# Should young children be taught about racism (Black History day)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 28, 2012, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116 "2012-10-28T07:38:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/21 "2012-10-28T20:26:14Z")
We pretend that only white people can be racists. Some of the biggest racists I’ve met are of none white ethnicities including African descendants. I doubt very much that my experience is unique. We teach children about slavery, but “forget” to mention that Black Africans practiced it long before they came in contact with Europeans, and still practice it today. We don’t mention that it was Black Africans who actively went out to capture their neighbours to sell as slaves, not because the nasty Whities told them to, but out of greed for what they could get for selling them. All to often Black racists use crocodile tears about slavery in history as a stick to beat Whitey with, and stir up race hatred for their own agenda. How do we know that they’re crocodile tears ? Because the people who pretend to be so upset about the plight of people long dead, and angry about other people long dead, do ABSALOUTLY NOTHING about slavery today, even though according to the United Nations there are more actual slaves on the planet then in recorded history. Not, indentured workers, or people working in harsh and poorly paid conditions, but actual SLAVES, as in bought and sold. Not only do the crocodile weepers make no attempt whatsoever to combat this evil, but they try hard to stifle any mention of it, and become positively abusive and very aggressive to those who do raise the subject. It seems to be that Black racists and White racists, play off of each other in a sort of “Mutt and Jeff” parody . Result African Americans lose out and can become marginalised in main stream society. Teaching kids about racism is a very good thing, but all too often the teachings and the teachers are racist themselves, albeit it, not of the White variety. White racists tend to be pathetic and not overly intelligent. Black racists tend to be more insiduous. But the losers always are African Americans. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/22 "2012-10-28T21:08:36Z")
> [@Lust4Life](#): > > But the losers always are African Americans. Especially all those British African Americans, huh? ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/23 "2012-10-28T21:24:29Z")
It’s all in the presentation. 8 Y/O is too young to see videos of lynchings or the holocaust, but not to be shown some positive history. They’re already picking up racial experiences in the real world. +1 to what **Whynot** said. The way to deal with the past is to address it, not deny it. ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/24 "2012-10-28T21:34:22Z")
> [@Lust4Life](#): > > We pretend that only white people can be racists. > > Some of the biggest racists I’ve met are of none white ethnicities including African descendants. > > I doubt very much that my experience is unique. > > We teach children about slavery, but “forget” to mention that Black Africans practiced it long before they came in contact with Europeans, and still practice it today. > > We don’t mention that it was Black Africans who actively went out to capture their neighbours to sell as slaves, not because the nasty Whities told them to, but out of greed for what they could get for selling them. > > All to often Black racists use crocodile tears about slavery in history as a stick to beat Whitey with, and stir up race hatred for their own agenda. > > How do we know that they’re crocodile tears ? > Because the people who pretend to be so upset about the plight of people long dead, and angry about other people long dead, do ABSALOUTLY NOTHING about slavery today, even though according to the United Nations there are more actual slaves on the planet then in recorded history. > > Not, indentured workers, or people working in harsh and poorly paid conditions, but actual SLAVES, as in bought and sold. > > Not only do the crocodile weepers make no attempt whatsoever to combat this evil, but they try hard to stifle any mention of it, and become positively abusive and very aggressive to those who do raise the subject. > > It seems to be that Black racists and White racists, play off of each other in a sort of “Mutt and Jeff” parody . > Result African Americans lose out and can become marginalised in main stream society. > > Teaching kids about racism is a very good thing, but all too often the teachings and the teachers are racist themselves, albeit it, not of the White variety. > > White racists tend to be pathetic and not overly intelligent. > > Black racists tend to be more insiduous. > > But the losers always are African Americans. [And it begins:](http://bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2012/10/27/poll-majority-harbor-prejudice-against-blacks/5Tj42nmGdF8e4iF0FQ0aNK/story.html). > [@](#): > > In all, 51 percent of those surveyed expressed explicit racist attitudes toward black people, compared with 48 percent in a similar 2008 survey. When measured by an implicit racial attitudes test, the share with racist sentiments jumped to 56 percent, up from 49 percent during the last presidential election. In both tests, the share of Americans expressing positive attitudes toward black people fell. ---
