Hmmm. Now, I was never, ever physically bullied, only harassed and tormented, so I don’t think being taught to fight would’ve done me much good (other than the possible self-esteem increase), unless there exists a point where you think non-physical bullying does necessitate a physical response… (In my case, I see a good chance I would have been expelled without question had I done such a thing, but that’s just me and my school.)
You’re lucky. I got my arm broken for fun. Perpetrators never even got a scolding. It’s very simple: Bullies deserve the hardest, nastiest, most vicious throwdown that can ever be mustered against them. They have chosen their path and deserve no more mercy than what they show their victims.
My little sister was having problems for a while with some of the boys from her school, verging on sexual harassment (or as close as it comes from 6th graders). I taught her the fastest ways to hurt a boy so that she could run to a teacher or police officer. If she ever gets into the situation where she needs it, she knows that her fingers go into his eyes and her knee goes to his balls.
I wouldn’t normally kick a guy in the nuts, but I made damn sure my sister knows to. She hasn’t had to yet and I hope she never does.
My mother wasn’t too happy with what I told my sister, but she didn’t argue either.
I was harrassed all throughout elementary and middle schools, but I was physically hurt only once. I was on the floor retrieving a pencil I’d dropped, in fifth grade, and this fellow hit me hard on the head; it made me dizzy for a few seconds. I scraped him across the face with my pencil as a reward. Heh. The dickwad deserved it, but I’m really surprised nobody got sued. I very well could’ve taken out his eye.
So nobody really messed with me in a hand-to-hand altercation. There was a period during which I poked people - hard - with a pencil or pen whenever they started teasing me. Violence is definitely the answer, occasionally, though I don’t condone my specific actions now.
(I was an interesting child.)
Probably my last post here 
I believe I have the experience on this matter that many lack.
I was unbelieveably picked on when I was in 6th-8th grade. In general, the advice given above is correct but not always. Teach your kid to fight back, stand up for themselves. If they stand up for themselves and fight back then they will be left alone etc.
One observation:
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You are only respected and left alone if you fight back * with some effectiveness*. If you fight back with no danger to your attackers it will just bring them on more as you are amusing. Most fights are avoidable before they start if you appear confident and they believe you can actually hurt them.
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Many of these fights can turn out to be ‘real’ and not kid fights where there are bruises/black eyes or even broken noses.
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I lived in a violent area. Funny, because it was western North Dakota. My parents almost moved to Minneapolis when I was younger and I was scared to death because if rural ND is rough…I could just imagine what a city was like. (little did I know that it would have been much better)
I was small for my age though people always said I was stronger than I looked and real fast. Starting in 5th grade the fights started. They reached a fever pitch in 7th grade. I suffered scars, bruises, broken nose, concussions, sprains etc. I am still VERY pissed that school teachers did nothing…school administrators did nothing. My PARENTS did hardly nothing (!) Their attitude was that I needed to get tougher.
In 7th grade I started ‘training myself’ especially between 7th and 8th grade in the summer. I lifted weights. Spent time chasing chickens (learned from a movie :P). I ran and ran and ran. Punched bags. I did this all day every day.
Come first day of school 8th grade and I was jumped on by a normal bully. We tussled and I came out somewhat better. Then another. It seemed to be working as people started leaving me alone.
Then came Allen. Allen was a huge brute for Jr. high. Strangely enough he usually left me alone but he came after me that day. We started fighting and he hit me so damn hard to my scalp about 3" above my right eye (I still have the scar). He hurt his hand and stood there cursing. I recovered and (also from a movie) flung a handful of dirt in his eyes. (this tactic hardly ever works btw because they see it coming and block it). He was distracted and it worked.
I then got up, and kicked him hard in the head. He went down and I proceeded to kick him again and again. Playground supervisors eventually took me away.
Allen was in the hospital for days. I had a concussion. I learned when I was older that I was almost sent away. I do remember seing judges and experts and such. Only Allen’s size compared to me, eyewitnesses and my history of being bullied kept me from being sent. Even so, I had to spend the next three years seeing headshrinkers.
I was left alone (except for one notable time in 11th grade) but it was a ‘leave him alone he’s crazy’ type of thing. This was fine by me.
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If you’ve read this far you must realize that fights, even among kids, are best avoided. You can suffer injuries and scars that don’t go away. Teeth knocked out and so on.
