# Should Marines be called soldiers? (and other questions) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 30, 2003, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155 "2003-03-30T03:51:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2003, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/21 "2003-03-31T18:17:21Z")
The “Devil Dog” battle was WWI, not WWII. A little place called Belleau Wood. [Some other answers](http://www.grunt.com/usmcterms.htm), with motivational or annoying cursor. “Troops in the field” could refer to Marines or soldiers. I see that term used for ground combat personnel and their ground support. You would not call a Marine a “Troop”, although MAYBE soldiers are called by that term. Someone else here can correct that. “Leatherneck” is not derogatory today, to my knowledge. “Jarhead” CAN have a negative connotation, depending on usage. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2003, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/22 "2003-03-31T19:37:36Z")
“Jarhead” is the pejorative form of “Marine.” “Dogface” is the pejorative form of “Army soldier.” “Squid” is the pejorative form of “Sailor.” “Flyboy” is the pejorative form of “Airman.” “Puddle Pirate” is the pejorative form of “Coast Guardsman.” Just so everybody has their terminology straight. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2003, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/23 "2003-03-31T19:52:41Z")
“Marine” implies a title, as does “Soldier” for an Army enlisted man. In fact, in some languages the rank of “Private” is actually called “Soldier” - in the Canadian Army, the French word for “Private” is “soldat.” I’m sure a Marine will tell you that a Marine is, technically, a soldier in the sense that the dictionary definition of “soldier” would imply. However, the appropriate way to ADDRESS a Marine is “Marine,” not “Soldier.” I’m sure any general in the Army would say he’s a soldier, too, but you’d address him as “General,” not “Soldier.” ---
**Author:** ![TGWATY](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@TGWATY](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TGWATY)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2003, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/24 "2003-03-31T19:54:19Z")
Marines are soldiers. Merriam-Webster has for marine: > [@](#): > > 2 : one of a class of soldiers serving on shipboard or in close association with a naval force; specifically : a member of the U.S. Marine Corps They also have for soldier > [@](#): > > a : one engaged in military service and especially in the army b : an enlisted man or woman c : a skilled warrior I would maintain that the use of _the_ army here does not mean “the Army,” as in the U. S. Army, and the author should have said “especially in _an_ army.” Today the U.S. Marines, along with the U.S. Army are part of the army attacking Iraq. army: > [@](#): > > a : a large organized body of armed personnel trained for war especially on land b : a unit capable of independent action and consisting usually of a headquarters, two or more corps, and auxiliary troops c often capitalized : the complete military organization of a nation for land warfare What makes one a soldier has more to do with what one does, not what club one belongs to. Case in point - a mercenary is a soldier that belongs to no club at all. And not everyone in the Navy is a sailor, either. A sailor is one who serves at sea doing sailor-stuff. There are some Navy personnel that go 20 years without ever serving at sea. ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2003, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/25 "2003-03-31T22:52:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by kaylasdad99 \* > \*\*“Puddle Pirate” is the pejorative form of “Coast Guardsman.” > > Just so everybody has their terminology straight. \*\* You say that as if there is only one. You left out: Mud Duck Puddle Duck Hooligan Navy sailor Shallow water sailor Plus, I thought AF were called “Zoomies” more often. Proud Chief of the Hooligan Navy sends… 😃 BT NNNN ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/26 "2003-04-01T00:43:31Z")
I’d like to dispell a myth about Marines. At least in my experience, Marines and sailors are not constantly at each others throats. I served in the “Gator Navy”, and was almost always vastly outnumbered by Jarheads (love the green thing ;)). In fact I seem to remember the Marines to be _less_ anxious to barroom brawl than the other services. Maybe it was because they were getting all the wimmen. Worst people to share liberty with, hands down, were carrier sailors. And officers. Come to think of it, Marine officers are cooler than other officers. What was the question? Oh yeah. Call 'em Marines. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Spit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Spit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spit)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/27 "2003-04-01T01:09:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mangeorge \* > \*\* > Come to think of it, Marine officers are cooler than other officers. > \*\* I’m glad you brought that up- Is it just me, or do Marine officers have less of an attitude about being an officer than the other services? I met a guy who had been an officer in the Marines at the gym last week, and it was no different than talking to a grunt who had just finished up his 4 years. Very laid back, gung-ho, and proud to be a Marine. Also, what is it about the corps that gives such a sense of camaraderie? Is it the boot camp? For instance, if you ask an enlisted person from the AF several years after leaving about their service, they will say “I was in the AF” (past tense). However, if you ask a Marine the same question, he/she will say “I **am** a Marine”; even if the last time they wore fatigues was in the 40’s. ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/28 "2003-04-01T01:29:21Z")
[Anectdotal story] When I was stationed at a small SAR station on the Great Lakes in the mid '90s, there was an old guy up the street from our station. He had a flagpole in his yard, and every single morning, rain or shine, he held colors and hoisted the US and Marine Corps flags. I assume they came down every night at sunset. A buddy of mine got to talking to him one morning, and asked how long he served in the Corps. His reply: “I did a couple years in _the Korean war_.” Now _that’s_ honor. [/Anectodal story] ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/29 "2003-04-01T01:48:35Z")
Sound’s silly, but the truth is that you don’t get to be a Marine unless you’re tough. Enlisted or officer, man or woman. And _every_ Marine know’s that. If you ever happen to go to a boot camp graduation, look over at the drill sgts. (I don’t know what they’re called). Half of them will be freakin’ _cryin’_. I didn’t say “good bar fighter”, BTW. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/30 "2003-04-01T02:12:25Z")
