# Should I be wary of dealing with this guy **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 5, 2001, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011 "2001-08-05T18:33:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/1 "2001-08-05T18:33:16Z")
Since I am an neive or however you spell it when it comes to dealing with people does this sound like some type of scam? Dear manny Congratulations you are the winner of my auction: Toshiba Portege UltraThin P300/96MB/6.4GB As you can see i am new on the auctions but i know there it is a lot of fraud so i have tried to find a way for a good deal for both.I do not trust electronic payment sistems(paypal,bidpay,paydirect …) and i won’t accept it,so please send me your name and shipping address and i will send the item to you with UPS two days . After that i will give you the UPS tracking number and you will have to send the money($400-moneygram fees) with Moneygram in 24 hours ,after you will receive the tracking number from UPS,and send me back the Moneygram tracking number.If i won’t receive it in 24 hours i will have to cancel the shipment . Thank you again for your interest and i wait for your response so we can close the deal. PS I am sorry for late response but i was out of town ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/2 "2001-08-05T18:51:35Z")
Naive. Hell yes, I’d say it’s a scam. It’s so thin I could read _The Brothers Karamazov_ through it. ---
**Author:** ![FortMarcy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9de053/32.png) [@FortMarcy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FortMarcy)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/3 "2001-08-05T18:51:35Z")
I’d be pretty suspicious, especially since there is no way to get a MoneyGram refunded. Unless he’s willing to accept some sort of payment that can be revoked if he doesn’t come through, I’d pass. ---
**Author:** ![Carina42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/439d5e/32.png) [@Carina42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carina42)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/4 "2001-08-05T18:51:50Z")
Did you actually bid for this laptop? Where? Or is this some unsolicited correspondence from the guy? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/5 "2001-08-05T18:57:02Z")
Is this on ebay? What did he list as the terms of sale? Can we get a link? ---
**Author:** ![Hanna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b3f665/32.png) [@Hanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hanna)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/6 "2001-08-05T19:04:28Z")
A few years ago a guy was running a big digital camera scam on eBay and Yahoo auctions that sounds a lot like this…he sends camera, you pay him after you get it…turns out all the cameras were stolen goods. It was a big scam, I remember reading about it in the news. I’d stay away if I were you. ---
**Author:** ![Sultan\_Kinkari](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7bcc69/32.png) [@Sultan\_Kinkari](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sultan_Kinkari)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/7 "2001-08-05T19:11:12Z")
**No way! SCAM ALERT! SCAM ALERT!** The only reason he wants you to send a money gram is so **HE CAN SCAM YOU**. PayPal, BidPay, and all the others require that he submits his **own** Visa card number to prevent this **exact** type of sh\*t. If he were to not send you the laptop and you were using PayPal, it would be charged to HIS credit card and you could file a report with your credit card company. His name would then be sent to the FBI and he would be prosecuted against accordingly. This happens to ignorant sorry suckers all the time. And in every case they have nobody to bitch and complain to. At least if you use PayPal you can bitch to the FBI and have a much better chance at getting compensated for your losses. ---
**Author:** ![Sultan\_Kinkari](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7bcc69/32.png) [@Sultan\_Kinkari](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sultan_Kinkari)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/8 "2001-08-05T19:16:31Z")
If I were you I would report him to Ebay immediately for even trying to pull that stunt. Believe me, they know exactly what he is doing and they hear about and deal with similar cases all the time. Get his username banned before he actually dupes someone. On the other hand if someone is actually dumb enough to do it(no offense if you had considered it, but you did the right thing by asking the teeming millions) it serves them right for being so naive. Good thing is it usually only happens once to the same person. ---
**Author:** ![pesch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pesch/32/4925_2.png) [@pesch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pesch)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/9 "2001-08-05T19:19:16Z")
If you’re using PayPal or BillPoint, you can also get a chargeback to your credit card within 60 or 90 days. This sounds too complicated and raises a lot of questions. For example, why not just accept your check, then he sends you the item? All reputable sellers work this way. They even say they’ll hang onto the check until it clears, then send you the item. Note: this is what I did when I was selling stuff on ebay (my id was **planetpeschel** if you wish to view my feedback; no, I don’t have anything up for auction now). Second, what’s to stop him from shipping a box of newspapers? You get the tracking number, fire him the money, you get scammed. Third, the ignorance he claims about the system is no excuse. This isn’t rocket science. There’s plenty of help to get and everything is above board and out in the open. (Go to the message board and post your initial message and see what the other buyers and sellers on ebay have to say about this). Let me guess, he either has no feeback responses, or very few. This **reeks** of a scam. I would suggest going to the Safe Harbor section and turn this guy in. Don’t accuse him of anything, just pass along his e-mail and ask if this is the way things should be done on ebay. I’ll bet you’ll get the same answer we are giving you, and it will alert them to this guy. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/10 "2001-08-05T19:40:18Z")
