# Should viciously mocking the boss's wife be a firing offense? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 12, 2014, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295 "2014-05-12T19:07:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/81 "2014-05-13T22:56:25Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > They would have known somebody was around that corner and could hear what they were saying. But they wouldn’t have known it was the worst possible person without seeing Geoff. Anyway, after that first remark of LeMoyne’s, they were already in shit up to their ears, as Geoff would have to have been inhumanly, even angelically, charitable to let them off the hook. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/82 "2014-05-13T23:03:34Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > But they wouldn’t have known it was the worst possible person without seeing Geoff. Anyway, after that first remark of LeMoyne’s, they were already in shit up to their ears, as Geoff would have to have been inhumanly, even angelically, charitable to let them off the hook. Inhumanely, even angelically, charitable? Are you serious? People talk trash about other people all the time. It’s a fact of life. Ignoring someone talking behind your back when it’s nonsense (and has absolutely no real effect on anything in the world) is part of growing up and being an adult. Seriously, if you think Geoff is inhumanely, even angelically, charitable to let them off the hook, than I should have billionaire dollar temple as Queen of the Blessed Archangel Saints in that universe. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/83 "2014-05-13T23:10:08Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Inhumanely, even angelically, charitable? Are you serious? People talk trash about other people all the time. It’s a fact of life. Ignoring someone talking behind your back when it’s nonsense (and has absolutely no real effect on anything in the world) is part of growing up and being an adult. Seriously, if you think Geoff is inhumanely, even angelically, charitable to let them off the hook, than I should have billionaire dollar temple as Queen of the Blessed Archangel Saints in that universe. I’ve already written in the thread that I think firing them is dicey. But if you love your spouse, LeMoyne’s remarks are gonna fill you with rage, and at a minimum you’re gonna want to have a talking-to with the speaker. It’s human nature. I know I didn’t make it explicit that Geoff is not a Vulcan but I though it was implied. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2014, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/84 "2014-05-13T23:21:06Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I’ve already written in the thread that I think firing them is dicey. But if you love your spouse, LeMoyne’s remarks are gonna fill you with rage, and at a minimum you’re gonna want to have a talking-to with the speaker. It’s human nature. > > I know I didn’t make it explicit that Geoff is not a Vulcan but I though it was implied. 😉 It was implied that Geoff was a grown man who should be of sufficient maturity to know that getting enraged over an overheard conversation like that is ridiculous, not a 10-year old boy. If you think LeMoyne’s remarks were justisfication for Geoff making a scene (let alone talking any sort of petty revenge), I suppose you would be approve of me attacking any number of people (I’ve got some relatives and friends that aren’t exactly lookers.) ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/85 "2014-05-14T01:41:03Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Not going out of the way to help someone, is considerably different from maliciously firing someone for an incident that has nothing to do with how well they perform their job. I absolutely think a boss should have a lot rules about what they can and can’t do to their employees. It’s too easy for them to abuse and exploit people otherwise. Well let me ask you this. You’re Lemoyne and/or Patrice. What is your response to Geoff when he asks you why he should continue to put money in your pocket when you repay him by viciously mocking his wife? ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/86 "2014-05-14T01:47:34Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Not going out of the way to help someone, is considerably different from maliciously firing someone for an incident that has nothing to do with how well they perform their job. I absolutely think a boss should have a lot rules about what they can and can’t do to their employees. It’s too easy for them to abuse and exploit people otherwise. Ain’t nothing malicious about firing these two workers. They fucked up and got caught. Sucks to be them. Next time maybe don’t talk about someone’s wife where that someone might hear you and fire your ass. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/87 "2014-05-14T05:39:57Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Well let me ask you this. You’re Lemoyne and/or Patrice. What is your response to Geoff when he asks you why he should continue to put money in your pocket when you repay him by viciously mocking his wife? Because HE isn’t putting money in “my” pocket. The company is paying me a “just” compensation or portion of the profits that I bring to the company. Furthermore, I don’t think the two were mocking the wife…they were saying mean shit, but as she wasn’t there - she wasn’t being “mocked” (mock: to attack or treat with ridicule, contempt, or derision) Put me in the camp of they should be making apologies, but this is not a firable offense. Furthermore, even in an “at will” state I don’t think it’s good business practise for fire people for anything other than what they do in the workplace. ---
**Author:** ![Chicagojeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b19c9b/32.png) [@Chicagojeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicagojeff)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/88 "2014-05-14T06:37:32Z")
Funny Skald… a popular morning show here in Atlanta… (The Bert Show) had a call in slightly resembling this several months ago. A young lady called in and said that she received an email from her boss imploring the workers to make better use of their time and to encourage productivity. The young lady decided to send a nasty message to her buddy detailing how the boss (the email author) waste time all day doing things that are personal in nature and so forth. She of course… copied the email to her boss and all of the employees the original email went out too. She called the show to ask if they thought she had a chance to explain and apologize… the consensus was for her to get a Monster account and get the resume updated. She called back… she was fired five minutes after she came in monday morning… she never even had a chance to speak with her boss… this occurred I in Georgia… another at-will location… ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/89 "2014-05-14T06:51:30Z")
