are discussed. It’s because of people like you that the rest of the world pointed and laughed at George W. You represent the very worst of partisan politics. I am biased. I have the self awareness to admit that, and still appreciate someone else’s intellect, skills and I can admit when they score a good point. You? I think you have all the self awareness of a rotten turnip, and have not progressed past “my dad can whup your dad” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/73 "2010-11-19T15:12:08Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It is neither - the candidates do not use teleprompters in a debate. **Magiver** didn’t mention debates, he was talking about speeches. Obama didn’t use teleprompters in the 2006-2008 debates (and neither did anyone else) and he managed to complete a sentence now and then. > [@](#): > > I suspect one of the dangers Obama would face in a debate with Sarah Palin is to behave the way the SDMB would like him to. In which case, not only would he lose the debate, he would be taken off the stage in a straitjacket and put on Thorazine. Very possible. > [@mo50](#): > > All Palin has to do is wink at the camera & voice the same two or three mindless, know-nothing plaititudes : “Small government”, “Don’t let the govenment come between you and your doctor” “Terrorists are bad”, etc. & the dumbed down electorate will lap it up. “She’s one of us” “Folksy & down home”, etc. Why didn’t that work in 2008? On the stump it worked for people who already liked her, but it seemed to drive other people away and her performance in the debates didn’t win over this “dumbed down electorate.” ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/74 "2010-11-19T15:13:10Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > It’s because of people like you that we will never actually see a proper intellectual debate amongst candidates where the respective merits of policies are discussed. > > It’s because of people like you that the rest of the world pointed and laughed at George W. > > You represent the very worst of partisan politics. This isn’t the right forum for personal comments like this. Please don’t do this again. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/75 "2010-11-19T15:13:49Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Let’s hope. I don’t think we’ll get that lucky, though. When push comes to shove, she doesn’t have the guts to publicly engage with opponents or face questions from the legitimate news media. Heck, by 2012 she might not even have read her first magazine! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/76 "2010-11-19T15:22:59Z")
Hey, that’s not fair. She reads all of them. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/77 "2010-11-19T15:24:12Z")
Leaving aside all the partisan side discussions, I think that Obama should treat her exactly as he would treat a Republican male candidate…no different. By treating her differently (either by dismissing her or attempting to ‘clean her clock’ in some sort of righteous smack down that some posters in this thread feel she ‘deserves’), he would be hurting himself. Instead, he needs to debate the issues and the person, make his own points and defend his own positions to the best of his ability. If Palin actually becomes the Republican candidate (I shudder to think this will actually happen), then it’s in Obama’s best interest to set aside any animosity or gender bias some of you seem to have and simply debate her as if she were any other Republican male candidate. -XT ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/78 "2010-11-19T15:33:02Z")
**xtisme** this is what I think would like to see, what I fear however is that his level of knowledge, the sophistication of his arguments, the way that he will rebut her talking points with well cited, accurate and thought through statements will just make him look elitist and arrogant. That the way that he would totally outclass her in a genuine debate would make him look bad. Then I wonder what sort of strategy could be used to deal with that. Without making him look like a bully or a wimp And just to be clear, if he outclassed a male opponent the same way, I would have the same fears ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/79 "2010-11-19T15:38:21Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > **xtisme** this is what I think would like to see, what I fear however is that his level of knowledge, the sophistication of his arguments, the way that he will rebut her talking points with well cited, accurate and thought through statements will just make him look elitist and arrogant. That the way that he would totally outclass her in a genuine debate would make him look bad. > > Then I wonder what sort of strategy could be used to deal with that. Without making him look like a bully or a wimp > > And just to be clear, if he outclassed a male opponent the same way, I would have the same fears Well, if you want a good idea of what that debate would look like, you just have to turn to the Coons-O’Donnell debate. Exact same stuff. One intellectual type with some gut feeling he’s the smart alec here, and one dumb chick who is persuaded intelligence is an obstacle on the way to the truth. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2010, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169/80 "2010-11-19T15:44:39Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > **xtisme** this is what I think would like to see, what I fear however is that his level of knowledge, the sophistication of his arguments, the way that he will rebut her talking points with well cited, accurate and thought through statements will just make him look elitist and arrogant. That the way that he would totally outclass her in a genuine debate would make him look bad. Seems like a fearful and unlikely interpretation to me. If you exclude those who are strongly biased toward Palin to begin with, very few people would feel sorry for her if he kicks her butt in the debates as long as he handles himself well and doesn’t come off like a jerk. And the way the debates are done, it’s hard for one candidate to really kick the other one’s butt anyway. So that’s another reason this isn’t likely to be a problem. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-he-clean-her-clock-obama-vs-palin-in-debates/561169.md?page=5)