My coworker had a similar situation last week. He won an auction online for a laptop for only $1000 - and the laptop would normally sell for $3000. The seller wanted the money wired to him in Romania, and then he would provide the UPS number. My coworker refused, suggested using an escrow service, and the seller balked, asking for $500 now and then $500 upon receipt. So, the things that immediately passed through my mind:[ul][_]Eastern Europe is a hotbed of fraud. Almost all (read- 90% or more) online orders from eastern Europe are fradulent. Your seller may not be from there, but it’s always something to keep in mind.[_]Getting a laptop for $1000 that’s worth $3000 screams ‘stolen property’. Maybe he bought it online using someone else’s credit card, and wants to sell it to get hard currency - or maybe he doesn’t even have a laptop at all, and is just trying to get some cash.Any legitimate seller will want to make the buyer happy and comfortable. There’s no excuse to wire money directly to someone without any guarantees.[/ul]I’d wager a pizza that even if you followed all of his instructions, you wouldn’t get your laptop and you’d be out all of the money. Say “Thanks but no thanks” and go on your way. ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/11 "2001-08-05T19:41:33Z")
This auction was off Yahoo. I don’t know if this link will work for anyone other than me. [http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/53929170](http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/53929170) I sent him the following mail. I’m waiting for a response I’m sorry but I cam not accept your conditions of payment. I have never had a problem when I use an electronc payment system. I can not take the risk that what I send payment for is not a laptop. However I am willing to use an escrow service such as tradeenable [http://www.tradenable.com/forms\_of\_payment.html](http://www.tradenable.com/forms_of_payment.html) How they work is as follows. I send them payment for the unit PLUS the escrow fees. You ship me the laptop and prodide THEM with the tracking number. When it arrives I am given ONE day to say Yep this is the item I ordered then they send you a check. If I fail to tell them that I recieved the item, they still send you a check after the one day checkout peroid because they know from the tracking number that it has been delivered. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/12 "2001-08-05T19:52:20Z")
Couldn’t view it. What EXACTLY did he say when you bid on it? What terms were listed? I would report this guy to Yahoo. ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/13 "2001-08-05T21:51:12Z")
Looking over the auction info below he says he will take a personal check but I don’t think I can trust him Seller (rating): dandovici4u (new) Payment Types Accepted • Accepts Personal Checks Shipping Info • Buyer Pays Shipping • Seller Ships on Payment Buyer Protection Info • Standard Protection Coverage Yahoo! Buyer Protection Program Toshiba 3020CT P-300MHz Slim Notebook (less than 1") Toshiba 3020 CT Ultra Thin SlimLine Laptop Toshiba External Floppy Drive Toshiba Port Replicator Specifications : CPU : Intel Pentium 300MHz MMX Cache : 512KB SRAM RAM : 96MB Memory Hard Drive : 6.4GB UltraDMA CD-ROM : PCMCIA (Optional) 10.4" TFT LCD Active Matrix Display up to 800x600 16.7 Millions Colors up to 1024x768 64K Colors on Ext.Monitor Video : 128bit NeoMagic (2160) 2MB FDD: External (included) Keyboard : 84 keys + Cursor + F1-F12 Mouse : AccuPoint (TrackPoint) Sound : YAMAHA Stereo Sound Built-in Stereo Speakers Built-in Microphone PCMCIA : Dual 32bit CardBus (backward compatible with 16bit) USB connector for Digital Camera, Scanner etc Height : 0.78" only! Power Supply : 110V/220V included Battery : Li-Ion High-Capacity. Good and Working Weight : 2.9 lbs with battery Condition : Used, has some scratches, which does not affect performance ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/14 "2001-08-05T22:39:43Z")
The description sounds plausible, but I’d still say ‘Scam’ unless he is willing to use a secure method of money transfer. ---
**Author:** ![sewalk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@sewalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sewalk)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2001, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/15 "2001-08-05T22:42:49Z")
Tell him you are not satisfied with his terms and insist on COD. That way no one gets taken. Since he states you are responsible for shipping, you’d have to pick up the COD chrage, too, but I think that UPS still only charges $6-8 for COD. Give the driver cash, sign and keep your copy of the delivery receipt, and notify the seller immediately of your receipt. I used to take care of all the mail orders for a computer store I managed and that was how we insisted that every non-credit card transaction take place. Anyone who denied a COD shipment was barred from using it in the future. It worked out great for us. IMO, anyone selling on eBay that will not accept credit cards should allow COD, particularly on items over $100. The UPS tracking number only verifies that a box was shipped but says nothing of the contents. It could be full of Vanilla Ice CDs for all you know. ---
