# Should women have to register for Selective Service? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 19, 2018, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361 "2018-12-19T11:27:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/1 "2018-12-19T11:27:27Z")
In the USA, only men can potentially be drafted into the military against their will. How is that fair? Isn’t it blatantly sexist to only force men to fight if the need arises? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/2 "2018-12-19T11:28:15Z")
Yup. Write your congressperson. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/3 "2018-12-19T11:34:07Z")
No. Women should not have to register for Selective Service. Making it fair would be not requiring young men to, either. ---
**Author:** ![JB99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JB99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JB99)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/4 "2018-12-19T12:21:44Z")
All combat roles are now open to women. So you either draft both genders, or you abolish it entirely. One cannot argue for equal representation in the armed forces and simultaneously support the single gender draft. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/5 "2018-12-19T12:30:30Z")
> [@elfkin477](#): > > No. Women should not have to register for Selective Service. Making it fair would be not requiring young men to, either. Yes, this. Why do you still have draft registration in the US at all? ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/6 "2018-12-19T12:35:03Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > Yes, this. Why do you still have draft registration in the US at all? Basically because it’s the last surviving icon of when Men were Men and women folk knew their place. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/7 "2018-12-19T12:47:58Z")
No. Registration should have been wound down no later than the end of the Cold War. It’s a wasteful relic and there’s no conceivable reason to double the number of people who are subjected to draconian consequences for being ignorant of the registration requirement. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/8 "2018-12-19T12:58:45Z")
To clarify, I agree that it is sexist. Requiring all citizens to register or none is a more equitable solution. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/9 "2018-12-19T13:04:42Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Basically because it’s the last surviving icon of when Men were Men and women folk knew their place. It’s not even that old. The president who instituted the current registration requirement is still alive, and it was understood to be pointless and wasteful\* at the time (Ronald Reagan, who was no dove, even campaigned on abolishing it, though he failed to actually do so). - [DRAFT REGISTRATION STARTS TO LOOK OBSOLETE – Chicago Tribune](https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1991-11-17-9104140291-story.html) > [@](#): > > Robert Pirie, then the Pentagon`s manpower chief, recalled, ‘‘We had a study at that time that said from a standing start we could register everybody needed within a two-week period.’’ > > The timing was mostly symbolic. ‘‘Carter did it to send a signal of U.S. resolve, that we weren`t going to get kicked around by the Soviets,’’ Pirie said. > > The Selective Service was brought out of cold storage in January 1980, and draft registration began six months later. > > ‘‘There was no immediate military benefit to be gained,’’ said Bernard Rostker, who revived the agency as Carter`s Selective Service director. The original concept for improving the military`s mobilization capability did not include peacetime registration. ---
**Author:** ![l0k1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bb73d2/32.png) [@l0k1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/l0k1)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/10 "2018-12-19T13:26:07Z")
Don’t forget, keeping the Selective Service System up and running cost $23 million a year. I was 11 1/2 months old the last time we used them, and I’m 44. Abolish it. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/11 "2018-12-19T13:35:36Z")
> [@JB99](#): > > All combat roles are now open to women. So you either draft both genders, or you abolish it entirely. One cannot argue for equal representation in the armed forces and simultaneously support the single gender draft. We’re not drafting anyone, and most likely never will. Massive numbers of soldiers doesn’t make sense anymore. The only solution that makes sense is to abolish Selective Service registration completely. But from a fairness standpoint this is basically a red herring. It’s an annoyance for young men that should be eliminated, but it’s never going to impact anyone’s life in a meaningful way. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/12 "2018-12-19T13:43:48Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > It’s an annoyance for young men that should be eliminated, but it’s never going to impact anyone’s life in a meaningful way. [Except these people:](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/storyline/wp/2014/10/16/america-may-never-have-a-draft-again-but-were-still-punishing-low-income-men-for-not-registering/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.d11e15e62b10) > [@](#): > > The odds of this country returning to a draft are almost zero, but the price for failure to register is high and is largely born by the men who can ill afford to pay it: high school dropouts, disconnected inner city residents, ex-offenders and immigrants — legal and unauthorized — who do not know that failure to register can jeopardize citizenship. In other words, those precisely in need of the type of job training, education and citizenship opportunities that could help move them from the margins to the mainstream. > > In California, the Selective Service System estimates, men who failed to register were denied access to more than $99 million in federal and state financial aid and job training benefits between 2007 and April of this year. Pennsylvania, New Jersey and Massachusetts saw $35 million in combined lost benefits between 2011 and spring 2014. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/13 "2018-12-19T13:50:45Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > But from a fairness standpoint this is basically a red herring. It’s an annoyance for young men that should be eliminated, but it’s never going to impact anyone’s life in a meaningful way. That’s probably true, but the logic of it cuts both ways. If registration is trivial and won’t impact anyone’s life, then it wouldn’t hurt women to be required to register, too. Besides which, there are certain things which don’t have much direct impact on our lives, but are still criticized for the message that they send. Even if no man is drafted, requiring only them to register sends an unfair message. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/14 "2018-12-19T14:01:48Z")
