# Should we replace Columbus Day with a Day Off For Election Day? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 19, 2018, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821 "2018-11-19T21:15:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2018, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/41 "2018-11-20T21:27:14Z")
Election day is a state holiday in NY and I’m a state employee- but I still don’t get the day off. It’s a 'floating holiday", which means the office stays open and I get a day off to take whenever. But NY also has a “time off to vote law” and employers are obligated to give up to 2 hours off with pay if the employee doesn’t have 4 hours either before or after work to vote , so that people who work 9-6 for example, can come in an hour late or leave an hour early and those who work 8am-8pm can come in 2 hours late or leave 2 hours early. Once you’ve made sure everyone has a four hour block to allow voting and travel to/from work, I’m not sure that giving the full day off increases the percentage of people voting. I know that when I worked for a city agency which did close on Election day, lots of people took Monday off and went away for the 4 day weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/42 "2018-11-21T04:16:32Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > Election day is a state holiday in NY and I’m a state employee- but I still don’t get the day off. It’s a 'floating holiday", which means the office stays open and I get a day off to take whenever. But NY also has a “time off to vote law” and employers are obligated to give up to 2 hours off with pay if the employee doesn’t have 4 hours either before or after work to vote , so that people who work 9-6 for example, can come in an hour late or leave an hour early and those who work 8am-8pm can come in 2 hours late or leave 2 hours early. That’s better than the holiday idea, but still looks like it leaves out a lot of people. Anyone working two jobs is SOL, since each job can point to four hours at the other job as off-duty time. Anyone classified as an independent contractor is SOL, because they’re not an employee. So it doesn’t actually make sure everyone has a four hour block free to vote, although it’s a good foundation. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/43 "2018-11-21T04:32:19Z")
> [@Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](#): > > In MN, the polls are open for either 12 or 13 hours. 7 AM to either 7 or 8 PM (I don’t remember which). So I have a hard time believing that there are a lot of people that can’t find time in there. > > Maybe it’s a time in lines issue. If so, then the answer isn’t giving government employees a day off (national holiday), it’s finding a way to reduce the lines. If voting takes 20 minutes, then there aren’t many people that can’t find time if they want too. > > I noticed this year that some of polling places closed at what seemed an early time. 5 or 6 PM. That seems like it would make voting hard, for someone with a longer commute and working an 8 to 5 job. So why not extend hours, and standardize them? > > Polls open from 6 AM to 9 PM, for the whole country, and fixing the issues that create lines, so voting takes 30 minutes or less. Those 2 should eliminate most problems that people want to vote have. Can’t do a whole lot about people that are away from home that day, except early and absentee voting. All Minnesota polling places are open 13 hours, from 7am to 8pm. (And later; the polls will stay open until the last person in line at 8pm has voted. In 2008, our polling place didn’t finish voting till nearly 9:30pm.) None of them should have closed at 5 or 6pm. Long, slow lines are generally related to machines, and a limited number of them. In Minnesota, we vote on paper ballots, so lines are unlikely. Our polling place has spaces for 26 voters at once, and we could easily add 24 more if needed. (The states where they use electronic machines seem like long lines would be almost inevitable, as this limits the number of people voting at once, and is probably slower than a paper ballot.) The only places we ever have lines is at the sign-in (we are now using electronic poll books to replace the paper sign-in books), but with 4-6 available it goes fast, and sometimes a line at the tally machine where people insert their completed ballot (but at about 10 seconds each that’s not a long line). ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/44 "2018-11-21T04:51:08Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I’m kind of “meh” about it. It’s not a bad idea, but it’s not really a good idea either. I think people have already pointed out the reasons. I think it would have very little effect on the elections, and would probably be more effective if we had elections on Wed to avoid the 4-day weekend issue. Eliminating Columbus Day would, of course, cause quite a bit of outrage-- some real, some recreational. > > Gotta keep it away from the weekend, though, as you run into religious issues and/or getting poll workers to work. Well aren’t you a wet sandwich?? ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/45 "2018-11-21T09:19:44Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > Ehh, school is a relative term I’ve got a 3 week old and a 3 year old. While, yes, the three year old can behave in public it took me and hour to fill out my ballet at home I wouldn’t want to have to watch her in public while looking up the specifics of the judges I’m voting for. For those of you wondering, yes the Montessori school for the 3 year old and the day care for the baby close for every holiday they can justify as well as in service days and both use the local public school calendar. You can’t look up the judges at any point after the ballot comes out? And you and your wife can’t take turns watching the kids while the other one runs out to vote? ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 9:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/46 "2018-11-21T09:56:40Z")
> [@Eva\_Luna](#): > > You can’t look up the judges at any point after the ballot comes out? And you and your wife can’t take turns watching the kids while the other one runs out to vote? Sure, but why should he have to have all those hurdles put up in front of him? Who will actually benefit? Maybe there’s evidence that it would be better on balance, but in the absence of that, this reminds me of how voter ID supporters hand-wave away all the concerns about their hobby horse. If people without ID _really_ wanted to vote they’d find a way to get to the DMV before election day, etc. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/47 "2018-11-21T12:12:15Z")