Yes, your kid needs to learn to stand up for himself and fight if necessary but do not think these fights will always be little tussles.
And, for the love of God, do not ever think your kid needs to ‘get tougher’ and act that way. You may think it and encourage martial arts and such but if you leave your kid to his own devices don’t be surprised if he comes up with a way to fight back. He might not chose my way but instead find his own way. That way may lie the way of Columbine.
I think its probably a good idea to fight back, but I would stress that any response has to be instant, otherwise you are sanctioning cold-blooded revenge which is no good.
I’m not too happy about the idea of teaching kids a martial art (unless it is soft). Knowing a martial art only makes you more likely to get into fights which is not a good thing unless you want to bring up your kid as defender of the realm.
I was brought up in the school of “never throw the first punch, just the last.” I developed the art of responding to bullies with a cleverly humorous sarcastic remark.
As you can imagine, I had the crap beat out of me at regular intervals. Not being willing to throw the first punch puts you at a definite tactical disadvantage.
My wife, as a schoolteacher, firmly believes that violence, particularly on the playground, solves nothing.
I find it interesting, however, that she did take self-defense courses, and had our daughter do the same.
The problem I see with self-defense is that the only way I believe a bully will actually stop is not just if you stand up for yourself, but only if you manage to pound the bully into the ground. The romanticized “good fight, now let’s be friends” concept is pure fantasy.
So in the real world, my advice would be not to get into a fight unless you can win it. And if both you and the bully figured you could win it, the bully would have found someone else in the first place.
I think there’s middle ground, between the two examples you gave. I’ve seen bullies lose face by picking on someone their own size, and failing to massacre them. They weren’t necessarily bested, but it was enough to make the bully become a source of ridicule, rather than a source to be feared. I’m sure this probably varies, but I think there’s room for something in between being friends and putting someone into the hospital.
I got into very few altercations over the course of my educational career. I’m told by some that other folks around the school were intimidated by me, but I’m not sure if I should believe that.
This being said, I have one or two relevant incidents that spring to mind.
While I believe that you must fight back if attacked, it is often most effective to, if possible, allow the nuisance to harm themselves.
Two examples that spring to mind …the first… the kid in question as not a bully, but he delighted in annoying me. I think it was some sort of geek-rivalry thing, but his motives remain unfathomable to me. One day he was walking along behind me in the hall, babbling inanities, with the purpose of ticking me off. I walk faster, he walks faster. So I stop. Suddenly. He bounces off my backpack, falling on his butt.
He learned not to do that.
The second kid (well, teenager) had more of the bully’s demeanor, but still, I wouldn’t call him much more than a nettling brat. He’d taken a dislike to me, and since we were both in the High School band, he decided to express his frustrations musically. As a trumpet player, he was in the row behind me, and the other Sax players. He positioned himself carefully as we prepared to play some-piece-or-other, and when the music started, he began playing loudly. Into my ear.
I suddenly decide that I need to brush an imaginary fly away from my ear, and pop! … I whacked the bell of his trumpet and he suffered the indignity of a busted lip. And that’s the end of that chapter.
People shouldn’t invade my personal space and annoy me. I’m wily and unpredictable. 
Has there been some sort of study I’m unaware of? Is this why there are so many rumbles outside the local Karate America?
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My son is now five. When he was four, he got into a fight with a kid at his daycare. My kid said, “My Dad said it is ok to hit back if someone hits you first!” The other kid said his dad told him that it was never ok to hit someone.They proceeded to get into a fight and wouldn’t talk to each other for a couple weeks.
Funny no one brought the “… turn the other cheek”. Seems the good “christians” aren’t much into it afterall.
I figure there isn’t a clear answer to this dilemma. Hitting back might just ensure getting beaten up then and there… or in the future. People don’t lose face easily. Not reacting makes you a further target as well. Ratting to a teacher makes you a “pussy” too.
I think its better to have some kind of lawfullness beyond “hit back”. Children need to learn to get along… but if they have to walk around in number to ensure their integrity its a step away from gang fighting. Soon enough the would be harrased become the new bullies if they get a big enough gang too.
Teaching self defense is always good though. More against rapists or muggers than Bullies I would say… but in an emergency its a must have. Close adult supervision is a must have too. As for the OP I would say we shouldn’t teach kids to hit back. That was how Mike Tyson started. Some kids took the money he was going to the groceries and crying he went to his mother. She gave him a big stick and told him to get it back. He has been hitting people in and out the ring ever since.