I’m for getting rid of the selective service. But if it’s required, it ought not to discriminate based on gender, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/15 "2018-12-19T14:01:55Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > That’s probably true, but the logic of it cuts both ways. If registration is trivial and won’t impact anyone’s life, then it wouldn’t hurt women to be required to register, too. Yes, but if you’re going to make a change in a useless system the correct change is to eliminate it, not expand it. Registration is mostly trivial but implementation has costs. And I wasn’t aware of some of the painful impacts mentioned by **Lord Feldon** , that alone should argue for eliminating the whole system rather than expanding it. Inequalities in the system should be removed, but it’s not necessary to impose unneeded burdens on everyone to make things fair. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/16 "2018-12-19T14:41:32Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Yes, but if you’re going to make a change in a useless system the correct change is to eliminate it, not expand it. Registration is mostly trivial but implementation has costs. And I wasn’t aware of some of the painful impacts mentioned by **Lord Feldon** , that alone should argue for eliminating the whole system rather than expanding it. > > Inequalities in the system should be removed, but it’s not necessary to impose unneeded burdens on everyone to make things fair. I would tend to agree that Selective Service registration has been essentially useless for decades, and will probably remain so. But that’s not really the topic of the thread. The question posed by the OP is that since we do have a Selective Service System, should it register women as well as men? ---
**Author:** ![senoy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@senoy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/senoy)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/17 "2018-12-19T14:44:04Z")
Eh, I’m older and score high on the benevolent sexism graph, so I guess I’m one of those people standing in the way of such things. I don’t know, I’ve always felt women should be able to do whatever they want to do including combat roles, but not be forced to do anything they would rather not including combat roles. I guess I’d rather men not be forced either, but if you have to make a choice, men are more expendable. We’ve always died earlier due to violence. It might be that I’m a country boy. I’ve had to slit my share of animal throats and shoot more than one. It’s a dirty job that I’d rather my wife not have to do if she doesn’t want to. Not that she couldn’t do it if she did enjoy it, but I don’t like the idea of anyone making her and killing a person has got to be harder than killing a pig or deer mentally, though I’ve never killed a person to know. I guess what it really comes down to is that if they drafted my boys, I’d mourn it, but accept it. If they drafted my wife, there’s a non-negligible chance that there would be bloodshed on my front porch when they came for her. I guess it’s just that I think women are more valuable and important. If I got killed, life would go on for my family. Not that it would be easy, but they’d manage. If the wife died, we’d fall apart. If God-forbid, she dies first, I’ll be one of those 6-month widowers following after her. Anyway, I guess I’ll be the whipping boy to attack over this stance, so have at it. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/18 "2018-12-19T15:09:18Z")
> [@senoy](#): > > I guess what it really comes down to is that if they drafted my boys, I’d mourn it, but accept it. If they drafted my wife, there’s a non-negligible chance that there would be bloodshed on my front porch when they came for her. I guess it’s just that I think women are more valuable and important. If I got killed, life would go on for my family. Not that it would be easy, but they’d manage. If the wife died, we’d fall apart. If God-forbid, she dies first, I’ll be one of those 6-month widowers following after her. > > Anyway, I guess I’ll be the whipping boy to attack over this stance, so have at it. The attitude you display is a textbook example of [Male Disposability](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Myth_of_Male_Power), a concept coined by Warren Farrell in his book “The Myth of Male Power:Why Men are the Disposable Sex” > [@](#): > > The subtitle of the book is “Why Men are the Disposable Sex.” Farrell argues that historically both sexes were disposable in the service of survival: women risked death in childbirth; men risked death in war. However, Farrell notes, there is a key difference: women’s disposability emanated more from biology; men’s expendability required socialization.[5] > Farrell observes various characteristics of modern US society, such as the tendency to assign higher-risk jobs - soldier, firefighter, coal miner, and so on - to men: almost all of the most hazardous professions are all-male, and segments within professions have higher percentages of men as their level of hazard increases. Other statistics, in conjunction with the lack of public outcry or mobilization around them, point in the same direction of male expendability. Men are victims of violent crime twice as often as women and are “three times more likely to be murder victims”. Suicide rates are much higher for men than for women. While the death rates for breast cancer and prostate cancer are comparable, the US spends six times as much on breast cancer.[6] ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/19 "2018-12-19T15:25:48Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > The question posed by the OP is that since we do have a Selective Service System, should it register women as well as men? Yes, if we must have Selective Service then it should be gender neutral, but I don’t accept that we must have it. Framing the question with the assumption that we must have the SSS isn’t a fair way to look at it, IMO. If the question is “How should we make the SSS gender neutral?” I vote for ending the program. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2018, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361/20 "2018-12-19T16:18:38Z")
To answer the OP, there technically is no legal reason why women shouldn’t be required to register. Up to a few years ago, women weren’t allowed in combat roles and that was why the Supreme Court ruled in favor of making it men-only. But ever since the Pentagon lifted that combat ban a few years ago, there has technically been no reason why it shouldn’t be done, save for the inertia or sexism of some Congressmen. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-women-have-to-register-for-selective-service/826361.md?page=2)