# Should Michael Sam be selected regardless of his playing ability? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 9, 2014, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076 "2014-05-09T18:48:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2014, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/21 "2014-05-11T23:39:36Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > [249 out of 256](http://www.cnn.com/2014/05/10/us/football-michael-sam/index.html?hpt=hp_t1), but he did get drafted. [Let the financial destruction of the St Louis Rams begin!](http://www.christianpost.com/news/nfl-team-that-drafts-openly-gay-player-michael-sam-will-face-boycott-says-d-c-lobbyist-seeking-to-ban-gays-from-league-119382/) ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/22 "2014-05-12T00:18:03Z")
> [@furt](#): > > He should get exactly the draft position his talent, skills and performance warrant, no higher or lower. Does that go both ways? Should a team that refuses to draft Sam based on their opinion that his sexual orientation would be a “distraction” be condemned for doing so? Or do these kinds of determinations only go against a homosexual player? Of course this is all assuming (wrongly to my mind) that there is some kind of objective measure of someone’s “talent, skills, and performance”. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/23 "2014-05-12T00:59:49Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > [Let the financial destruction of the St Louis Rams begin!](http://www.christianpost.com/news/nfl-team-that-drafts-openly-gay-player-michael-sam-will-face-boycott-says-d-c-lobbyist-seeking-to-ban-gays-from-league-119382/) The Rams are already in a heated battle with St. Louis about improvements to their stadium, and the lease has an escape clause that can be activated in 2015. Any serious boycott that substantially impacts Rams revenues and the owners will activate the escape clause and move to somewhere that offers a better deal. In other words, boycotting the Rams could turn their billionaire owner into an even bigger billionaire. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/24 "2014-05-12T00:59:55Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > [Let the financial destruction of the St Louis Rams begin!](http://www.christianpost.com/news/nfl-team-that-drafts-openly-gay-player-michael-sam-will-face-boycott-says-d-c-lobbyist-seeking-to-ban-gays-from-league-119382/) We all know how successful the Christian Rights boycott of Disney was. Place is almost a ghost town… Somehow I think the Rams will do just fine. ---
**Author:** ![UTejas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UTejas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UTejas)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/25 "2014-05-12T01:32:03Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > [Let the financial destruction of the St Louis Rams begin!](http://www.christianpost.com/news/nfl-team-that-drafts-openly-gay-player-michael-sam-will-face-boycott-says-d-c-lobbyist-seeking-to-ban-gays-from-league-119382/) On the other hand,[it already seems](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/10/michael-sam-jersey-rams_n_5303435.html) as if Sam will have the highest selling jersey for any rookie this year ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/26 "2014-05-12T21:35:49Z")
> [@UTejas](#): > > On the other hand,[it already seems](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/05/10/michael-sam-jersey-rams_n_5303435.html) as if Sam will have the highest selling jersey for any rookie this year Nope. It will be Manziel, but Sam will likely be the second most. [Johnny Manziel’s jersey a top-seller](http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/johnny-manziels-jersey-top-seller/story?id=23681052) [QUOTE=ESPN] So many No. 2 Cleveland Browns jerseys with Johnny Manziel’s name on them have been sold since he was drafted Thursday night that the rookie quarterback has the best-selling jersey on [NFLShop.com](http://NFLShop.com) since April 1, topping the likes of Russell Wilson, Peyton Manning and Colin Kaepernick. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/27 "2014-05-12T21:45:35Z")
According to [one writer](http://onenewsnow.com/perspectives/bryan-fischer/2014/05/12/the-nfls-inexcusable-lack-of-compassion-for-michael-sam), the NFL should be ashamed of themselves for not caring about Sam, because as a young, black, gay man he’s clearly going to get HIV and die. If they cared they’d have him go to ‘reparative therapy’ and turn straight! ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/28 "2014-05-12T21:48:20Z")
> [@UTejas](#): > > On the other hand, he was the defensive player of the year in the premier college conference in the country. It would be shocking if the DPOY in the SEC went undrafted, especially after being projected around the 4th round prior to coming out. Eh, I don’t think it would have been that shocking. The Big 12 DPOY, Jackson Jeffcoat, went undrafted, and he was projected as a 3rd round pick. He also was a tweener defensive end. First Team All-SEC DT, Kelcy Quarles went undrafted. There have been Heisman trophy winning players not drafted; in fact the guy who finished 3rd in the Heisman voting this year went undrafted. The NFL is a different game than college. Whether it is QBs who play in different offensive systems than are used in the NFL or undersized lineman, there are always guys with big time college resumes who don’t make it in the NFL. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2014, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/29 "2014-05-12T22:06:07Z")
I know it’s moot at this point, but I think it was in the NFL’s best interest to draft him given that they are a business, and him being part of the league is good for business. Yes, sports are the closest industries to ideal meritocracies, but so much of it is still subjective and circumstantial that I don’t think making space for one (seemingly marginal) guy is that big a deal given the obvious upside. ---