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/25 "2012-10-28T22:04:45Z")
> [@Lust4Life](#): > > All to often Black racists use crocodile tears about slavery in history as a stick to beat Whitey with, and stir up race hatred for their own agenda. What the hell? Reconstruction was a flat-out failure and, after all that, white people couldn’t keep the basic promises of the Civil Rights movement. Didja know that not one decade had passed after MLK was shot before white people started [dismantling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regents_of_the_University_of_California_v._Bakke) the Civil Rights movement? Frankly, it pisses me off because you (general you) should’ve endorsed Malcolm X and crafted legislation built on the framework of racial separateness rather than pretending to enamored with the MLK’s dream of racial harmony. IMO, the more I read these forums and the Internet, I’m convinced it’s about time white people call the experiment over and give us our forty acres & a mule _with interest_ and be done with it. Napoleon once remarked that one should “Promise everything and deliver nothing”- those words ought to be the white national anthem and embroidered in flowing subscript on the American flag. The ragehating on blacks is ridiculous especially when most of you don’t understand our culture and 95% of you don’t have a single non-coworker African-American friend to your name. Listening to Nelly and Rick Ross or watching _The Color Purple_ or _Boyz in the Hood_ doesn’t count. - Honesty ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/26 "2012-10-28T22:11:41Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Especially all those British African Americans, huh? How many posts have I made over the years ? Do you seriously believe that I was trying to conceal my Britishnessnessnessness ? Things must be pretty desperate for you to use this incredibly lame tactic in an attempt to undermine my post. Perhaps you could trawl through and pick up on any spelling mistakes or grammatical errors I’ve made ? We haven’t so far in the U.K. had Black ex criminals hijacking the racist/human rights campaign for their own agendas. (money and power over their ethnic groups perhaps ?Pimps talking about human rights, ironic to say the least) Or racist made up “festivals” to promote race hatred. Most of the the Afro Carribbeans in the U.K. do not evaluate themselves on the basis of their long dead ancestors being slaves, nor do they try to teach or promote it, as the very cynical inhabitants of these isles, of all races would give them the horse laugh if they tried to do so. Yes we have more then our fair share of White and Black racists here, but the Black racists tend not to be of the “Poor little me , give me extra priveleges because someone that I’ve never met and who died two hundred years ago was enslaved, and even posibly a slaver himself” variety. Yes we all know about the unforgivable Jim Crow laws , but they’re gone. If anyone has the right to whine about their sad lot its the Jews, but funnily enough they tend not to, and instead try to get successful lives instead of telling us all how hard done they were before the present day. And before you ask, I’m not Jewish, or as far as I know, actually know any Jews. Now why don’t you tell me how shocked and angry you are about present day slavery, and how you’re fighting it ? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/27 "2012-10-28T22:12:05Z")
One of the things you might have to teach your child - it probably won’t get taught in school - is that when it comes to the topic of racism, some people get reeeeaaal touchy on the subject. > [@](#): > > 95% of you don’t have a single non-coworker African-American friend to your name. Why, some of my best friends are… Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/28 "2012-10-28T22:26:49Z")
Pretending that something doesn’t exist won’t make it go away. In fact, that’s probably the worst thing you could do if you want it to go away. Racism exists. First come to terms with that fact, and then you can start fighting back against it. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/29 "2012-10-28T22:32:43Z")