Could I tentatively ask what the current issue is? In the UK, voting is always on a Thursday, but the hours are so long (7am-10pm) that you’d be hard pushed to say you couldn’t make it to the polling station. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/48 "2018-11-21T12:19:57Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > Sure, but why should he have to have all those hurdles put up in front of him? Who will actually benefit? Maybe there’s evidence that it would be better on balance, but in the absence of that, this reminds me of how voter ID supporters hand-wave away all the concerns about their hobby horse. If people without ID _really_ wanted to vote they’d find a way to get to the DMV before election day, etc. It’s impossible to eliminate every hurdle - even all mail-in voting is going to have some sort of registration process. And some hurdles aren’t worth eliminating - I have no problem with the idea of early voting or voting by mail but if you tell me you didn’t vote because your kids’ school was closed and how could you possibly be expected to know who you were going to vote for before you arrived at the polls, I’m going to assume you weren’t all that interested in voting. It’s really not the same the voter iD thing- because the objections so far as I can tell with the ID are based on the need to pay for the ID or to get copies of the documents needed to get the ID or refusal to accept other forms of besides those issued by the DMV. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/49 "2018-11-21T12:36:28Z")
Back to the topic, I think Columbus Day is a stupid holiday anyway, less to do with how much a bouchedag Columbus was or empathy for the native tribes, which would be overlookable in the face of celebrating a huge breakthrough. He discovered jack squat. He wasn’t the first European in the New World, he didn’t realize it was the New World, and boaters around the Bering Sea went back and forth across the strait all the time like it was no big deal. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/50 "2018-11-21T13:03:43Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > Could I tentatively ask what the current issue is? In the UK, voting is always on a Thursday, but the hours are so long (7am-10pm) that you’d be hard pushed to say you couldn’t make it to the polling station. Part of it is a matter of size and population density. The UK feels superdense to this Spaniard; the majority of the US feels like “why do they have so much space between houses? 😕 No wonder they use the car for everything!” You probably can walk to your polling place; mine is a whole 120m from my house (if the Library) or 300m (if City Hall); there are less than 40 adults in town who don’t live within walking distance of whichever polling place has been chosen that time. There are counties in the US where the place with the highest population density didn’t even have a polling place in the recent election and where “public transportation” is some vague concept heard in movies. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/51 "2018-11-21T13:07:34Z")
So, reading through the thread again, I see these issues: This is the biggest one: 1. Those who can’t take time off to vote now (hourly workers, service workers) will still likely have that problem. It may even get worse for service workers, since they may have to work extra to accommodate those people who do get the day off. Those who can easily vote now (government workers, union members, salaried white collar workers) will vote just as easily, maybe easier. So, making it a holiday seemingly does nothing to solve the problem and may make it worse. These are smaller problems: 1. For many, possibly most, voters, the primary is really the day that matters. This was true for Ocasio-Cortez voters, for example. It’s not like New York is really going to send a Republican Senator or Utah a Democratic one. This is even more true at the House level, where many candidates are either actually or effectively unopposed. And, with much lower turnout for the primaries, your vote matters much more. 2. If it’s still on a Tuesday, a four day weekend may make turnout worse. 3. If the post offices are closed, mail-in and absentee ballots will be even more delayed. 4. Veteran’s day is the following week – will they both remain holidays? This won’t be like Thanksgiving or Christmas where almost every place closes. Those are family holidays. It will be like President’s Day or Labor Day, where people take the day to do some shopping, go out to eat, and, maybe take a few minutes to vote. So, **RitterSport** , what’s your big idea? Well, weekends seem to be out. How about the Feds help the States set up 100% mail-in voting, which some states already do. States who do that will get some Federal aid to get the process up and running. I mentioned this above, but the first problem is something that Ocasio-Cortez should really understand, since I think she just came from the service industry. **Czarcasm** , given this thread, have you changed your position at all? ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/52 "2018-11-21T13:59:35Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > Sure, but why should he have to have all those hurdles put up in front of him? Who will actually benefit? Maybe there’s evidence that it would be better on balance, but in the absence of that, this reminds me of how voter ID supporters hand-wave away all the concerns about their hobby horse. If people without ID _really_ wanted to vote they’d find a way to get to the DMV before election day, etc. There isn’t much info about judges or any other candidate actually printed on the ballot, and so as electioneering in or near the polling place is forbidden, presumably he is looking up the info somewhere online. I can’t fathom why one would want to do that in a tiny, uncomfortable voting booth anyway. Seems to me it would be less of a “hurdle” to do the research anywhere but there. ---
**Author:** ![UCBearcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/77aa72/32.png) [@UCBearcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UCBearcats)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2018, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821/53 "2018-11-21T14:23:37Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Back to the topic, I think Columbus Day is a stupid holiday anyway, less to do with how much a bouchedag Columbus was or empathy for the native tribes, which would be overlookable in the face of celebrating a huge breakthrough. He discovered jack squat. He wasn’t the first European in the New World, he didn’t realize it was the New World, and boaters around the Bering Sea went back and forth across the strait all the time like it was no big deal. This isn’t the topic. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-we-replace-columbus-day-with-a-day-off-for-election-day/824821.md?page=2)