# Should infanticide be legalised? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 1, 2009, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545 "2009-09-01T21:39:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/21 "2009-09-02T13:23:49Z")
No. A woman who doesn’t want a fetus has the right to keep it from taking over her whole body. A woman who doesn’t want a baby has Safe Haven laws to follow. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/22 "2009-09-02T14:04:13Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I agree. And that’s about all the thought that should be required because I haven’t seen anyone advocate making infanticide legal in the US. May I introduce Dr. Peter Singer~ > **[Peter Singer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Singer#Abortion.2C_euthanasia_and_infanticide)** > > Peter Albert David Singer (born 6 July 1946) is an Australian moral philosopher who is Emeritus Ira W. DeCamp Professor of Bioethics at Princeton University. Singer's work specialises in applied ethics, approaching the subject from a secular, utilitarian perspective. He wrote the book Animal Liberation (1975), in which he argues for vegetarianism, and the essay "Famine, Affluence, and Morality", which argues the moral imperative of donating to help the poor around the world. For most of his car... ---
**Author:** ![Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/46a35a/32.png) [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walker_in_Eternity)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/23 "2009-09-02T14:36:44Z")
> [@HoboStew](#): > > Why stop at infanticide? If you wake up one day and decide you have had enough of your lazy, freeloading son with no job, no girlfriend, no prospects for either and his only real accomplishment in life is an epic set of gear on WoW and you decide to take a mulligan by way of a .44, be my guest! Brilliant, given the amount of slack jawed morons on our streets (UK as well as US) abortion should be legal up to the age of 18. “Sorry kid, you’ll only be a drain on the system and I don’t want a tax increase” bang! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/24 "2009-09-02T14:39:23Z")
I have [A Modest Proposal](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_modest_proposal) . . . Can’t **believe** I was first with that! ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/25 "2009-09-02T14:45:50Z")
I support abortion rights because bodily autonomy is the issue. Infants don’t encroach on anyone’s bodily autonomy (or, if they do, yer doin’ it wrong). ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/26 "2009-09-02T14:54:16Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I agree. And that’s about all the thought that should be required because I haven’t seen anyone advocate making infanticide legal in the US. Allow me to introduce [Dr. Peter Singer](http://www.equip.org/articles/peter-singer-s-bold-defense-of-infanticide), the famed professor and “bioethicist” from Princeton University. He recognized that there is no essential difference between an infant inside the womb and one that has moved through the birth canal. He concluded that if we take the standard pro-choice arguments seriously, then infanticide is likewise justified. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/27 "2009-09-02T15:01:35Z")
Is there any particular _reason_ it should be legalized? The OP doesn’t provide one, neither has anyone else. I suspect (he said, understatedly) that’s because there’s absolutely no reason to legalize infanticide. It’s a barbaric and terrible practice. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/28 "2009-09-02T15:22:22Z")
[What?! Killing babies is the **prerogative** of the Alpha Male! Is that so wrong?!](http://archive.salon.com/comics/boll/1999/11/18/boll/story.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Blut\_Aus\_Nord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Blut\_Aus\_Nord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blut_Aus_Nord)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/29 "2009-09-02T15:30:41Z")
> [@JThunder](#): > > Allow me to introduce [Dr. Peter Singer](http://www.equip.org/articles/peter-singer-s-bold-defense-of-infanticide), the famed professor and “bioethicist” from Princeton University. He recognized that there is no essential difference between an infant inside the womb and one that has moved through the birth canal. He concluded that if we take the standard pro-choice arguments seriously, then infanticide is likewise justified. “Standard pro-choice arguments” have nothing to do with fully developed infants. Third trimester abortions are close to nonexistent. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/30 "2009-09-02T15:58:32Z")
> [@JThunder](#): > > He recognized that there is no essential difference between an infant inside the womb and one that has moved through the birth canal. He’s mistaken. The difference is that one is inside my body, and one is outside my body. That particular difference is pretty fucking essential to me. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/31 "2009-09-02T16:01:21Z")
