# Should I vote to legalize marijuana in my state? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 15, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620 "2016-10-15T18:02:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/1 "2016-10-15T18:02:59Z")
In my state (Arizona) there is a ballot proposition to legalize marijuana. There has been a lot of pro and con mailings and commercials, and I don’t know who to believe. So how has the legalization of marijuana affected other states that have already done it? Has crime gotten worse? Are more kids using drugs? More DUIs? Other effects? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/2 "2016-10-15T18:18:31Z")
Lets look at Colorado: [https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/06/21/colorado-survey-shows-what-marijuana-legalization-will-do-to-your-kids/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/06/21/colorado-survey-shows-what-marijuana-legalization-will-do-to-your-kids/) > [@](#): > > Rates of marijuana use among Colorado’s teenagers are essentially unchanged in the years since the state’s voters legalized marijuana in 2012, new survey data from the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment shows. > > In 2015, 21 percent of Colorado youths had used marijuana in the past 30 days. That rate is slightly lower than the national average and down slightly from the 25 percent who used marijuana in 2009, before legalization. The survey was based on a random sample of 17,000 middle and high school students in Colorado. Regarding crime: > **[Marijuana legalization unlikely to blame for Denver crime increase](https://www.denverpost.com/2016/02/17/marijuana-legalization-unlikely-to-blame-for-denver-crime-increase/)** > > Marijuana legalization unlikely to blame for Denver crime increase > [@](#): > > Beginning in 2012, city safety officials began tracking crimes that they believe are marijuana-related. In that first year, the city counted 223 offenses, 172 of which were connected to the marijuana industry, which at the time encompassed only medical marijuana businesses. Last year, the city counted 251 marijuana-related offenses, including 183 connected to the medical and recreational marijuana industry. (The numbers are for more serious offenses and do not include petty citations for violations such as public marijuana consumption, nor do they include crimes committed by juveniles.) > > That means, in any given year, marijuana-related crimes in Denver make up less than 1 percent of all offenses counted in the Uniform Crime Report and less than a half-percent of all NIBRS offenses. > > “There’s absolutely no evidence that our change in marijuana laws has contributed to any specific crime increase,” said Mason Tvert, one of the activists who helped pass legalization in Colorado. > > A group of Metropolitan State University of Denver students who last year looked into any connection between crime trends and marijuana legalization concluded the same thing. DUIs: > **[Fewer people charged in Colorado with driving while high in 2015](https://www.denverpost.com/2016/02/11/fewer-people-charged-in-colorado-with-driving-while-high-in-2015/)** > > Fewer people charged in Colorado with driving while high in 2015 > [@](#): > > The State Patrol arrested fewer people on allegations they were driving under the influence of marijuana last year than in the previous year, according a report released Thursday. > > The report is the first glimpse at how the change in law is affecting highway safety, because the patrol did not keep statistics on the number of people accused of driving under the influence of marijuana prior to 2014, when recreational pot became legal. > > In 2015, the second year the patrol kept statistics, 4,546 citations were issued for driving under the influence of alcohol or drugs. > > Of those, 665 people — or nearly 15 percent — had marijuana in their systems when they were charged, according to State Patrol statistics. > > Overall, the number of people cited for marijuana-related driving under the influence of drugs dropped 1.3 percent between 2014 and 2015, the report said. In 2015, 665 impaired drivers had marijuana in their systems, compared with 674 in 2014. > > The data do not include arrests made by local police and sheriff’s departments. In Colorado, the legislature has decided that the legal limit for impairment by marijuana is 5 nanograms of THC in the blood. However, that is a presumption only and has been rejected in court. > > Highway safety experts said they were not reading too much into the numbers. But others said it is a good indicator that Coloradans are getting the message about the dangers of stoned driving. I will vote yes to legalize, not only because of that, but also because, historically speaking, the very reason why marijuana was banned had a lot to do with bigoted and racist ideas. It is no coincidence that minorities are the ones most affected by the ban. > **[Marijuana Prohibition Was Racist From The Start. Not Much Has Changed.](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/marijuana-prohibition-racist_n_4590190)** > > Marijuana Prohibition Was Racist From The Start. Not Much Has Changed. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/3 "2016-10-15T18:28:37Z")
In Washington State I don’t perceive any problems with legalization. And, on the other hand: Freedom is up. I’m sure, like Colorado info posted above, there are studies available if anyone wants to google. [Here’s what I found](http://ijr.com/2015/07/361976-many-effects-legalizing-marijuana-washington-state/): > [@](#): > > Legal marijuana stores sold $250 million worth of the drug. > > Legal sales generated $70 million in taxes for the state and local government. > > Lawmakers had originally predicted $36 million in taxes in 2014. and > [@](#): > > Since the passage of I-502, the bill that legalized the drug, crime has dropped to a 40-year low. This includes: > > ``` > 10% decrease in violent crime statewide > > 13% drop in the murder rate > > ``` > > Although not all these crimes can attributed to marijuana, it shows that legalization has certainly not increased the crime rate. ---