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/30 "2014-05-13T01:14:11Z")
So since Micheal’s now part of an NFL team, any guesses as to how long before other gay players come out of the closet? ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/31 "2014-05-13T02:07:32Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > So since Micheal’s now part of an NFL team, any guesses as to how long before other gay players come out of the closet? I would imagine there are plenty of gay athletes who are out to their teams and peers, but not the public. Even Sam was out to his teammates long before he went public. I don’t know if him being out publicly, and subjecting himself to the scrutiny a media spotlight, will convince many others to do the same if they weren’t inclined to do it already. Especially since we don’t yet know how all of this will pan out. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/32 "2014-05-13T02:32:49Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > So since Micheal’s now part of an NFL team, any guesses as to how long before other gay players come out of the closet? He hasn’t made the team yet, he was drafted. Lots of drafted players never play a down in the NFL. It’s better than not being drafted (for the most part) but making the team is probably a much better guidepost. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/33 "2014-05-13T07:03:23Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Does that go both ways? Should a team that refuses to draft Sam based on their opinion that his sexual orientation would be a “distraction” be condemned for doing so? Or do these kinds of determinations only go against a homosexual player? I, for one, would call them gutless. > [@](#): > > Of course this is all assuming (wrongly to my mind) that there is some kind of objective measure of someone’s “talent, skills, and performance”. No, it doesn’t. It’s a subjective measure, but every team does indeed make it and expresses it on their draft board. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/34 "2014-05-13T14:10:26Z")
> [@Patch](#): > > So since Micheal’s now part of an NFL team, any guesses as to how long before other gay players come out of the closet? > [@Telemark](#): > > He hasn’t made the team yet, he was drafted. Lots of drafted players never play a down in the NFL. It’s better than not being drafted (for the most part) but making the team is probably a much better guidepost. Sam hasn’t made the team, and he has some major obstacles in his way: Robert Quinn and Chris Long. The Rams are reasonably set for defensive ends: Quinn was a first round draft pick in 2011 and Long was a first round draft pick in his year (2007?). And on the bench, they have a number of backups whose names I can’t recall. In other words, the Rams have some depth in the position. Still, the guy was SEC’s Defensive Player of the Year. He certainly has the potential. He just needs to bulk up. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/35 "2014-05-13T18:17:32Z")
I think all this tweener stuff is talked up too much. There are plenty of linebackers in the NFL who are no faster than Sam > [@LonghornDave](#): > > Eh, I don’t think it would have been that shocking. The Big 12 DPOY, Jackson Jeffcoat, went undrafted, and he was projected as a 3rd round pick. He also was a tweener defensive end. First Team All-SEC DT, Kelcy Quarles went undrafted. There have been Heisman trophy winning players not drafted; in fact the guy who finished 3rd in the Heisman voting this year went undrafted. The last 10 SEC DPOTYs have been first- or second-round picks, and nobody in the Big 12 _plays_ defense. ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/36 "2014-05-14T18:00:07Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The last 10 SEC DPOTYs have been first- or second-round picks, and nobody in the Big 12 _plays_ defense. Well, then good reason to not pick Michael Sam then since his first three years at Missouri were in the Big 12. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/37 "2014-05-14T18:06:00Z")
> [@LonghornDave](#): > > Well, then good reason to not pick Michael Sam then since his first three years at Missouri were in the Big 12. Except when Missouri played in the SEC, he was co-Defensive Player of the Year, so there’s that. I understand that the professional leagues are always infatuated with guys who have great measurables and get nervous around smaller player who may have peaked in college against competition and who may not have top-tier athleticism. And he did himself no favors at the combine or the other meat-market events. Taking it all together I find it hard to believe he didn’t hurt himself a bit just by coming out. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/38 "2014-05-14T19:53:20Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I think all this tweener stuff is talked up too much. There are plenty of linebackers in the NFL who are no faster than Sam > > The last 10 SEC DPOTYs have been first- or second-round picks, and nobody in the Big 12 _plays_ defense. A 4.9 40 is really slow for a linebacker, particularly an Outside one. How many Outside LBs have 40s that low? My understanding is not many. That said, he could make a good special teams player. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/39 "2014-05-14T21:11:25Z")
It’s not a huge shock, but the Tea Party Nation says they believe Sam kissing his boyfriend was a ‘scripted moment’ and obviously staged to push an agenda. It of course couldn’t possibly be that he had just received what was probably the biggest news of his life and reacted by embracing the person he loves. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076/40 "2014-05-14T21:13:37Z")
Who cares what they think, though? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-michael-sam-be-selected-regardless-of-his-playing-ability/688076.md?page=3)