Which leads inexorably to the conclusion that either he doesn’t understand what the hell the “standard pro-choice arguments” are, or that someone is reporting him wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/32 "2009-09-02T16:10:25Z")
> [@HoboStew](#): > > Why stop at infanticide? If you wake up one day and decide you have had enough of your lazy, freeloading son with no job, no girlfriend, no prospects for either and his only real accomplishment in life is an epic set of gear on WoW and you decide to take a mulligan by way of a .44, be my guest! Is… is that you Dad?! ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/33 "2009-09-02T16:23:25Z")
Infanticide does happen in a number of very very small cases, or at least, letting the baby die, if not killing it. I read a book long ago that discussed, in detail, the ethics of babies born that were very sick, severely mentally retarded, or severely disabled. I am talking nothing in the head but the brain stem, no chance of anything remotely resembling a normal life, etc. In cases like these it has happened that a pair of loving parents, educated by the doctors and nurses and by themselves, have elected to remove feeding tubes, and life support from the baby, and let it die. I am wholeheartedly in favor of leaving this decision in the hands of the parents and not penalizing them for it. (I don’t rightly recall if they ever do get penalized.) Beyond that, no, infanticide just randomly should not be legal. And you as the OP have given no justification as to why it should be. Is there a specific reason? If you had addressed cases like I did in my post above, I might be more inclined to listen. Not the average childbirth, however. ---
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/34 "2009-09-02T16:24:14Z")
> [@](#): > > Allow me to introduce Dr. Peter Singer, the famed professor and “bioethicist” from Princeton University. He recognized that there is no essential difference between an infant inside the womb and one that has moved through the birth canal. He concluded that if we take the standard pro-choice arguments seriously, then infanticide is likewise justified. A frequent “star” and guest in the Skeptical word and I am a good Agnostic/Skeptic but I have absolutly no use for this guy at all, he puts animals in the same moral context as human beings. No way. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/35 "2009-09-02T16:33:00Z")
> [@JThunder](#): > > Allow me to introduce [Dr. Peter Singer](http://www.equip.org/articles/peter-singer-s-bold-defense-of-infanticide), the famed professor and “bioethicist” from Princeton University. He recognized that there is no essential difference between an infant inside the womb and one that has moved through the birth canal. He concluded that if we take the standard pro-choice arguments seriously, then infanticide is likewise justified. Singer is a hypocrite: he believe infanticide is permissible but not animal cruelty. What a son of a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/36 "2009-09-02T16:43:10Z")
It is already legal in the US ([cite](http://www.speakout.com/activism/issue_briefs/1104b-1.html)), and happens hundreds of times a year ([cite](http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/ib14.html)). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/37 "2009-09-02T17:47:41Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It is already legal in the US ([cite](http://www.speakout.com/activism/issue_briefs/1104b-1.html)), and happens hundreds of times a year ([cite](http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/ib14.html)). And the effect on American society is what, exactly? Or even roughly. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/38 "2009-09-02T17:57:45Z")
Apparently, a profoundly weakened vocabulary. ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/39 "2009-09-02T18:12:05Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > He’s mistaken. The difference is that one is inside my body, and one is outside my body. That particular difference is pretty fucking essential to me. He’s pointing out that this distinction says nothing about the essential nature of the unborn. Whether it’s “essential to you” is ultimately unimportant, since the taking of a life is not a mere matter of personal preference. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545/40 "2009-09-02T18:13:14Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > Infanticide does happen in a number of very very small cases, or at least, letting the baby die, if not killing it. I read a book long ago that discussed, in detail, the ethics of babies born that were very sick, severely mentally retarded, or severely disabled. I am talking nothing in the head but the brain stem, no chance of anything remotely resembling a normal life, etc. But that is infanticide only in the sense that the person who is being allowed to die is an infant. There is a huge difference between ceasing or not starting artificial life support and a homicide. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-infanticide-be-legalised/508545.md?page=3)