# Should people only be allowed to purchase ingredients with food stamps? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 6, 2010, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410 "2010-08-06T16:08:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/341 "2010-08-13T17:50:25Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Not at all. We all get to vote. I’m just pointing out that your blood pressure can probably only take this incessant counting of every dime you’ve ever paid in taxes for so long. > > Vote. And then… let it go. I fully intend to vote some financially disabled politicians out of office on the next go around. I do appreciate your concern for my BP. However, working in private industry and having to account for the money I spent I don’t see this as a major project. Put a spending limit on the cost per lb of meat/high end commodities and use WIC style nutritional standards. I would expect a handful of nutritionists already on the Federal Payroll could knock this out in a couple of months. the list goes to grocery stores who then sticker the items on the list. Done. Move on to the next pile of tax money blowing out the window. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/342 "2010-08-13T17:52:18Z")
> [@needscoffee](#): > > > [@monstro](#): > > > > Potato chips and similar products. Pretzels, crackers, and popcorn would be allowed, but not pork rinds and _cheese doodles_. > > Well, here you’re getting into really ambiguous territory. Most crackers have about the same fat content as potato chips. Pretzels are white flour. Popcorn is not low-fat. Potato chips - are you going to make an exception for baked potato chips? Why are chips any worse than crackers made from white flour and shortening? I’d rather eat the potato-based product, myself. And since nowadays it’s appearing that fats aren’t the enemy, but carbs, how do you make the distinction between good and bad crackers/chips? Snacks, $40 limit per month. Next. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/343 "2010-08-13T17:53:21Z")
Magiver, are you clear on the concept that if food-assistance recipients spend their allotment on junk food, your money is no more “wasted” than if they spend it on good food? Your money spent is the same either way. They don’t get an increased amount of your money if they spend it on junk food. They get their calories. They don’t starve to death. Your tax dollars don’t change based on what they buy and eat. ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/344 "2010-08-13T18:04:31Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > EBT is a _Federal_ program - those dollars are separate from the welfare dollars coming from the state of California. They’re both Federal. In fact, when you apply for EBT, you can use the same form for either of the two. And it’s county agencies that actually process the applications. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/345 "2010-08-13T18:05:19Z")
Where are you people living that food stamps are still used? NJ people get a credit card with the balance put in every month. The only diffference between it and a credit/debit card is that users can’t get change. May I remind you that junk food calories are cheap and enjoyable. When your choices of enjoyable things in life are so severely limited, you might as well enjoy food. And sometimes you have no choice but to spend $2 on 1,000 junk food caloriesover 600 healthy calories. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/346 "2010-08-13T18:07:45Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > the most saddest :smack: Note to self; more careful editing. > [@Magiver](#): > > Put a spending limit on the cost per lb of meat/high end commodities and use WIC style nutritional standards. I would expect a handful of nutritionists already on the Federal Payroll could knock this out in a couple of months. the list goes to grocery stores who then sticker the items on the list. Done. Move on to the next pile of tax money blowing out the window. Except, of course, that you still haven’t given a compelling reason WHY this should happen, other than that seeing poor people buy things you disapprove of gives you agita. ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/347 "2010-08-13T18:21:29Z")
**Magiver** , are you more opposed to people on EBT buying _junk food_ (snack cakes, Cheetos, etc.) or expensive _good food_ (lean steak, lobster, shrimp, etc.)? Because it sounds like you’re opposed to both. I don’t see people on EBT buying ‘luxury’ foods like steak and seafood as often as I see them buying junk food and sodas, but again, where is the line for ‘luxury food’? If you know when to go to the supermarket, you can often find really nice steaks that have been _way_ reduced, price-wise, because it’s near it’s sell-by date. In fact, on occasion, I’ve found steak _cheaper_ than ground beef! As for ground beef, if people _are_ well-versed in nutrition, they know that the more expensive ground beef is healthier than the cheaper ground beef because the more expensive stuff is leaner, lower in fat, and doesn’t shrink down as much. So you don’t think ‘poor people’ need steak and lobster. OK, what about coffee? Is it OK if they buy coffee? And if it’s OK for them to buy coffee, does it have to be Maxwell House or cheaper, or can they decide to splurge some of their budget on something a little more upscale? The point’s been made again and again, but you don’t seem to be getting it: the people who get EBT get a _limited amount_ of money per month. When that money’s gone, it’s gone. They don’t get _more_ because they run out of food before they run out of ‘month’. So it doesn’t _cost_ you (or me) any more if they make poor choices than if they make good ones. Do a lot of people make bad choices? Yes. Would I be in favor of some funding to educate people on EBT as to smarter