**Author:** ![squidfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a87d85/32.png) [@squidfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squidfood)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/4 "2016-10-15T18:29:08Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > So how has the legalization of marijuana affected other states that have already done it? Has crime gotten worse? Are more kids using drugs? More DUIs? Other effects? Washington reporting in. Vastly less “crime” in that we no longer spend money to arrest these folks as it’s not a crime. No increases in other crimes. Substantial new source of funds in our coffers and vast savings in the courts/jails. No visible change in public (I don’t smell/see pot walking down the street any more than I used to). In my middle-class educated social circle, it’s no more or less acceptable than before (comes out occasionally and discreetly at a party sometimes, as it always has). There’s aggressive “keep it out of the hands of kids” advertising and it’s too soon to say if it’s having a statistical or normative effect on kids, so that’s a lingering concern. Our initiative had a stupid-low DUI threshold in the blood; you can be done for DUI for a toke you had 2 days ago - but I haven’t seen the stats (there’s definitely been no news on “more people crashing while high” or anything). So other than waiting to see if it affects kids (and how to combat it if it does), several big positives on $$ and justice system with no negatives that I can point to. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/5 "2016-10-15T19:02:46Z")
Yes. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/6 "2016-10-15T19:10:31Z")
Yes, vote yes. The downside is vastly outweighed by the upside. Revenue for taxes and decreases in useless incarcerations more than outweigh the uptick in drug treatment programs. Also it is a vote for personnel liberty and more freedoms to choose. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/7 "2016-10-15T19:19:24Z")
I’ve already made up my mind to vote yes. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/8 "2016-10-15T19:22:08Z")
To me it is inconceivable that any increase in crime (which seems unlikely in any case) could compare to the damage done by the marijuana ban. With hard drugs there might be an argument, but not with pot. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/9 "2016-10-15T19:55:54Z")
One caveat: Marijuana is still illegal under federal law. Currently, the Feds are choosing to look the other way in states that have decided to allow it, but that could very easily change with a different administration. And if a legal marijuana industry has built up when that happens, it could cause some economic shocks when it’s suddenly (de facto) delegalized again. Of course, on the other hand, the more states legalize it, the more pressure there will be to change the law at the federal level, too. And it’s possible that this might happen before an administration comes in that decides to enforce the laws. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/10 "2016-10-15T20:22:31Z")
It’s been [legal](http://mpdc.dc.gov/marijuana) to have two ounces and grow six plants in Washington _ **DC** _ for nearly two years now. If we had a functional government, this would have been taken care of on the national level by now. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/11 "2016-10-15T20:25:02Z")
I’m in Maine. Medical marijuana is legal here and this year we have a recreational legalization proposition to vote on as well. I’m torn. I’m not sure what the rules are on outright admitting to smoking weed somewhere that it isn’t legal yet, but lets just say that if I \*did \*want to experiment with marijuana I don’t know how much I’d want to go down to the Pot Store and get an gram for $30. I don’t know for sure, but I’ve been told that full half-ounces can be had for $125, if one knows the right people. So I’m told. Anyway. Yeah, legalization will make it a little easier, but it won’t make it any cheaper. And I value my experimentation-dollar. You know, if like, that day ever comes. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/12 "2016-10-15T20:34:14Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > In my state (Arizona) there is a ballot proposition to legalize marijuana. Yes. Actually, legalise the lot. Next question? More seriously, are not related crimes are already covered under existing laws? Driving while drugged? DUI. Theft? That’s already a crime. Etc. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/13 "2016-10-15T20:43:35Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I’m in Maine. Medical marijuana is legal here and this year we have a recreational legalization proposition to vote on as well. I’m torn. > > I’m not sure what the rules are on outright admitting to smoking weed somewhere that it isn’t legal yet, but lets just say that if I \*did \*want to experiment with marijuana I don’t know how much I’d want to go down to the Pot Store and get an gram for $30. I don’t know for sure, but I’ve been told that full half-ounces can be had for $125, if one knows the right people. So I’m told. > > Anyway. Yeah, legalization will make it a little easier, but it won’t make it any cheaper. And I value my experimentation-dollar. You know, if like, that day ever comes. IANACPA, but my understanding of the tax rules says that unlike any other business, they are unable to write off expenses, and so have to pay their taxes on revenue, rather than on profit. This is because they are engaged in an unlawful business, and as such they are not allowed to write off illegal expenses. This makes the product much more expensive to sell. If the fed changed the law, or at least directed the IRS to allow marijuana businesses to write off their expenses, prices would probably come down very rapidly. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/14 "2016-10-15T20:56:56Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > One caveat: Marijuana is still illegal under federal law. Currently, the Feds are choosing to look the other way in states that have decided to allow it, but that could very easily change with a different administration. And if a legal marijuana industry has built up when that happens, it could cause some economic shocks when it’s suddenly (de facto) delegalized again. > > Of course, on the other hand, the more states legalize it, the more pressure there will be to change the law at the federal level, too. And it’s possible that this might happen before an administration comes in that decides to enforce the laws. I think the odds of that happening are so small as to be negligible. Especially as more states legalize it, and that’s bound to happen. I’m pretty sure it’s going to pass in CA this year, so that’s ~12% of the population right there. It would be political suicide for a president to crack down on states w/ legal marijuana laws. A majority of the entire country favors legalization. ---
