# should the Sesame Street same-sex couple be human or Muppet? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 15, 2011, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738 "2011-08-15T00:39:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/21 "2011-08-15T17:48:47Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > The latter obviously. I was responding to posters that thought they could just drop a gay-couple in the show and not explain why they live together or what their relationship is. Thats not really how Sesame Street works. When I said, “not a word mentioned about it”, the “it” referred to their being specifically **gay** -married, emphasis on the **gay**. Sorry I wasn’t clearer in that post, but I hope my second post made it more clear. Basically, what \*\*purplehorseshoe \*\*said. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/22 "2011-08-15T19:32:49Z")
Y’know, I’d always thought [Mokey and Red](http://www.flickr.com/photos/muppetcast/3395223319/) were an item—from when I was a little kid, long before I’d ever even _heard_ of what being “gay” was. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/23 "2011-08-15T19:37:10Z")
I vote neither. Honestly. Sesame Street doesn’t need a gay couple. It’s a kid’s show, not a political playground. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/24 "2011-08-15T19:51:18Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > Y’know, I’d always thought [Mokey and Red](http://www.flickr.com/photos/muppetcast/3395223319/) were an item—from when I was a little kid, long before I’d ever even _heard_ of what being “gay” was. Thanks for RUINING _Fraggle Rock_! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Vita\_Beata](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@Vita\_Beata](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vita_Beata)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/25 "2011-08-15T19:58:18Z")
Oscar the Grouch was an early example of a hoarder. Send in the psychologists and cleaners to empty out his garbage can. Mr. SnuffleUpaGus? Warned of the dangers of snorting or sniffing. :dubious: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/26 "2011-08-15T20:01:52Z")
I’m not sure this is something the show needs to address specifically. And the OP is worded in a way that makes it sound like the show is definitely going to deal with same-sex marriage in NY, and they haven’t said they will. I wouldn’t expect that to happen. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/27 "2011-08-15T20:14:17Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m not sure this is something the show needs to address specifically. No? Gay couplehood and gay parenting, by almost any measures, are on a trend of ever-increasing visibility and social normality. The ethos of _Sesame Street_ has always been diverse and inclusive. Maybe not this year, but soon enough the absence of a gay couple will be more conspicuous than the presence. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/28 "2011-08-15T20:14:39Z")
**Marley** -You’re right that I worded it badly, my bad. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/29 "2011-08-15T20:19:21Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > I vote neither. Honestly. Sesame Street doesn’t need a gay couple. It’s a kid’s show, not a political playground. You might as well say they should tone down the black, hispanic and Asian stuff. Sesame Street has always been uber diverse. What’s all this I’m hearing about Bert & Ernie anyway? Is the gay couple thing coming from the show, or what? People have joked about the pair for years. Is this different? ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/30 "2011-08-15T20:29:18Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > You might as well say they should tone down the black, hispanic and Asian stuff. Sesame Street has always been uber diverse. > > What’s all this I’m hearing about Bert & Ernie anyway? Is the gay couple thing coming from the show, or what? People have joked about the pair for years. Is this different? You know, there are some people, it seems, who would be perfectly content if same sex couples stayed in the closet forever. It’s a reality that such couples exist and are not at all uncommon; why is it “political theatre” to acknowledge their existence? No one’s talking about a sex-ed course here. We’re just talking about having a couple who are the same sex, yeesh. And the Bert & Ernie thing isn’t coming from the show. It’s the same gag that’s been going on for eons now, which still makes me chuckle for some reason. The only thing that tickles me more than them being a gay couple is that internet joke that ran for a while claiming that Bert was a member of the Taliban. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/31 "2011-08-15T20:32:22Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > What’s all this I’m hearing about Bert & Ernie anyway? Is the gay couple thing coming from the show, or what? People have joked about the pair for years. Is this different? It was a (debunked) email rumor that gets resurrected every few years. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/32 "2011-08-15T20:44:17Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > No? Gay couplehood and gay parenting, by almost any measures, are on a trend of ever-increasing visibility and social normality. The ethos of _Sesame Street_ has always been diverse and inclusive. Maybe not this year, but soon enough the absence of a gay couple will be more conspicuous than the presence. My take on this may be skewed because by the time I started watching the show, showing interracial friendships and couples wasn’t a big deal - so either it didn’t get as much attention as in previous years, or I just didn’t notice. I also don’t know what the show is like these days, although my impression is that they’re aiming at younger kids. If it’s in keeping with how they already deal with diversity, then they should go ahead and add a gay couple at some point and not draw any more attention to it than they do with straight couples. > [@levdrakon](#): > > What’s all this I’m hearing about Bert & Ernie anyway? Is the gay couple thing coming from the show, or what? People have joked about the pair for years. Is this different? No, it’s the same joke. I think some people passed around a petition saying Bert and Ernie should get married since people have been making that joke for decades. CTW said “They’re puppets and don’t have a sexual orientation.” ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/33 "2011-08-15T20:54:52Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > I vote neither. Honestly. Sesame Street doesn’t need a gay couple. It’s a kid’s show, not a political playground. Unless you’re a member of the 16th century European nobility, marriage is seldom a political act. ---
**Author:** ![HenryGale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b782af/32.png) [@HenryGale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HenryGale)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/34 "2011-08-15T21:41:36Z")
You know… I think in the long term, it just doesn’t matter. A quick Googling confirms that I would have been a young Sesame Street viewer when Mister Hooper died, and the “Farewell, Mr. Hooper” episode is probably the best-known and most important “very special episode” that Sesame Street had and… I don’t remember it at all. If not for the internets, I wouldn’t even know it happened. Should there be gay characters on Sesame Street? Definitely. Would they exclude a character who is Latino, Muslim, Republican, working-class, or whatever other ethnic/religious/sexual/social/political group? But if we think the inclusion is going to actually teach the kids anything… probably not, unless I was just a particularly block-headed kid (which I’m not ruling out). ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/35 "2011-08-15T21:44:24Z")
Has _Sesame Street_ ever had a disabled Muppet? I gotta believe a human in a chair has happened at some point. (Haven’t watched in 20 or so years) ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/36 "2011-08-15T21:52:39Z")
They should be Muppets, for one reason: Little kids tend to identify with them more easily, rather than with a pair of adults they don’t have anything in common with. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/37 "2011-08-15T21:56:44Z")
> [@etv78](#): > > Has _Sesame Street_ ever had a disabled Muppet? I gotta believe a human in a chair has happened at some point. (Haven’t watched in 20 or so years) [Sivan](http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Sivan)is a disabled Muppet on the Israeli version of Sesame Street. I don’t recall any on the US version, but I’m not the most avid viewer. Yes, of course there have been disabled humans on Sesame Street, from the beloved [Linda](http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Linda)(the deaf librarian) to a multitude of kids in wheelchairs. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/38 "2011-08-15T22:19:26Z")
Wait, I’ve got it! They could do both. A human/muppet combo where they’re both of the same sex! ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/39 "2011-08-15T22:20:38Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > [Sivan](http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Sivan)is a disabled Muppet on the Israeli version of Sesame Street. I don’t recall any on the US version, but I’m not the most avid viewer. > > Yes, of course there have been disabled humans on Sesame Street, from the beloved [Linda](http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Linda)(the deaf librarian) to a multitude of kids in wheelchairs. I figured they had kids in wheelchairs. As I said, it’s been 25 years since I was an avid viewer. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2011, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738/40 "2011-08-15T23:11:25Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Human. It would be more real, and kids would see it as less than a “fairy tale” or something “pretend”. Not to comment at all on the question of whether Sesame Street should have a gay couple, or if so, whether they should be human or muppet, but I think your implication is entirely wrong here. I have a 2 1/2 year old Elmo, and he knows that Elmo is just as real as I am. He doesn’t have any idea that the things that the muppets do are any more “pretend” than the things the humans do. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-sesame-street-same-sex-couple-be-human-or-muppet/592738.md?page=1)