# Should the US agree to take a share of the refugees trying to seek asylum in Europe? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 3, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864 "2015-09-03T23:04:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/1 "2015-09-03T23:04:52Z")
For at least the last year, we’ve been seeing refugees from Syria and other war-torn countries in the Middle East and Africa seek safety in Europe. Unfortunately, the EU seems, at best, unprepared or, at worst, openly hostile, to taking in such a large mass of people. As a result, there have been a number of tragic, horrific, and avoidable incidents like [the one that’s the subject of this BBQ thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=767117). Has the time come for the US to finally step up and agree to take in a significant share of these refugees? ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2015, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/2 "2015-09-03T23:22:50Z")
I don’t think the US is capable of letting in a large group of people all at once. Last year when all those children from South America were coming up the then current system was not ready and things got all wonky. If I remember right all of the kids are out of the detention centers but according to this: > **[Q&A: Unaccompanied children from Central America, one year later](https://www.tucsonsentinel.com/nationworld/report/082815_migrant_kids/qa-unaccompanied-children-from-central-america-one-year-later/)** > > In 2014, roughly 69,000 kids from El Salvador, Guatemala and Honduras flooded the U.S.-Mexico border, traveling alone at great personal peril. A year later, the number of unaccompanied children arriving at U.S. borders has dropped significantly. But... it says, > [@](#): > > 67,699 still had cases pending as of June . It also says that about 112,000 of these children have come up since 2012 so there are still more than half that need to go through the system and get sorted out. A lof of the kids had family they could go to, or went into the foster system, while they wait but I would think the amount of people fleeing the Middle East that have family here is a lot less than the kids. Also we don’t have a foster system for adults. Now if we spent the next six months and got programs in place and find places to house the people then I think we’d have a better system to accept the people. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/3 "2015-09-04T00:13:52Z")
We have our own economic and occasional war (Niceragua, El Slavador, Columbia) refugees to manage. We have been dealing with this in various ways. Let the Euros, who have been criticizing our methods for years, show us the way to open the borders to others openly and happily without having any significant negative impact. ---
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/4 "2015-09-04T00:55:22Z")
I have been thinking about this very thing, and yes the US should offer to bring in some number of refugees, absolutely. Any inability to process them is a lack of will, not capability. I am really saddened at the EU’s lack of ability on this matter, and as a nation that was made great by immigration, we should show some leadership on this issue. If we have administrative backlogs that’s a lack of will, not ability. ---
**Author:** ![Construct](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@Construct](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Construct)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/5 "2015-09-04T02:03:36Z")
No, the majority of refugees fleeing to Europe appear to be young and middle aged men, aka military aged males. There’s no reason Europe or America should take men too cowardly and weak to fight for their countries and their homelands. This is in addition, of course, to the fact that immigrants have low education, low IQ, high rates of crime, and a host of other undesirable characteristics. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find a group less deserving of American residency. The purpose of America is to ensure the best possible existence for Americans and their posterity. Syrians ruined their own country. Let’s not give them a chance to ruin ours. ---
**Author:** ![bb49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b38774/32.png) [@bb49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bb49)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/6 "2015-09-04T02:52:00Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > No, the majority of refugees fleeing to Europe appear to _ **be young and middle aged men, aka military aged males. There’s no reason Europe or America should take men too cowardly and weak to fight for their countries and their homelands.** _ > > This is in addition, of course, to the fact that immigrants have low education, low IQ, high rates of crime, and a host of other undesirable characteristics. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find a group less deserving of American residency. > > The purpose of America is to ensure the best possible existence for Americans and their posterity. Syrians ruined their own country. Let’s not give them a chance to ruin ours. My thoughts exactly, in bold italics. There are tens of thousands of refugees fleeing Iraq and Syria,and looking at the pictures, there appear to be a heck of a lot of young men capable of fitting for their country. If say 10,000 of these men had stayed home, joined the army and stood up to ISIS, that would have made a difference. Instead, the US, Canada and many other countries have to carry the load. Do any countries that take these refugees in really want the guys that in effect are cowards? Would these men pick up arms to defend their new country? This is what pisses me off about the war against ISIS and the refugee problem. ISIS is succeeding in chasing out everyone they don’t want. All that will be left in this god forsaken country will be ISIS supporters. And all the cowards and their families will be in our countries. The sooner ISIS can be defeated, the sooner this refugee crisis is over. If I were in the EU, I would grab every able bodied man, put him through basic training and ship him back to Syria. And when he defeats ISIS, then i would ship his family back to Syria to join him and rebuild their country. ---
**Author:** ![Construct](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@Construct](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Construct)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/7 "2015-09-04T03:26:04Z")
More than anything else, that’s what bothers me about the manufactured ‘refugee crisis’. Syrians, whether due to environmental, genetic, or cultural factors, don’t have a good track record of civilization. They aren’t (on average) the people you want as immigrants anyways. And then the best immigrants, the bravest and the most fearless, are fighting on the front lines or dead because their comrades deserted them. This destroys any shred of sympathy I have for most of the refugees. Let’s look at some numbers: ISIS has between [20,000 and 31,000 men](http://edition.cnn.com/2014/09/11/world/meast/isis-syria-iraq/), according to the CIA. There are over [275,000 Syrian refugees](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refugees_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War) already in Europe, summing up the figures for European countries on this page. [Germany alone expects 800,000 refugees this year.](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/aug/20/germany-raises-estimate-refugee-arrivals-800000) Let’s be generous and say that half of refugees are men (likely a gross underestimate), and half of these men are of fighting age. That means that there are at most 30,000 ISIS fighters, 68,000 Syrian men of military age in Europe already, and 268,000 Syrian men of military age in Europe expected by the end of this year. The United States and the rest of the West cannot afford to fight wars on behalf of cowardly men who enjoy overwhelming numerical superiority while these very men enjoy the creature comforts of life in the West. We don’t owe them anything. If they don’t have the courage to defend their homeland, they don’t deserve to keep it. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/8 "2015-09-04T07:45:43Z")
> [@bb49](#): > > My thoughts exactly, in bold italics. There are tens of thousands of refugees fleeing Iraq and Syria,and looking at the pictures, there appear to be a heck of a lot of young men capable of fitting for their country. If say 10,000 of these men had stayed home, joined the army and stood up to ISIS, that would have made a difference. So… you’re saying they should have fought for the Assad regime? The very regime they rebelled against in the first place? Or maybe they should have joined Hezbollah or other Iranian proxy forces? Fact is, there are no good sides in the Syrian civil war. Refusing to fight for either bunch of murderous thugs is a perfectly legitimate, and brave, decision. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/9 "2015-09-04T07:50:08Z")
Plus this whole thing would not have occurred without the unnecessary Mesopotamian misadventure a dozen years ago. Its not like the US does not have huge tracts of uninhabited land, what else is there to do with Wyoming anyway. Penance begins somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/10 "2015-09-04T07:55:38Z")
> [@bb49](#): > > If I were in the EU, I would grab every able bodied man, put him through basic training and ship him back to Syria. That could backfire if ISIS starts sending “refugees” to receive free military training from their enemies. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/11 "2015-09-04T08:24:32Z")
Germany has taken 800,000 in the past year. That’s a chunk. Maybe the USA should be excused from any moral, common humanitarian response to the crisis. It’s not like it sells itself as the shining beacon, in any way contributed to unrest in the relevant regions of the developing world or has any kind of proud history of taking in the dispossessed and oppressed. For the record, we now have small, dead children washing up. Those of a sensitive disposition should not click on this link and scroll down: > **[Photos of drowned Syrian boy spark debate on social media ethics | CBC News](https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/migrant-crisis-pictures-1.3212481)** > > On social media this week, wedged between selfies and posts about breakfast, are extremely graphic images of dead Syrian refugee children, their bodies washed ashore. One image in particular, of a tiny boy, has sparked an ethical debate: Does this go... ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/12 "2015-09-04T09:24:14Z")
Are any of the super wealthy oil rich arab states taking any of these refugees in? Shouldn’t they shoulder more if not all of the burden of these refugees? European leaders don’t have the right to the cultural annihilation of the hard fought values of western civilization by accepting mass immigration from people who do not have the shared cultural experience of secular western nations. Syrians aren’t going to magically become Germans just because they moved there. They will bring their third world attitudes with them with little hope of ever assimilating. If these “refugee” men of military age are cowards then the European leaders who allow it are doubly so. This won’t end well. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/13 "2015-09-04T09:51:29Z")