**Author:** ![ganthet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de0a6/32.png) [@ganthet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ganthet)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/15 "2016-10-15T21:13:38Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > In my state (Arizona) there is a ballot proposition to legalize marijuana. There has been a lot of pro and con mailings and commercials, and I don’t know who to believe. In Arizona, many of the county (district) attorneys have publicly opposed legalization, offering the usual hysteria about the effects of marijuana, how marijuana DUIs would skyrocket, and of course, think of the children. What they don’t mention is that there is a mandatory drug fine of $1,000+ in Arizona for every marijuana conviction (and possession of even a tiny, but usuable quantity of marijuana in Arizona without a valid medical marijuana card is still a felony). Also, a not insignificant number of police stops and searches begin with officers smelling marijuana, arresting someone, and then using this as a (lawful) basis to search the arrested person, their car, or their nearby possessions for other possible crimes. Prosecutors rely heavily on both the fines and searches conducted following marijuana possession arrests. There is a reason that the Arizona proposition’s non-number title is “regulate marijuana like alcohol.” While minors have historically found many ways around the ban on alcohol sales to anyone under 21, they would still likely find ways to get around any ban on marijuana sales to anyone under 21. But that is no different than their ability to do so now through a random dealer. Ultimately, alcohol and tobacco are far more harmful substances to someone’s health than marijuana. While marijuana is known to cause some damage to someone’s brain with long term use, particularly when that use starts at a young age, there is really no credible comparison in the level of harm. The prosecutors and public officials who want to maintain the criminal ban on marijuana show their craven hypocrisy by insisting on marijuana’s dangerousness to health and public safety while completely accepting the regulation of alcohol and tobacco with no comment. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/16 "2016-10-15T21:17:30Z")
When I was growing up (back in the dark ages of the 60s) it was easier for us younguns to buy pot than to buy alcohol. Everyone knew who the guys were who sold pot, and you didn’t need a fake ID or need to convince some adult to buy it for you. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2016, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/17 "2016-10-15T21:24:27Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > This makes the product much more expensive to sell. > > If the fed changed the law, or at least directed the IRS to allow marijuana businesses to write off their expenses, prices would probably come down very rapidly. And yet, prices have been dropping lower and lower, particularly when accounting for the greater potency per dollar and all of the new extraction forms. [http://mjbizdaily.com/colorado-wholesale-recreational-cannabis-prices-tumbling/](http://mjbizdaily.com/colorado-wholesale-recreational-cannabis-prices-tumbling/) ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2016, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/18 "2016-10-16T01:14:51Z")
Besides the increased taxes and reduced arrests/prosecutions, the main effect of legalizing mj is that smugglers from Mexico have been largely put out of business[sup]1[/sup]. But that was mostly accomplished by medical marijuana, which is legal in half the states already. However, the one area of the country that does not have medical mj is the South, unless you count Delaware and DC in that region. This year, two southern states, Arkansas and Florida, have medi-weed on their ballot. If those pass it will be a bigger change than California and the other four states legalizing recreational mj. [sup]1[/sup] I do wonder how much mj is now being smuggled from the US to Mexico. From what I’ve heard, the best stuff is grown indoors. Mexican weed is mostly grown outdoors and in the US indoors, at least the stuff that’s quasi-legal. Legalizing recreational mj in CA and AZ can only increase the amount exported. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2016, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/19 "2016-10-16T02:48:23Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > In my state (Arizona) there is a ballot proposition to legalize marijuana. There has been a lot of pro and con mailings and commercials, and I don’t know who to believe. > > So how has the legalization of marijuana affected other states that have already done it? Has crime gotten worse? Are more kids using drugs? More DUIs? Other effects? Aside from other people’s arguments, is what you observe with respect to marijuana being currently illegal stuff that you would label as a “net positive” for society? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2016, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620/20 "2016-10-16T07:17:43Z")
It’s amazing in a sense; all those arguments that have been touted for decades are coming to pass - tax revenues, lower crime, decriminalising earlier racist laws, more effective use of police time, less socially disruptive than alcohol, etc, etc. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-i-vote-to-legalize-marijuana-in-my-state/768620.md?page=2)