When my younger son began school he found himself in a difficult situation, One of the other children persuaded his friends to pick fights with my son. This was understandable because my son was much bigger than the other kids. I discussed it with my two sons and the elder brother suggested that it would be best to confront the instigator and “beat the shit out of him” and promise to keep doing it until he was left alone. This approach worked instantaneously, no-one ever touched him again.
This is the kind of thing that makes life so wonderfully interesting.
It also puts things into perspective - kids will always find something to fight about, so we as parents, teachers, responsible adult types, should be prepared to deal with it.
Rashak Mani: While I can’t speak for the other posters, I never claimed to be a “good Christian,” then or now.
If God wants me to be a martyr, he can tell me so himself (that statement probably excludes me from the category of “good Christian”).
We taught our boys to keep their hands and feet to themselves. That hitting is not the mature solution to a disagreement or problem. However, like others in the thread have mentioned we did encounter a prolonged period of bullying that began in the 5th grade where the teachers and administrators were unwilling or unable to do anything.
At our first meeting with the teacher she said she our child was well behaved and had never made it known when there was a problem. We told him then and there in front of her that the next time someone poked, shoved, punched, pinched or tripped him, he be very loud and say, “Stop (insert offensive action here) right now!” The next call we had was from the school that he was disrupting class because he was doing as the teacher suggested and we instructed. So we took it up the line to the administrators, this went on for weeks and weeks with meetings with adminitrators or teachers on Monday mornings or during the week. Eventually the administrator admitted that they had done all they could do including meeting with the offending childrens parents and they felt nothing further could be done. We withdrew him from school that day.
The next year in the new school within a few weeks of the beginning of the year an 8th grader cornered our now 6th grader and backed him into a wall.There were no teachers or coaches around, as usual for “when bullies strike”. There were however a few other students. Our son fought back with a hard uppercut that missed the chin and caught the head taller, heavier, older boy on the nose. He fell to the ground weeping and our son was not physically assaulted again.
Was it the most mature way or best way for him to handle it? No, most likely not, but it was effective and he’s no longer a target for kids who get their jollies off of hurting others.
The interesting thing is this; when he has had something happen that was a teenage “disagreements” with other young men, he didn’t have to resort to fists to “solve” the problem.
My point being, fists are not for solving disagreements, but sometimes you must use them to protect yourself from the irrational assaults of bullies.
Not much debating here really.
Teach 'em how to protect their own bodies, and how to recognize when their bodies are endangered.
Not much more to it.
Yes, teach them to hit back. Also teach them when to hit first.
FWIW, I remember a scholarly explanation of this that puts it in a different light. The idea behind the quote was that it referred to a situation where you were back-handed (which today would be a universal insult). By turning the other cheek you are standing up for yourself as an equal.
I’m pleasantly surprised to see so many supporter’s of the “hit back” philosophy. Even if the bully kicks the shit out of your kid, they generally won’t do it again --if your kid fought back. They’ll have respect for your kid just for trying.
I agree that if a child is unable to depend upon authority to maintain order then that child has every right to defend him/herself. What I am amazed at is the Wildwest attitude embraced here. Whatever happened to holding the teachers, administrators, and schoolboard responsible? I have seen but a few proponents of the parents getting involved.
If you want children to submit to authority later in life, you had better teach them to defer to authority early in life. It is the parents responsibility to insure that the authority (administration, teachers, etc.) is good.
So the proper response to a bully for a child, is the proper response to a bully as an adult. Do whatever it takes to get away with the minimal damage to one’s self and property (whether it be walk-away, kick, bite, scratch) —whatever is minimally necessary to remove one’s self from the situation. Secondly report, report report. Tell the parent, teacher, principal. If the Authority figure is unwilling to take action, it is the PARENT’s FAILURE not the child’s. I can’t believe all of the responses that promote such a laissez-faire attitude and/or might makes right.
Stop blaming the kids (victims) for being bullied, blame the adults in charge.
Just adding my agreement to the prevailing theme to hit back. You’ll gain a large measure of respect, the bullying will stop, and the S.O.B. probably deserves the bloody nose/black eye/etc.
I think Teddy Roosevelt said it best, “Don’t hit at all if it is honorably possible to avoid hitting; but never hit soft.”