# Should Non-Citzens be allows to vote? One USA state ( California ) says YES. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 23, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432 "2018-07-23T14:26:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/101 "2018-07-31T20:53:18Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > There’s also how in many cases in the US the local (municipal, county) elections are held in off-years or off-dates where there’s no federal election to cross-contaminate (e.g. NYC). Or, you can have a ballot paper of local elections and a ballot paper of statewide/federal and just not hand over the latter to the noncitizen voter (this of course applies to Scantron ballots, not to the straight screen-only e-voting). It’s true that it would be more challenging where and when where the local elections and referenda are all simultaneous with the Congressional/Presidential one. I’m sure you could design a ballot that worked for this situation. Maybe add an additional check box for each electoral race, if that box is marked then the machine ignores that race. The poll worker could fill it in before handing to a voter not eligible for all races. In my area, you are assigned to an election district. Your election district is the area with a unique combination of state and local congressional and council districts. Each polling place serves multiple election districts. When you go in to vote, you go to the table assigned to your district and sign in and get your ballot - back in the days of the machines each election district had its own set of machines. For many years I was in a tiny election district ( only about 2 city blocks square ). We always had this one sad looking beat up voting machine over in the corner of the polling place. The upside was that there was never a line. This little anomaly was corrected during the last redistricting. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/102 "2018-08-01T00:27:05Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > In this case for school boards, but its a slippery slope. The fifth response to your OP contained a link which said “at one time or another 40 states or territories … have at some time given at least some aliens voting rights in some or all elections… Arkansas became the last state to outlaw non-citizen voting in 1926.” It seems pretty obvious to me that reality has demonstrated that this is the opposite of a slippery slope, but I don’t claim to be an expert at this counting thing. What do you think: Is 1 less than 40? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Economist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c89c15/32.png) [@Evil\_Economist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Economist)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/103 "2018-08-01T00:29:42Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > That would be extremely easy in the US, given that we don’t have any federal elections. There are elections for federal positions, but it’s completely up to the states to decide who gets to vote in those, just like all other elections. According to the [Wiki link](http://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=(title:18%20section:611%20edition:prelim)%20OR%20(granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section611)&f=treesort&edition=prelim&num=0&jumpTo=true): “Since 1996, a federal law has prohibited non-citizens from voting in federal elections, punishing them by fines, imprisonment, inadmissibility, and deportation.” Federal elections are defined as “any election held solely or in part for the purpose of electing a candidate for the office of President, Vice President, Presidential elector, Member of the Senate, Member of the House of Representatives, Delegate from the District of Columbia, or Resident Commissioner”. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2018, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/104 "2018-08-02T06:23:39Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > How would you know? Step 1) Higher tax levy voted in. Step 2) Rent does not change. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2018, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/105 "2018-08-02T08:02:11Z")
> [@OldGuy](#): > > There are, I think, very few mechanical machines anymore. Many machines are simply scanners that scan your paper ballot. Some are touch screen like ATMs. I’m not proposing more machines. The machines have to be reprogrammed every election, even the mechanical ones if you count setting them up as programming. You only need to program them a bit differently. > > It might take a few more workers to physically stand there and direct people, but not even that for the scanner type machines. In the UK, votes are still counted by hand, in a spirit of ‘if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it’. Votes are counted by armies of council workers at large trestle tables in sports halls and the like. Local and national voting slips are printed on different colours. If you don’t qualify to vote in the national election, the nice lady in the polling station, who simply asks your name and address and ticks you off a list, just doesn’t give you that coloured piece of paper. No ID is requested. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2018, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/106 "2018-08-04T17:25:01Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Snopes says [not true.](https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/california-motor-voter-act/) What is true is that California allows illegal immigrants to obtain drivers licenses. During that process, a person who obtains a drivers license may register to vote simply by attesting that he or she is a United States citizen and no verification is ever done. Although, it is technically true that California has not legalized illegal immigrant voting, for most definitions of “allow” it is true. It would be like having a law on the books saying that escape from prison is illegal, but if you merely attest that you are innocent, they let you go. It is very fair to say that such a system allows prison escapes. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2018, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432/107 "2018-08-04T17:36:43Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I’m fine in theory with states allowing non citizens to vote for state and local offices. But if they do that, they have to have safeguards in place to keep them from voting in federal elections and I don’t sense much motivation on Democrats’ part to insure that. Their “plan” is to just assume it won’t happen. Except people can’t be expected to know what they can vote for and what they can’t. The way it is dealt with is that you are not offered the ability to vote on things that don’t apply to you. Or, so I assume. That’s what happens in elections for me. I live outside of town, so, although I go into town to vote, neither my absentee ballot nor the computer back when I used it offered me the chance to vote for anything that was city-only. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-non-citzens-be-allows-to-vote-one-usa-state-california-says-yes/818432.md?page=5)