I resigned. I wasn’t fired. It was for the best. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/90 "2014-05-14T06:52:54Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Furthermore, even in an “at will” state I don’t think it’s good business practise for fire people for anything other than what they do in the workplace. So going on a killing spree means still having a job when they get out of prison? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/91 "2014-05-14T09:42:35Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > THAT is hugely unwise. Stephen works for Geoff, not the other way around. Geoff wasn’t asking a favor; he was giving an instruction. The most Stephen can do is, as Geoff’s friend rather than subordinate, possibly point out reasons firing them summarily is unwise. But if Geoff wants them gone, Stephen has to get rid of them. Aah, I misread the relative positions - I thought Stephen was the same level as Geoff, in charge of sales staff vs other stuff. > [@](#): > > And of course Stephen may not be about to counsel keeping them on anyway. He may be about to say, “Take your wife out to dinner tonight and leave a big tip so the waiter remembers you, and while you’re alibied I will gather three of our frat brothers and kick the crap out of LeMoyne.” I was joking with the Thunderdome stuff - you know this isn’t the type of response _my_ Stephen would ever give. > [@](#): > > I wouldn’t call either passive. Patrice seems to have been the instigator, but LeMoyne is the one who made the majority of the insults. Doesn’t really matter to me - agreeing with the insults is just as bad (never mind the “swallows” line)… Women can be misogynists too. > [@](#): > > Geoff only considers punching up LeMoyne because he, like me, has a strong inhibition against striking women. I totally have Patrice as a man’s name, I’m afraid. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/92 "2014-05-14T11:31:53Z")
> [@Oakminster](#): > > So going on a killing spree means still having a job when they get out of prison? Aside from a) employer no need to keep the job open for so long b) a criminal record is a game changer Yeah… Or to put it another way - Should someone be fired for being a cross dresser or an Elvis impersonator? Comments not directed to anyone at work, made out of work, at a non work function - not a firable offence (short of some obvious to find examples) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/93 "2014-05-14T12:33:32Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Should someone be fired for being a cross dresser or an Elvis impersonator? False equivalency. Neither of those is a negative, the way being a misogynist is. ---
**Author:** ![Chief\_Pedant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@Chief\_Pedant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chief_Pedant)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/94 "2014-05-14T12:44:39Z")
A private, non-workplace conversation between two consenting adults about a personal opinion on a topic (here; pulchritude) not significant for any legal implication is…a private conversation about a personal opinion. I am staggered that anyone thinks anything at all should come of it, other than the one who accidentally overhears it (privately) disagreeing with the opinion expressed. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/95 "2014-05-14T12:45:39Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Aside from > a) employer no need to keep the job open for so long > b) a criminal record is a game changer > > Yeah… > > Or to put it another way - > > Should someone be fired for being a cross dresser or an Elvis impersonator? > > Comments not directed to anyone at work, made out of work, at a non work function - > not a firable offence (short of some obvious to find examples) Aside from the wife, they were mocking the boss for having poor taste/being willing to have sex with an ugly woman. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/96 "2014-05-14T12:54:16Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Well let me ask you this. You’re Lemoyne and/or Patrice. What is your response to Geoff when he asks you why he should continue to put money in your pocket when you repay him by viciously mocking his wife? Geoff, you don’t put money in my pocket, I earn every cent of it. I do a darn good job for this company. What I do on my off-time is none of your business. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/97 "2014-05-14T12:59:15Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Aside from the wife, they were mocking the boss for having poor taste/being willing to have sex with an ugly woman. And who among us has not commented negatively about our boss’s tastes, intelligence, class, etc.? As long as they aren’t doing it on company time, the boss is an arsehole for taking out his insecurities on the people who work for him. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/98 "2014-05-14T12:59:49Z")
> [@bengangmo](#): > > Aside from > a) employer no need to keep the job open for so long > b) a criminal record is a game changer > > Yeah… > > Or to put it another way - > > Should someone be fired for being a cross dresser or an Elvis impersonator? > > Comments not directed to anyone at work, made out of work, at a non work function - > not a firable offence (short of some obvious to find examples) Is being a cross dresser or Elvis impersonator directly insulting the boss and potentially affecting workplace morale? This situation doesn’t need Edward Snowden to be leaked - it will be making the rounds by late Monday morning at the latest. Despite a natural tendency to want to sweep things under a proverbial rug and hope they go away, Geoff is better served by dealing with this directly and openly. I don’t think Geoff can sack Patrice (which I immediately took as a woman’s name, as I’ve known 2 or 3 Patrices and they were all women) without sacking LeMoyne. Without knowing more, I will assume sacking a top performer would be ‘cutting off one’s nose to spite one’s face’ - it will have negative repercussions back on Geoff. So when Geoff walks in, executioneer’s axe in hand, Stephen should counsel punishment, not beheading. Separate the two, send Patrice to a shit location, dial back on Geoff’s leads. But in no way, shape, or form is a boss wrong for axing someone for talking nasty shit about his/her family. It just might not be the smartest move. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/99 "2014-05-14T13:05:49Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > And who among us has not commented negatively about our boss’s tastes, intelligence, class, etc.? As long as they aren’t doing it on company time, the boss is an arsehole for taking out his insecurities on the people who work for him. I was responding to the argument that they weren’t talking about anyone at work, so it wasn’t work-related. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2014, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295/100 "2014-05-14T13:27:33Z")
> [@Chief\_Pedant](#): > > A private,[…]conversation No conversation held just outside a wedding venue, in the open, can reasonably be called “private”. Geoff heard their conversation without making any special attempt to do so - so they were speaking in public, IMO. (I should add that my mental picture includes them using that loud “Drunk Voice” but that’s my gloss, not the OP’s, and it’s irrelevant to the point) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-viciously-mocking-the-bosss-wife-be-a-firing-offense/688295.md?page=6)