I find that actually having the codes on-hand and their meaning is a HUGE diagnostic boost versus the old way of listening, feeling and guesstimating.
It’s like a doctor having a patient who can tell them where it hurts, vs. a pediatrician working on a baby who doesn’t talk yet.
Some BMW models have sealed automatic transmissions-you cannot add fluid to them.
Owning the code, which the customer only leases is what made Microsoft very rich. *
Which is why some people run Linux or BSD.
On the other hand a hell of a lot of car firmware ( especially infotainment systems ) is now based on the Linux Kernel, so whilst they can charge what they like for their versions, they might have a FOSS fight on their hands if they claim others can’t modify their modified code.
Umm no.
Many cars now don’t have transmission dipsticks, but every single one of them has the ability to add fluid.
Think about it if they didn’t have a way to add fluid how would the car maker fill them up at the factory?
There’s a difference between modifying their code and replacing it with my own. People erase OSX and put Linux on their Macs all the time. What GM and John Deere are saying here goes beyond that. Copyright doesn’t give anyone the right to mandate what code runs on my own property. If Joe’s Garage hires a hotshot programmer to sell me custom code (which is not derived from GM’s factory installed program), that’s my own business. GM can void my warranty, but they should not be able to sue me or charge me with a crime.
EDIT: And I know with the DMCA, you can be charged with a crime for breaking copy protection (i.e., whatever bullshit they include to prevent me from installing my own program over theirs) even if you don’t violate copyright. That is the specific rationale GM and John Deere are using here and specifically what I disagree with.
I think the point was SOMEONE had to copy the code in order to modify it. And if so, then that mod could be considered a derivative work.
Dunno. The whole point of WINE — Wine Is Not An Emulator — is that it is not a derivative work — it uses APIs etc. that do the same functionality as Windows would, in order to run programs [ fortuitously ] designed for Windows [ but not of Windows ] on OSX or Linux or any other OS.
However, someone would have had to take a look at those Windows components that ran the program in order to provide an equal functionality. Generally, looking at anything software or in the physical world for reverse-engineering is perfectly legal.
I don’t use WINE hardly at all, since I don’t need Windows programs, and VirtualBox is nearby if I did, but one has to respect their skill.
No, they did not. They did not have to copy anything. Andrew Tannenbaum created Minix from scratch and Linus based Linux off of that. There is more free software out there than proprietary software – the vast majority was created from scratch or built upon earlier free software, not derived from proprietary code.
With access to the ECU and a the tools to program it, a skilled programmer could possibly create a better program from scratch. And even if it isn’t better, I as the owner should have the right to use his program in lieu of the one GM included with the vehicle. They own their code, but it’s my car, my ECU, and my money on the line if I end up screwing things up.
Hmmm. That is an interesting distinction. I shall have to ponder this. Well, I plan to, anyway. More likely I’ll forget. But it’s still a good point.
You buy both the hardware, and then the software to put on it. This will cover most makes except some of the more oddball ones - I know we don’t do Saab, as an example.
Currently the hardware would cost from $10,000 to $12,000. Software would run between $2,400 and $2,800 annually. We usually get an upgrade of the software every other year.
That seems awfully expensive why not use a $50 dollar tool from Autozone instead?
Perhaps I’m getting ahead of the debate, splitting hairs, apples/oranges, whatever. But if GM and Deere get away with this, where does it end? Is Pandoras box opened?
What if I put an aftermarket seat cover on a car still under warranty?
A different grip on my pistol?
A Corbin seat on my motorcycle?
Do I relinquish possession of these things back to the manufacturer because I did something to it they don’t approve of?
At what point does the “motorists don’t necessarily buy a car; they merely buy a license to use the car for the duration of its life” count for everything?
Sounds crazy and over the top, but crazy and over the top has to start somewhere. Right?
“motorists don’t necessarily buy a car; they merely buy a license to use the car for the duration of its life”
Sorry, but theres something about it that just f*cking bugs me!:mad:
The reason why the $50 scan tool exists (or the $10 bluetooth phone adapter which is what I use mostly these days) is because the government mandates certain data be made available via the standard OBD-II port on all (post-'96) cars. The problem is that OBD-II mostly only deals with the engine. All of the other computerized systems cars have these days aren’t standardized, so to be truly full service you need a small collection of proprietary OEM scan tools, or one of the really expensive professional tools can do them all and comes with a suitcase full of connectors.
Plus I’m guessing what Daylate is talking about also includes a repair info service like Alldata and maybe some sort of hour tracking/billing software. So stuff that’s maybe not critical to fixing cars, but important for fixing them with the minimum of fuss and actually running a shop.
My feelings exactly!
If it weren’t raining buckets, out be out working on the F’-in’ Jeep carb.
yes but you don’t need a diagnostic tool to figure out the ball joints or the CV joint are shot. Few people are going to rebuild a transmission although some will pull one and send it out.
It’s the crap in the middle that needs diagnostics and frankly a lot of that stuff either works or doesn’t. I just had to replace a heater control module on my car because the variable resistor inside it died. A quick trip to the junkyard and $15 replaced a $200 part. Not much labor involved but you get the general drift.
It’s a huge cost savings for me to work on my own stuff. And sometimes mechanics won’t work outside the box. Fixed a friend of mine’s hybrid when the underbody wind panel (?) broke. All it took was a couple of rivets and a sheet of aluminum and it was back in business. They didn’t have the part and it basically grounded the car.
This describes the situation exactly-you made a repair to a car using a non-factory part. A dealer would not do this-such a substitution would never be allowed. This is also a problem for people who want to keep old cars running. Parts for specialized makes will become harder to get. When a car gets to the point where junkyard parts are not available, the cars will be scrapped.
none of that has come to pass, and that appleinsider article is a load of horseshit. Of course, it comes from Daniel Eran Dilger, so it can’t help but be anything but a pile of drivel.
It could easily come to that if GM et al have their way.
Hardware manufacturers are all too happy to use digital controls to prevent physical access by end users. By example, I cite printer manufacturers. They embed controller chips in their ink cartridges to prevent users from refilling them with third-party ink, and then attempted to use the DMCA (part of copyright law) to prevent anyone from circumventing the controller.
Fortunately, the printer companies lost. It seems likely that the same will be true if car manufacturers attempt similar control over replacement items. But it might have to go to court again.
I haven’t met a “mechanic” in years. I’ve encountered lots of “parts swappers”. They don’t bother to find the real problem, they just throw new (expensive) parts at the symptoms till they get it right. If ever. I want the problem fixed, not masked.
I’ve been burned too often and now only fix my own shit (unless its a transmission or other serious tight tolerance stuff. Then, its just cheaper to buy a re-man and stick it in myself). If I don’t know how, I study and figure it out. I got nothing but tools, time and space. I manage to keep nearly 2 dozen vehicles up and running.
I’m not sure where you’re getting this from. It doesn’t get anymore factory than an original part from a junkyard car. The one I described had 3 different switches and I could swap the other 2 out so my $15 purchase was backed up with 2 spare parts from the old one. I’m $185 ahead plus the cost of installation. And the Junkyard gives about the same guarantee that new electronic parts get.