Swa hit= So it = it is so / let it be so.
The first guy who runs for president and promises to abolish the POA has my vote. Our schoolkids turn into North Koreans for about 20 seconds every day.
Well the Pledge was originally devised by a socialist… Incidentally, this was how the Pledge was done in the old days: http://forgottenhistoryblog.com/the-official-american-flag-salute-used-to-be-a-hitler-salute/
I don’t think true patriots need to trumpet their beliefs and loyalty loudly for public consumption. They are qualities best lived: not recited, rote and routine.
Like this?
http://chicbuying.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Hunter-boots-Union-Jack-special-edition.jpg
I don’t know, I can’t tell if those are from UK retailers. I’ve seen American retailers sell stuff like that.
But I’d especially like to know if other countries combine religion and patriotism into everything-about-me-centric crap like the Americana Freedom Cross. Jesus doesn’t fucking love America that much, people, stfu.
The “under god” was added when I was in HS and from that forward, I have never recited it. No one ever noticed.
“Amen” is the standard ending to prayers in a religion that specifically proscribes worshipping images.
The flag is the prime symbol of a country that specifically proscribes mixing religion and law.
I may have my issues with both organized religions and the implementation of patriotism, but even I find the practice breathtakingly offensive to both.
(This from a strong environmentalist, since the days we were conservationists, who leaves the porch light burning all night because it shines on the flag my neighbor never takes in or illuminates.)
And no-one can say the French are not proud of their country.
Another strong religious virtue, praying in the back of the temple.
While I happily will listen to “An American Child” and “An American Saturday Night”.
A lot of people especially in the South say “Amen” to mean an emphatic yes sort of like the German “Jawohl!”.
Don’t get me started.
Too late.
Are these the same people who leave their flags flying all night without a light? And until it’s a tattered mess? And then throw it out? Because, flag-burning is a sin, right?
Damn it, I do not worship the American flag, but if you’re going to do something, do it right, and respect what a symbol stands for in the first place.
A few years ago, I got a temporary federal job for a department that was about to shut down. One of the final steps in the extraordinarily long and complicated initiation process was to take a loyalty oath…which ended in “so help me God”.
I’ll be honest…I was stunned. I’ve never had to say that in my life, and I grew up with the secure knowledge that this wasn’t Iran and we were not required to bow down to the Invisible Space Fairy*, least of all a federal worker. But I needed the work, and, heck, I made it that far. I decided to go with it, serve out my term, and then raise a big stink about it if so inclined. As it turns out, the job would present me with far greater hassles than some mildly inappropriate phrasing, and when it was over, I was too busy looking for new work to bother.
Anyway, bible-thumpers will be bible-thumpers. The whole point of the Pledge is loyalty, so I don’t find using it as a proselytization vehicle much of a stretch.
I do find it a bit odious that it’s essentially forced on people powerless to challenge it, but in all honesty, I can’t remember a single kid who was affected by it at all. And hey, if you want to improve schoolkids’ attitude, there are about 20 things you need to address before some stupid meaningless chant.
- I’m sorry, but I just can’t dig “Flying Spaghetti Monster”…it’s such a non-sequitur that it doesn’t even register.
You have the occasional kid who refuses to say the “under God” part and gets ostracized by teachers and students alike, and of course beaten up while the teachers look the other way.
Beaten up for not saying the pledge?
At the public school I went to nobody would have cared if a kid didn’t want to say the pledge at all. Well, we didn’t say it anyway, but maybe they did in the younger grades, I don’t know (I didn’t start there until 8th grade but it was a K-12 school). It was a very non-religious, non-blindly patriotic school.
At my Catholic schools though, I don’t think not saying it would have been allowed. It’s not so much that they were so into patriotism as it is that they were so into conformity and obedience. Plus the pledge was said at the same time as morning prayers, and I know you couldn’t have opted out of that.
At my daughter’s public school they say it every Monday but there’s an explicit rule that you don’t have to say it if you don’t want to, but you do have to stand up. She says some kids don’t say it, and it’s not an issue.
Stupid that it’s ever said at all though, in my opinion.
Is there something it actually says that you disagree with? Is there any pledge you would say? To the Constitution, perhaps? To Obama? To the UN?
:rolleyes:
Cite?
Odd of you to pick that particular comparison, then.
Hi. I was that kid.
I think nationalism and patriotism are counterproductive forces, which the pledge reinforces.
I think our constitution is outdated, and that we need a new one, so no to that, too.
Shit. All this time I’ve been saying “gesundheit” after the pledge.
The Pledge itself comes to mind; the whole point of adding “under God” to it and keeping it there is to underline the general assumption that patriotic = Christian.
Well, to be fair, God did tell the Christians they own America. It’s in the bible somewhere.
You understand that the flag is no different from any other mass-produced piece of cloth, right? It’s not hurting anyone or anything if the flag gets frayed around the edges, or left out overnight. What’s going to happen - the America-ness is going to leak out of a hole in the flag? The vengeful gods of mindless jingoism will forever haunt a garbage can in which a flag is disposed of?