choices? Yes. But it’s not your decision, because once you pay your taxes, it stops being your money! ---
**Author:** ![guizot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guizot/32/3636_2.png) [@guizot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/guizot)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/348 "2010-08-13T18:26:21Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > May I remind you that junk food calories are cheap and enjoyable. When your choices of enjoyable things in life are so severely limited, you might as well enjoy food. And sometimes you have no choice but to spend $2 on 1,000 junk food caloriesover 600 healthy calories. Yes, and alcohol is the cheapest source of calories of all. Yet, the WIC counselor told my pregnant girlfriend that cheap, enjoyable Thunderbird wasn’t a good idea, insisting on milk. Imagine that. The fact is, this isn’t Africa we’re talking about. Healthy calories are not at such a premium. Even if they tend to cost more, as a tax-payer I’d rather just raise the EBT allocation. It’s a public health issue, and many EBT users are establishing life-long eating habits for their children. ---
**Author:** ![misterW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@misterW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/misterW)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/349 "2010-08-13T18:26:22Z")
> [@starwarsfreek42](#): > > I have just returned from Wal-Mart, where I bought some pre-packaged guacamole. It cost $2. Avocados were 1 apiece, but I'd have needed 3 to make as much guacamole as is in this package. Yeah, that's anecdotal. Don't care. They also have .99 pizzas, ramen for $.14 per pack, and a variety of other cheap prepared foods. But a bag of frozen vegetables is $3 or $4. A bag of mixed fruit was $5.99. Sack of potatoes $4.98. Two boxes of frozen potatoes was $3.89. From where I stand, the math is pretty clear. You’re not doing it right. Simply buying ingredient type foods is not enough by itself. A lot of healthy ingredient type foods are fairly expensive. Of course you will spend a lot of money if you go around buying bags of mixed fruit. That would be idiotic. How long will your $.99 pizza last you? Will ramen by itself even keep you alive? Why the hell would you even want to be eating that stuff? Go take a look at how much a generic brand of brown rice costs. Now go take a look at how much a generic bag of pinto or black beans costs. With those few dollars, you can eat for a month, and I’m sure you will be feeling better than you will after consuming your 15th ramen in a row. Buy some eggs; they are pretty cheap. Fry them up and throw them in with the rice and beans. Yes, vegetables can unfortunately be expensive, so don’t go picking through the organic produce – go for a big bag of frozen peas or something and add that in here and there. Buying ingredient type food can be incredibly cheap if you are smart about it and very expensive if you are not. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/350 "2010-08-13T18:35:16Z")
Rice. Beans. Eggs. Peas. Man, if I went on that diet, they’d know about it for blocks around. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/351 "2010-08-13T18:37:46Z")
[QUOTE=guizot;12798447[/QUOTE] Yes, and alcohol is the cheapest source of calories of all. \ [/QUOTE] I’m talking “food” not “alcohol.” Allyou people taking about healthy food, find out the allowance for your state and live on it for a month. Really live on it. No restaurants, no movies and popcorn, just supermarket food. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/352 "2010-08-13T18:43:36Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > > [@DianaG](#): > > > > the most saddest > > :smack: > Note to self; more careful editing. > > > [@Magiver](#): > > > > Put a spending limit on the cost per lb of meat/high end commodities and use WIC style nutritional standards. I would expect a handful of nutritionists already on the Federal Payroll could knock this out in a couple of months. the list goes to grocery stores who then sticker the items on the list. Done. Move on to the next pile of tax money blowing out the window. > > Except, of course, that you still haven’t given a compelling reason WHY this should happen, other than that seeing poor people buy things you disapprove of gives you agita. budget cuts. If tax revenue is down then expense efficiency is the logical end result. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/353 "2010-08-13T18:46:46Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > > [@DianaG](#): > > > > :smack: > > Note to self; more careful editing. > > Except, of course, that you still haven’t given a compelling reason WHY this should happen, other than that seeing poor people buy things you disapprove of gives you agita. > > budget cuts. If tax revenue is down then expense efficiency is the logical end result. Seems like an odd place to start. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/354 "2010-08-13T18:56:06Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > [QUOTE=guizot;12798447[/QUOTE] > Yes, and alcohol is the cheapest source of calories of all. \ I’m talking “food” not “alcohol.” Allyou people taking about healthy food, find out the allowance for your state and live on it for a month. Really live on it. No restaurants, no movies and popcorn, just supermarket food. [/QUOTE] The task is to replace potato chips and Dr Pepper with dishes like vegetable lo-mein and egg plant parmesan. Instead of cheese doodles I buy cheese. One eggplant made something like 9 meals. I’m doing that right now. My “snacks” are homemade ice tea instead of pop and toast instead of potato chips. I don’t see how fried snacks figure into a food budget. The question is how do people live on the allowance while buying high priced nutritionally vacant snacks? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/355 "2010-08-13T18:59:52Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > > [@Magiver](#): > > > > budget cuts. If tax revenue is down then expense efficiency is the logical end result. > > Seems like an odd place to start. My state is bleeding out and has already cut mental health care way back. It’s going to happen. Budget cuts are going to cut into every aspect of tax funded expenditures. Country roads will be downgraded to gravel, parks will close… It’s inevitable. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/356 "2010-08-13T19:28:36Z")
