# should seized Iraqi funds be used to compensate American POW? DOJ says no. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 30, 2003, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823 "2003-07-30T03:07:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/1 "2003-07-30T03:07:10Z")
[Linkage](http://reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=politicsNews&storyID=3180719) Earlier this month, 17 American POWs were awarded a billion dollars in damages, payable to Iraq, for torture that was inflicted on them during Gulf War One. Those POWs want to be paid from funds that have been seized from Iraq. The Justice Department is opposing the judgement. > [@](#): > > The U.S. government on Tuesday told a federal judge it did not want to spend seized Iraqi funds to pay compensation to 17 Americans held as prisoners of war during the 1991 Gulf War. > > Shannen Coffin, a deputy assistant attorney general at the Justice Department, said the government preferred to spend the money on postwar rebuilding in Iraq. > > “It really is unthinkable that in the end that the reconstruction of Iraq should be done on the backs of the POWs who were brutally tortured (there),” said Stephen Fennell, attorney for the 17 former prisoners of war and their families who are trying to recover the nearly $1 billion in damages they were awarded earlier this month. > > \ > > Justice Department officials said President Bush’s March order seizing the assets makes it clear the funds should go mainly to the rebuilding of Iraq. > > “The United States does not have an obligation to pay these claims to plaintiffs,” said Coffin. “The president’s judgment is that this money is to be used to rebuild Iraq.” The POWs are trying to argue that the US is taking sides against its own POWs and aligning itself with the very country that tortured them. > [@](#): > > Col. David Eberly, the senior American POW who was held captive for more than six weeks in 1991, criticized the government for failing to stand by its own troops. > > “It’s not about the money,” he told reporters outside the courtroom. “It is rather ironic that we have come to a point that a representative of the government is now arguing for a government…that our government sent us into combat for.” “It’s for the young men and women … who are continuing to fight,” Eberly said when asked why he filed suit. “When they go into battle they have to have faith that their country will continue to stand behind them.” The DOJ is asking for the lawsuit to be dismissed and for the judgement to be set aside on the grounds that the government which was responsible for the torture no longer exists. So who’s right? I actually kind of see the government’s side of this. The Iraqi regime responsible for the torture of American POWs is gone. Is it really fair to raid the desperately need coffers of the Iraqi people now to pay a debt incurred by a government they had no control over? On the other hand, I think the POWs are entitled to _something_ and I’m not sure I agree with the DOJ’s argument that that the judgement should totally be set aside. Of 1.9 billion dollars originally seized from Iraq, only 722 million remains. Can’t we give the POWs a million dollars each and use the rest for rebuilding Iraq? My natural instinct is to oppose anything that Ashcroft and Bush want to do just on general principle. In this case I don’t think they’re completely wrong but I’m surprised they’re being so absolute about it. So what do you think? Is the government right to oppose this judgement? Are they stabbing our POWs in the back? Or are they making a pragmatic choice and do the POWs just have to realize that they can’t collect their damages from a defunct regime? ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/2 "2003-07-30T03:16:34Z")
The POWs deserve nothing more than an average soldier. They deserve no special treatment. ---
**Author:** ![Priam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/77aa72/32.png) [@Priam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Priam)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/3 "2003-07-30T03:19:12Z")
I would say compensate them reasonably from U.S. funds instead. Yes it might still mean drawing money away from the rebuilding efforts, but there’s symbolism here as well. Much better to invest Iraqi money into Iraq than use it in other places. Half of the battle is perception, and thats an area we could use some boosts in. ---
**Author:** ![system](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/original/2X/e/e489c3b7d8fce19c4b355dd4fc3f88cc39c34b87.png) [@system](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/system)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/4 "2003-07-30T06:39:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > So who’s right? I actually kind of see the government’s side of this. The Iraqi regime responsible for the torture of American POWs is gone. Is it really fair to raid the desperately need coffers of the Iraqi people now to pay a debt incurred by a government they had no control over? In a world of limited resources, the money should be put to its best use, further to that, I find the concept of foreign soldiers suing a sovereign over accusations of treatment during wartime to be exceedingly bad precedent, one which the US would not enjoy if the tables were turned. The lawsuit is bad policy. > [@](#): > > On the other hand, I think the POWs are entitled to _something_ and I’m not sure I agree with the DOJ’s argument that that the judgement should totally be set aside. Why are they entitled to “something”? They’re not civilians, they are or were soldiers. > [@](#): > > Of 1.9 billion dollars originally seized from Iraq, only 722 million remains. Can’t we give the POWs a million dollars each and use the rest for rebuilding Iraq? Why should the meagre resources available to Iraq go to a set of American soldiers whose award, by the way, was a default judgement as the Iraqis did not defend themselves (Iraq not recognizing in their basic law the legality of most outside judgements.). Further to that, as the occupying power, the US has a certain duty to the Iraqi interests as well, which is certainly not to fork over money to some Americans with torture claims, valid or not. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/5 "2003-07-30T06:55:45Z")
You make some good points, **Collounsbury** , I was leaning towards the government’s side on this anyway. You’ve convinced me that confiscating what’s left of the Iraqi coffers to pay this judgement is probably a bad idea. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/6 "2003-07-30T07:24:14Z")
I think that money rightfully belongs to the people of Iraq. Not that I don’t want to see the soldiers compensated, but countless Iraqi citizens were tortured as well, and I think they should be entitled to the money. ---