**Author:** ![FortMarcy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9de053/32.png) [@FortMarcy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FortMarcy)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2001, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/16 "2001-08-06T01:49:19Z")
COD has the same problems as the tracking number does. You’re not allowed to open a COD package until you’ve forked over the cash. So you could still get the box of Vanilla Ice CDs even using COD. ---
**Author:** ![kniz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@kniz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kniz)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2001, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/17 "2001-08-06T05:14:19Z")
I got an email recently from an army officer in Nigeria saying that he needed help moving his family’s cash out of Nigeria. He said I could have a percentage of the millions involved. I hit “delete” as fast as possible. ---
**Author:** ![MannyL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MannyL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MannyL)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2001, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/18 "2001-08-07T16:51:20Z")
Well I received a response from him regarding the letter I sent. With his attitude I do not feel safe dealing with him. I’ve given him poor feedback and am waiting for his retiliation. — “daniel a. andonovici” \<[dandovici4u@yahoo.com](mailto:dandovici4u@yahoo.com)\> wrote: \> \> For $400 escrow service? \> Good BYE \> — Emanuel Levy \<[manny\_l@yahoo.com](mailto:manny_l@yahoo.com)\> wrote: \> \> I’m sorry but I cam not accept your conditions of \> \> payment. I have never had a problem when I use an \> \> electronc payment system. I can not take the risk \> \> that \> \> what I send payment for is not a laptop. However I \> \> am \> \> willing to use an escrow service such as \> tradeenable \> \> [http://www.tradenable.com/forms\_of\_payment.html](http://www.tradenable.com/forms_of_payment.html) \> How \> \> they work is as follows. I send them payment for \> the \> \> unit PLUS the escrow fees. You ship me the laptop \> \> and \> \> prodide THEM with the tracking number. When it \> \> arrives \> \> I am given ONE day to say Yep this is the item I \> \> ordered then they send you a check. If I fail to \> \> tell \> \> them that I recieved the item, they still send you \> a \> \> check after the one day checkout peroid because \> they \> \> know from the tracking number that it has been \> \> delivered. \> \> \> \> – “daniel a. andonovici” \<[dandovici4u@yahoo.com](mailto:dandovici4u@yahoo.com)\> \> \> wrote: \> \> \> Dear manny \> \> \> Congratulations you are the winner of my \> auction: \> \> \> Toshiba Portege UltraThin P300/96MB/6.4GB \> \> \> Winning Bid Range: $375.00+25shipping. \> \> \> As you can see i am new on the auctions but i \> know \> \> \> there it is a lot of fraud so i have tried to \> find \> \> a \> \> \> way for a good deal for both.I do not trust \> \> \> electronic \> \> \> payment sistems(paypal,bidpay,paydirect …) and \> i \> \> \> won’t accept it,so please send \> \> \> me your name and \> \> \> shipping address and i will send the item to you \> \> \> with \> \> \> UPS two days . \> \> \> After that i will give you the UPS tracking \> number \> \> \> and \> \> \> you \> \> \> will \> \> \> have to send the money($400-moneygram fees) with \> \> \> Moneygram in 24 hours ,after you will receive \> the \> \> \> tracking number from UPS,and send me back the \> \> \> Moneygram \> \> \> tracking number.If i won’t receive it in 24 \> hours \> \> i \> \> \> will have to cancel the shipment . \> \> \> Thank you again for your interest and i wait for \> \> \> your \> \> \> response so we can close the deal. \> \> \> \> \> \> PS \> \> \> I am sorry for late response but i was out of \> town \> \> \> \> \> \> Sincerely Daniel A. Andonovici \> \> \> \> \> \> ---
**Author:** ![smoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@smoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smoke)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2001, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/19 "2001-08-07T17:23:41Z")
**Manny** , I read your link. You did the right thing, so far. You definitely need to bring this to the attention of the Yahoo auction admins, though, as suggested by other posters. This guy’s eventually gonna take SOMEONE in. I see he has a Yahoo mail address, too. I imagine Yahoo would want to protect its reputation and investigate (possibly educate) this guy on how auctions SHOULD work. Good luck, and let us know if you get any response. -j ---
**Author:** ![Flymaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c4cdca/32.png) [@Flymaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flymaster)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2001, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011/20 "2001-08-07T17:59:04Z")
The fact that he used a stock manufacturer’s photo of the item set off bells, too. I never buy unless I can see the actual, specific item. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-be-wary-of-dealing-with-this-guy/75011.md?page=2)