> [@DJ\_Motorbike](#): > > This won’t end well. It never does for refugees from the Levant in Germany. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/14 "2015-09-04T09:53:43Z")
If Russia wasnt so racist ans xenophobic that would be the perfect place for immigrants. They have a huge ammount of land and a relatively small population for its size. They could also use the cannon fodder. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/15 "2015-09-04T10:34:57Z")
> [@Construct](#): > > No, the majority of refugees fleeing to Europe appear to be young and middle aged men, aka military aged males. There’s no reason Europe or America should take men too cowardly and weak to fight for their countries and their homelands. > > This is in addition, of course, to the fact that immigrants have low education, low IQ, high rates of crime, and a host of other undesirable characteristics. In fact, you’d be hard pressed to find a group less deserving of American residency. > [@Construct](#): > > More than anything else, that’s what bothers me about the manufactured ‘refugee crisis’. Syrians, whether due to environmental, genetic, or cultural factors, don’t have a good track record of civilization. They aren’t (on average) the people you want as immigrants anyways. And then the best immigrants, the bravest and the most fearless, are fighting on the front lines or dead because their comrades deserted them. This destroys any shred of sympathy I have for most of the refugees. You do your “argument” no good when you simply resort to boiler-plate racist tropes that are not backed by even the most tenuous appeal to actual facts. Once, again, you appear to be simply posting to get a rise out of other posters and once again, I am going to issue you a Warning for trolling. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/16 "2015-09-04T10:47:28Z")
And, in case anyone thinks that Construct might have had a point with his nonsense, I will point to actual facts: Syrian immigrants [have a history of embracing education](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_American#Education). [Among the Syrians](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_American#Notable_people_and_contributions) who have demonstrated the “low education, low IQ, high rates of crime, and a host of other undesirable characteristics” have been Steve Jobs, Paul Orfalea, Louay M. Safi, (probably the reason Construct is so down on Syrians), and Fawwaz Ulaby. (Actually, I would think that Construct would be encouraging people like Wafa Sultan, but I do not expect consistency from Construct. ---
**Author:** ![Robert163](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/4af34b/32.png) [@Robert163](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robert163)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 10:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/17 "2015-09-04T10:51:16Z")
yes, we should help. we can debate to what degree to help but the main point is to help. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/18 "2015-09-04T11:29:50Z")
Just to offer a different perspective - whci may or not be politically pragmatic - Assad is now running out of resources, most significantly fighting men. There are suggestions Russian troops are on the ground because there is no other option now if the regime is to survive. Obviously ISIS is the main contributor in the battle against Assad. Not least because the US-led western initiatives have been stop-go and lost all credibility. If/when Assad falls, things look clearer for the millions of refugees waiting in Jordan and elsewhere - they may even gain faith in a collective opposition again. But right now, this is a biblical humanitarian catastrophe. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/19 "2015-09-04T14:12:25Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Its not like the US does not have huge tracts of uninhabited land, what else is there to do with Wyoming anyway. Well, yeah, but we can’t just stick a bunch of hungry people in the middle of a prairie or desert. They need food and shelter and medicine and so on. They might even want jobs and things. That means placing them in or near urbanized areas. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864/20 "2015-09-04T14:35:54Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Just to offer a different perspective - whci may or not be politically pragmatic - Assad is now running out of resources, most significantly fighting men. There are suggestions Russian troops are on the ground because there is no other option now if the regime is to survive. > > Obviously ISIS is the main contributor in the battle against Assad. Not least because the US-led western initiatives have been stop-go and lost all credibility. > > If/when Assad falls, things look clearer for the millions of refugees waiting in Jordan and elsewhere - they may even gain faith in a collective opposition again. > > But right now, this is a biblical humanitarian catastrophe. I have heard the same thing. Suppose Putin sends in crack troops (Specnaz); and orders them to completely destroy ISIS (and their supporters). Then Putin would become enormously popular-he would be hailed as a defender of civilization. He might also save the Syrian Christians. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-the-us-agree-to-take-a-share-of-the-refugees-trying-to-seek-asylum-in-europe/729864.md?page=2)