**Author:** ![welby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d78d45/32.png) [@welby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/welby)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/7 "2003-07-30T14:09:47Z")
I don’t see it as the right thing to do. The soldiers were just that - soldiers. When you join the military you know that there is a chance you will see combat, and perhaps be captured or killed. It is an agreement entered into with open eyes. Certainly it is a horrible thing to be a POW, especially in a country where the things that we consider rights are considered conveniences, but to take money from the pockets of Iraqi citizens will not produce justice for either the POW’s or the Iraqi people. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/8 "2003-07-30T14:48:39Z")
I’m agreeing that money should not be taken from Iraqi citizens. The POWs should still get generous veterans’ compensations and benefits, including any psychological treatments they may need, for the rest of their lives. However, is it possible that this decision may piss off veterans or even troops currently in the field. Is there any chance that the military culture in general will buy into the POWs rhetoric that the Us government is “siding with” the enemy? From my experience in the miltary I wouldn’t think so. As has been pointed out, there was a pretty pragmatic acceptance of the fact that signing on the line meant we might get killed or captured. I doubt it would have even occurred to us to try to sue a hypothetical enemy. That was almost twenty years ago, though, and I’ve been out of touch. I also wasn’t standing in a desert in 110 degree heat watching out for snipers. We’ve already seen reports of low morale and anti-Bush/Rummy resentment from the troops in Iraq. Could something like this antgonize them even more? ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/9 "2003-07-30T15:59:08Z")
Are these funds Iraqi government funds, or do they belong to individuals? If the latter, then even aside from all other considerations of fairness I believe it’s wrong to penalize individuals for the actions of their governments. ---
**Author:** ![Shiva418](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@Shiva418](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shiva418)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/10 "2003-07-30T17:10:11Z")
I think that the Bush regime is correct in their decision. Any compensation made to POWs should come from their patron nation, NOT the enemy. Just think, are we going to cough up billions of dollars to compensate the “detainees” in Guantanamo (sp?)? To give this money to Americans would only enrage the Iraqis further, make the rebuilding of Iraq more costly and difficult, and set a precident that would be detrimental to the way war is conducted. ---
**Author:** ![Sterra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8c91f0/32.png) [@Sterra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sterra)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/11 "2003-07-30T17:12:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*However, is it possible that this decision may piss off veterans or even troops currently in the field. Is there any chance that the military culture in general will buy into the POWs rhetoric that the Us government is “siding with” the enemy? \*\* I’d say that Bush cutting veterans benifits is what will do that. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/12 "2003-07-30T17:14:13Z")
The POW’s came home with their lives, which is more than the 148 killed in action can say. Should the families of the KIA’s be able to sue the Iraqis for killing their loved ones? ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2003, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/13 "2003-07-30T17:25:47Z")
Sorry, I can’t see it. If a soldier held prisoner by the former Iraqi government, why should the future Iraqi government be held responsible? Further, if a soldier held prisoner deserves payment, surely those wounded or the families of those killed would be next in line. Soldiers are compensated by the government they serve. Full stop. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/14 "2003-07-31T07:19:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > I’m agreeing that money should not be taken from Iraqi citizens. The POWs should still get generous veterans’ compensations and benefits, including any psychological treatments they may need, for the rest of their lives. Getting off topic here, but… I know we have to have the best toys and all, but wouldn’t it be nice if we could spend just a _little_ more of that huge military budget on soldiers getting the care they need, and just a little less on having enough bombs to blow the other guys up 10 times over? [Sorry, no cite for 10 times over, it’s just hyperbole.] ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/15 "2003-07-31T09:59:15Z")
Sure blowero. Run for office. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/16 "2003-07-31T12:23:43Z")
58mil each? WTF What is wrong with these guys that they deserve 58mil each. Would someone please torture me and then give me 58mil. ---
**Author:** ![scm1001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@scm1001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scm1001)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/17 "2003-07-31T17:04:34Z")
My pleasure yojimbo. What size whip do you normally use? ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/18 "2003-07-31T18:33:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Paul in Saudi \* > \*\*Sure blowero. Run for office. \*\* Nah, I’d never win. My idea won’t condense into an oversimplified sound-bite. The other side would just distort it into “Blowero soft on defense; liberal bad”. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2003, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-seized-iraqi-funds-be-used-to-compensate-american-pow-doj-says-no/191823/19 "2003-07-31T19:43:47Z")
yojimbo, I imagine the excessively large compensation figure is because Iraq didn’t recognize the legitimacy of the suit, and therefore did not defend themselves, and therefore the plaintiffs won a default judgement. In a normal court case with even minimal representation Iraq probably could have got the judgement reduced to a reasonable level. Personally, I think the soldiers are out of luck. The entity that tortured them is no longer in business. The US is in a position of trusteeship for the future Iraqi state, and paying the soldiers out of Iraqi funds would be wrong. The whole suit was silly anyway. Saddam would never pay, and any future post-Saddam Iraqi state would repudiate repsonsibility. They never had a chance of actually seeing any money.