The Marine Corps does the BEST brainwashing of any US service branch. By far. From Day One. Recruits EARN the right to be called Marine. As do Candidates at OCS. The small size and fiscal underdog status, coupled with the less than optimal living and eating establishments add to it. In 1989 I was on an exercise at Fairchild AFB. My Marines had the last night off, ate at the “Cafeteria” and saw the “Dormitories”. They could not buy a drink at the club that night. Marines have Barracks and Chow Halls. I don’t know if this is different from other services, but Marine Officers eat last. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Slant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c57346/32.png) [@Mr.Slant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Slant)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/31 "2003-04-01T02:24:18Z")
I don’t know how far off-topic this is, but I had the opportunity to work at the Cleveland area headquarters of MBNA, the credit-card company. A gentleman in management, I believe their CEO, was a marine. The company flies the USMC flag _right beneath_ the Ohio and USA flags out front of the main building on that corporate campus. Now THAT is loyalty. ---
**Author:** ![WillSantini](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ed8c4c/32.png) [@WillSantini](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillSantini)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2003, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/32 "2003-04-01T02:44:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Spit \* > **Also, what is it about the corps that gives such a sense of camaraderie? Is it the boot camp?** It’s a sense of pride, a sense of honor, love for God, Country and Corps. It’s paying respect to our brothers who have paved the way. It’s leading from the front, policing our own, and winning battles. It’s sleeping in a fighting position with a brother, drinking beer with a man/woman who will gladly give his life for you, and chasing women with a drunk that you would happily lay your life on the line for. It’s a Band of Brothers, it’s being _Always Faithful_ to our Nation and to the Marine Corps. It’s the flag rasing atop Mt. Suribachi. It’s the Eagle, the Globe and the Anchor. If you have never been to a Marine Corps birthday celebration, I say to you; do what ever you can to buddy up to a Marine, anything to get invited to a Birthday Ball. No other service celebrates it’s history as the Marine Corps does. Or ask a Marine about Chesty, or ask about Manila John. I hear tell, when you die, you only remember two people, your mother and your Senior Drill Instructor. Semper Fi ---
**Author:** ![toadspittle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2003, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/33 "2003-04-04T16:00:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Daver914 \* > \*\*The couple of marines I know only refer to themselves and their fellows as “marines”. They don’t like to be called “soldiers”. In less formal situations they call each other “devil dogs”, as in “Hey devil dog, get over here.” The devil dog thing is supposedly a nickname from the WWII-era, when certain German units nicknamed the U.S. Marines “teufelhunden” (hence Devil Dogs). I’m sure someone whose German is better will be along to correct the spelling of the aforementioned term. \*\* Just an additional note on the “devil dogs”–apparently the Navy medics, who serve with the Marines, are also called “devil docs”: [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23329-2003Apr3.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A23329-2003Apr3.html) [quote] Assigned by CNN to cover the mobile staff of naval surgeons known as the **“devil docs,”** Gupta said he was called on to operate on the boy because he was the only neurosurgeon present. … During one of his reports on the incident Thursday, unit commander Dr. Rob Hinks thanked Gupta for his help, welcoming him as “an honorary member of the **devil docs**.” [/quote ---
**Author:** ![Kilt-wearin\_man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/82dd89/32.png) [@Kilt-wearin\_man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kilt-wearin_man)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2003, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/34 "2003-04-04T16:21:09Z")
If all of your information, **TGWATY** , is technically correct as far as dictionary definitions go. In the world at large, however (and this seems to be true not only in the USA, but also in the UK)… “Soldier” refers to a member of the Army “Sailor” refers to a member of the Navy “Airman” refers to a member of the Air Force (regardless of gender) “Marine” refers to a member of the Marine Corps. For US Marines, it is always capitalized. Branches of the uniformed services should never be referred to as “clubs”. And that’s the way it is. A Marine is not a soldier, and will explain this to you in no uncertain terms if you call one such to his face. An airman is not a soldier, either - he or she isn’t as likely to be offended as a Marine would be, but it would annoy said airman. However, if you collect three or four members from each service, you have a roomfull of troops. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Ranger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2003, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/35 "2003-04-06T06:30:02Z")
2 points I want to make. If you don’t want to insult a Coast Guardsman, call him/her a Coastie. The Coast Guard is NOT part of the Navy. :: shudder :: A Cavalry troop is on the same rung of the organizational ladder as an Infantry company. A Cavalry squadron is on the same rung as an Infantry battalion. Squads and platoons are the same. And “Trooper” refers to a Cavalryman. Ranger Jeff \< former member of 2/7 Cav AND USCG ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2003, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/36 "2003-04-06T06:59:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kilt-wearin’ man \* > \*\*A Marine is not a soldier, and will explain this to you in no uncertain terms if you call one such to his face. \*\* Nope. Can’t agree: [http://www.angelfire.com/ca/dickg/soldier.html](http://www.angelfire.com/ca/dickg/soldier.html) Marines are soldiers, and have been referred to as “Soldiers” by their own officers since the days of John Adams. However, “Soldier” is not a proper TITLE for a Marine; the proper title is “Marine.” ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Rieux](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@Dr.Rieux](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Rieux)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2003, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155/37 "2003-04-06T09:24:27Z")
The other night on _Mail Call_–the episode featuring hand grenades–I swear I heard R. Lee Ermey use the term **Soldier Marines**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-marines-be-called-soldiers-and-other-questions/165155.md?page=1)