# Should the red cross/crescent/star/diamond just find a neutral symbol? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 8, 2005, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649 "2005-12-08T10:39:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hirundo82](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/919ad9/32.png) [@Hirundo82](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hirundo82)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2005, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/21 "2005-12-11T22:07:33Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > I vote for a simple red circle on a white background. Bold, easily recognizable, and not religous. And [already taken](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan). ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2005, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/22 "2005-12-11T22:29:00Z")
[aside] > [@Hirundo82](#): > > And [already taken](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan). Well, technically that’s a red _disk_, rather than a red _circle_, which would look like a big letter “O”. [/aside] ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2005, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/23 "2005-12-12T00:58:31Z")
> [@Hirundo82](#): > > And [already taken](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan). And kinda Buddhist. Or maybe Hindu. Come on, there’s got to be at least one religion that can be symbolized by a circle. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2005, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/24 "2005-12-12T04:51:38Z")
> [@asterion](#): > > Come on, there’s got to be at least one religion that can be symbolized by a circle. Some goddess worshipin’ pagans use a circle as our symbol. But no one takes us seriously, anyway, so you’re welcome to it! ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2005, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/25 "2005-12-13T16:31:06Z")
slaphead: > [@](#): > > Like I said, EVERYONE who has asked for another logo since 1929 (before Israel existed) has failed to get it - why should the Israelis get what they want? Tell me this - was anyone refused permission to use another logo between then and the refusal to accept the red Star-of-David? Did anyone, before Israel (but after 1929, which you chose simply because that was the last time they _accepted_ an alternate) apply for such permission? Or was the Israeli application the first refusal? Metacom: > [@](#): > > I vote for a simple red circle on a white background. Bold, easily recognizable, and not religous. How about several concentric red-and-white circles? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2005, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/26 "2005-12-13T16:41:07Z")
The Target chain of stores might be concerned about infringing their copyright on that - not to mention that it would be a tempting, well, target. How about everybody just chill out a little? Naw, too unrealistic, I know. ---
**Author:** ![Potato\_Chip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b5a626/32.png) [@Potato\_Chip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Potato_Chip)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2005, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/27 "2005-12-13T19:24:14Z")
This may sound a little mean-spirited, but it’s not really meant to be. What about just not helping people who refuse to recognize whatever symbol the Red Cr\* has chosen? Seriously. Helping people who are extremely fickle about such matters is going to be more trouble than it’s worth anyway. Why not just wait until the leaders ask for intervention? ---
**Author:** ![slaphead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@slaphead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slaphead)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2005, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649/28 "2005-12-14T11:38:17Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Tell me this - was anyone refused permission to use another logo between then and the refusal to accept the red Star-of-David? Did anyone, before Israel (but after 1929, which you chose simply because that was the last time they _accepted_ an alternate) apply for such permission? Or was the Israeli application the first refusal? I mentioned the 1929 date because it was was the date when the Geneva Conventions were modified to recognise the Red Crescent and the Red Lion which Iran used. Before that it only ever recognised the Red Cross, as far as I know. So if you look at what is officially recognised into the Geneva Conventions, the history of the symbols breaks down into pre1929 (1), 1929-2005(3), post 2005(4), and that’s all. According to the reasonably comprehensive [wikipeida](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Red_Cross_and_Red_Crescent_Movement#Protection_symbols_vs._organizational_emblems) entry Sri Lanka and India both tried to get the red swastika added in 1957 and 1977 respectively. It is possible that the wiki article might be wrong, but a quick google found support from [ABC](http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2005/s1461328.htm) and [Scotland on Sunday](http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=1319432003), which also mentions Zimbabwe wanting a red star, Thailand wanting a red flame and Afghanistan at one time wanting a red mosque. Additional detail [here](http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/int-ifrc.html) on some flag-obsessives website, which also mentions the Red Palm, Red Lamb and other oddities. Google also turned up some ranting from some [Krauthammer](http://www.jewishworldreview.com/cols/krauthammer032700.asp) person who seems very inflamed about the whole thing and appears totally ignorant of the long history of the swastika emblem in Asia ([pic](http://www.swastika-info.com/en/startpage/singapore/1063235550.html),[Article](http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/995595.cms)). I can only assume that this sort of ranting is what gets everyone so excited about what is basically a matter of practicalities and international bureacracy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-red-cross-crescent-star-diamond-just-find-a-neutral-symbol/334649.md?page=1)