# Should the United Negro College Fund turn down the gift from the Koch brothers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 6, 2014, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199 "2014-06-06T14:09:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/1 "2014-06-06T14:09:25Z")
[http://www.startribune.com/politics/national/262109971.html](http://www.startribune.com/politics/national/262109971.html) > [@](#): > > The United Negro College Fund announced a $25 million grant Friday from Koch Industries Inc. and the Charles Koch Foundation > > \ > > From the donation, $18.5 million will go toward nearly 3,000 merit-based scholarships to African-American undergraduate, graduate and post-doctoral students, and $6.5 million will go toward general support for historically black colleges and universities and the UNCF. > > \ > > He said that in today’s politically charged climate, he’s prepared to take criticism from those of different political leanings than the Kochs. > > “Criticism is a small price for helping young people get the chance to realize their dream of a college education, and if I’ve got to bear the brunt of someone else’s criticism to ensure that we have the resources to help those students, then I can handle it, and I can take the heat,” Lomax said. If I recall, there was a call for Catholic University of America to reject a $1 million donation they made last year. Should universities not accept students that are attending their school on a _Koch/UNCF_ scholarship? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/2 "2014-06-06T14:11:36Z")
Do you want to give us some idea as to why you think they should not accept the donation? Are we all supposed to automatically think “Koch brothers = bad”? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/3 "2014-06-06T14:18:11Z")
> [@](#): > > Should the United Negro College Fund turn down the gift from the Koch brothers? I don’t see why they should. Money is money and it all spends the same, and this will pay the way for 3000 scholarships (undergraduate, graduate and post-doctoral). Why would the turn it down? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/4 "2014-06-06T14:19:28Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Do you want to give us some idea as to why you think they should not accept the donation? Are we all supposed to automatically think “Koch brothers = bad”? Yeah, that’d be my question. Are there strings attached to the money? If not, it’s just money. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/5 "2014-06-06T14:20:12Z")
I believe they should as they have. Non-profits that depend upon fund raising shouldn’t look gift horses in the mouth. But, as I pointed out in the OP, many people have criticized past recipients of contributions from the Koch Brothers, as the receiver of ill gotten gains. Many people here at the SDMB have opined that the Koch’s are morally bankrupt, should be locked up, etc. etc. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/6 "2014-06-06T14:22:06Z")
Yes, you pointed out that there have been criticisms in the past, but so what? What were the criticisms and were they valid? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/7 "2014-06-06T14:24:14Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Yeah, that’d be my question. Are there strings attached to the money? If not, it’s just money. Hadn’t thought of that, but certainly if there were strings attached that could be justification for not taking the offer. If not though I really can’t see why an organization that needs and or depends on donations and funding would reject an offer that allows 3000 students scholarships. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/8 "2014-06-06T14:24:47Z")
They should only turn it down if it will negatively affect their fundraising efforts towards others to the point that it will cost them more than what they are getting from them. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/9 "2014-06-06T14:27:00Z")
The LA chapter of the NAACP gave Donald Sterling of all people anti-racism awards \*twice \*- for the low, low price of $10 million apiece. Big-time fundraising sometimes requires keeping a straight face until the check clears. I wouldn’t blame the UNCF one bit for this. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/10 "2014-06-06T14:30:03Z")
Are the Kock brothers known for holding racist views? And I don’t mean that they favor policies that aren’t particularly friendly to poor people, but have they promoted white supremacy or advocated for segregation or called black people lazy and stupid, or…??? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/11 "2014-06-06T14:31:04Z")
They’re known for anti-\*science \*views, as you know, making contributions to any kind of colleges questionable. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/12 "2014-06-06T14:42:31Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > They’re known for anti-\*science \*views, as you know, making contributions to any kind of colleges questionable. I’d think that would be more of an incentive for them to take the money. Unless the Koch brothers are attaching some sort of strings on what subjects the recipients of the scholarships have to take (I actually don’t know what sorts of anti-science views you mean, but I assume it’s global warming), this is a way to use their money to educate 3000 new students and fight whatever ignorance they are putting out. Right? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/13 "2014-06-06T14:43:17Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > They’re known for anti-\*science \*views, as you know, making contributions to any kind of colleges questionable. David Koch has given at least $70 million to the American Museum of Natural History. I don’t think they have a problem with science unless they think it might cost them a dollar. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/14 "2014-06-06T14:45:13Z")
Right. Yes, the Kochs, with their massive fossil-fuel holdings, are the financiers of most of the denialist “movement” since ExxonMobil gave it up. But if - IF - there’s no strings attached, even as an understanding, money is money, and that’s a buttload of it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/15 "2014-06-06T14:46:12Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > They’re known for anti-\*science \*views, as you know, making contributions to any kind of colleges questionable. > [@XT](#): > > I’d think that would be more of an incentive for them to take the money. Unless the Koch brothers are attaching some sort of strings on what subjects the recipients of the scholarships have to take (I actually don’t know what sorts of anti-science views you mean, but I assume it’s global warming), this is a way to use their money to educate 3000 new students and fight whatever ignorance they are putting out. Right? I agree. Unless they stipulate curriculum changes or something like that, so what? One of them, at least, is a contributor to the PBS show NOVA, which is far and away the best science show on US TV and has been for years. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/16 "2014-06-06T15:00:02Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Should the United Negro College Fund turn down the gift from the Koch brothers? > > If I recall, there was a call for Catholic University of America to reject a $1 million donation they made last year. Should universities not accept students that are attending their school on a _Koch/UNCF_ scholarship? (post shortened) I believe that the UNCF and CUoA should ask those people and organizations who whine about the Koch bothers donating money to cough up a matching sum. Let the whiners put THEIR money where THEIR mouth is. Don’t just whine, make a difference. These absurd statements that YOU can’t take money from THEM because I don’t like them is, well, absurd. IMHO, of course. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/17 "2014-06-06T15:03:02Z")
Nobody’s whining about them donating money. :rolleyes: We’re questioning if there are strings attached, and what they are, a valid topic considering the pro-ignorance source of the money. Will the Kochs expect support of their agenda from the colleges, contrary to the colleges’ anti-ignorance mission? ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/18 "2014-06-06T15:35:51Z")
Well, in 2011 there was a [controversy](http://www.tampabay.com/news/business/billionaires-role-in-hiring-decisions-at-florida-state-university-raises/1168680) regarding a 1.5m donation to Florida State’s economics program. With that donation, > [@](#): > > “The contract specifies that an advisory committee appointed by Koch decides which candidates should be considered.” I don’t know if the blowback caused them to cease this practice or if this is their MO. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/19 "2014-06-06T16:03:12Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > Well, in 2011 there was a [controversy](http://www.tampabay.com/news/business/billionaires-role-in-hiring-decisions-at-florida-state-university-raises/1168680) regarding a 1.5m donation to Florida State’s economics program. With that donation, > > I don’t know if the blowback caused them to cease this practice or if this is their MO. No college worth the name should allow that practice. That a publicly funded university would do this is even more disturbing. ---
**Author:** ![LonghornDave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@LonghornDave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LonghornDave)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2014, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199/20 "2014-06-06T16:19:06Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > They’re known for anti-\*science \*views, as you know, making contributions to any kind of colleges questionable. Doesn’t it strike you as a little odd to call guys with master’s degrees in chemical engineering from MIT as anti-science? They’ve made their careers and fortunes in applied science; calling them anti-science sounds ludicrous. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-united-negro-college-fund-turn-down-the-gift-from-the-koch-brothers/690199.md?page=2)