**Annie-Xmas** – I think people are simply using “food stamps” as a generic term. > [@Magiver](#): > > > [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > > > Am I the only one here who finds it ironic that the conservatives seem to be in favor of more regulation and the implementation of the nanny state? I guess it really comes down to you can’t tell me what to do but you you damn well better tell other people what they can do. > > Reducing waste does not equal a nanny state. A nanny state would involve telling people how to live their lives and spend their money, not how to spend other people’s money. That direction should remain with the people from whom the money was taken. If you think it’s OK for people to buy steak and lobster as part of a program to feed people in need then you approve of feeding fewer people per tax dollar spent. Get this through your head: IT IS NOT YOUR MONEY ANYMORE. And this: > [@](#): > > If you think it’s OK for people to buy steak and lobster as part of a program to feed people in need then you approve of feeding fewer people per tax dollar spent. Once again, only hurts the person buying it. THEY won’t have enough money at the end of the month, if they blow it all on fancy food. It’s no different if you or me goes to the store and spends all of our grocery money on expensive crap. BTW, you don’t have to spend a ton of money to buy steak. Wait until it’s on sale, and look for a decent piece of meat. We’re not talking prime rib or filet mignon here, but steak doesn’t have to be THAT expensive. And in one minute you’re bitching that people are buying junk food; now you’re complaining that people are buying decent food that’s expensive. What is it now? (Oh, and you DO know that the people using EBT are also paying taxes? It’s not just YOUR tax money alone.) > [@Magiver](#): > > > [@begbert2](#): > > > > Seems like an odd place to start. > > My state is bleeding out and has already cut mental health care way back. It’s going to happen. Budget cuts are going to cut into every aspect of tax funded expenditures. Country roads will be downgraded to gravel, parks will close… It’s inevitable. Once again, you have YET to demonstrate how restricting what people can buy with EBT/food stamps/whatever affects this. ---
**Author:** ![misterW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@misterW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/misterW)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/357 "2010-08-13T19:30:15Z")
> [@StusBlues](#): > > Rice. Beans. Eggs. Peas. > > Man, if I went on that diet, they’d know about it for blocks around. Thats how you get back at The Man for keeping you down. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/358 "2010-08-13T19:37:18Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > budget cuts. If tax revenue is down then expense efficiency is the logical end result. I say again – creating a complex regulatory regime which costs more to develop and administer than it saves, is not an example of expense efficiency. It sounds like you could use some food assistance, **Magiver**. That’s true of a lot of middle class people these days. Since, as noted SNAP is a Federal program, it does not affect your state’s coffers – perhaps you should utilize it. You know, sometimes I’m really sad that MY tax dollars are going to bomb Afganistan, instead of giving someone right here at home the right to splurge on a birthday cake during hard times. Guess you can’t always get what you want, huh? ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/359 "2010-08-13T19:49:14Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > The question is how do people live on the allowance while buying high priced nutritionally vacant snacks? No, the question is “Why does Magiver care if people choose cheetos over eating between the 27th and the 1st of the month?” After all, you’ve explicitly said they shouldn’t eat steak or lobster, either. Apparently it can’t be said enough… from your perspective, and from the state’s perspective, it doesn’t matter whether they spent the money on spinach or on hohos or on abalone. They don’t get more if they run out, so it’s their decision what to buy, and their problem if they choose badly. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2010, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410/360 "2010-08-13T20:11:09Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > > [@Magiver](#): > > > > The question is how do people live on the allowance while buying high priced nutritionally vacant snacks? > > No, the question is “Why does Magiver care if people choose cheetos over eating between the 27th and the 1st of the month?” > > After all, you’ve explicitly said they shouldn’t eat steak or lobster, either. Apparently it can’t be said enough… from your perspective, and from the state’s perspective, it doesn’t matter whether they spent the money on spinach or on hohos or on abalone. They don’t get more if they run out, so it’s their decision what to buy, and their problem if they choose badly. It’s, as I said, the “eat your peas – there are people starving in China!” philosophy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-people-only-be-allowed-to-purchase-ingredients-with-food-stamps/549410.md?page=19)