I was born just a few months after the end of World War II, and I was raised Jewish. I honestly don’t remember a time when I didn’t know about the Holocaust, and I don’t remember the first time I saw those horrible photos of the piles of victims. Later on, nobody shielded me from learning about racism, or sexism, or homophobia, or any other ideology of injustice. It instilled in me an understanding of “man’s inhumanity to man,” and an appreciation of people who lived and died to achieve freedom and equality for themselves and others. I cannot imagine withholding this lesson from an 8-year-old. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/30 "2012-10-28T22:32:49Z")
Totally agree, you might want to have a word with British Afro Caribbean “Paki Bashers” on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/31 "2012-10-28T22:50:26Z")
> [@Honesty](#): > > [And it begins:](http://bostonglobe.com/news/nation/2012/10/27/poll-majority-harbor-prejudice-against-blacks/5Tj42nmGdF8e4iF0FQ0aNK/story.html). And what was the percentage of Hispanics who expressed racist views against African Americans, and vice versa ? Or Vietnamese against Thais , or both against Phillipinos ? Or Chinese against Japanese and vice versa ? Or Japanese against Koreans ? Or Greeks and Turks, or Arabs about Jews ? It hasn’t begun, its been around for thousands of years. And in the U.K ask Afro Carribeans about “Paki Bashing”. Or what Indians and Pakistanis think about Afro Caribs and Africans. Or what Indians and Pakistanis think about each other. Don’t demonise Whitey, sort yourselves out first. We’re trying to, you 're not even making an attempt. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/32 "2012-10-28T22:57:07Z")
> [@Lust4Life](#): > > Do you seriously believe that I was trying to conceal my Britishnessnessnessness ? No, I was teasing you for using the term African American instead of black, when the OP isn’t talking about any kind of Americans, being British, and is herself averse to the word black. It just seems a bizarre label for British people of African descent to me. But, as \*\*Dangerosa \*\*points out, I don’t “get” racism and probably never will. So it was insensitive of me to try to inject some levity to a topic which clearly bothers you on a much deeper level than I understand. I apologize. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/33 "2012-10-28T23:19:35Z")
> [@SomeBodyUK](#): > > My brother and sister-in-law never talk about race in front of their kids …and this is the point where I’d bet a hundred bucks your brother and sister-in-law are white. One of the awesome parts about being white is that you don’t need to prepare your kids to deal with racism; you can let them be oblivious to it without harming them, because they’re likely not to encounter it directed at them. So, lucky them! Just because it won’t affect them, however, doesn’t mean they’re not aware of race, and doesn’t mean they should be ignorant of the history of their country. That said, recently when I was giving a standardized test to some third-graders, I was heartened to see how many of them had no idea what to put under “race” on the form. One white girl from Hawaii wanted to check the Hawaiian/Pacific Islander box; an Asian kid wanted to check American Indian for who knows what reason; a black girl had no idea what the question even meant. So maybe things are getting better. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/34 "2012-10-28T23:27:37Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > …and this is the point where I’d bet a hundred bucks your brother and sister-in-law are white. …too late to edit, I’d bet a thousand bucks that I’m the kind of idiot who posts in a thread before reading the whole thing. A million bucks, even. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/35 "2012-10-28T23:29:26Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > …and this is the point where I’d bet a hundred bucks your brother and sister-in-law are white. One of the awesome parts about being white is that you don’t need to prepare your kids to deal with racism; you can let them be oblivious to it without harming them, because they’re likely not to encounter it directed at them. So, lucky them! After the Trayvon Martin shooting there was a lot of discussion about “the talk” that black American men have with their sons. That we white folks (my husband and I)\_ have tried to have with our Asian son even though we don’t “get it” because we live in an area where Asian means “Hmong gang member” not “overachieving child of Chinese Tiger mom who plays the violin.” Those editorials and essays about the talk were scary. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2012, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/36 "2012-10-29T00:04:52Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > No, I was teasing you for using the term African American instead of black, when the OP isn’t talking about any kind of Americans, being British, and is herself averse to the word black. It just seems a bizarre label for British people of African descent to me. > > But, as \*\*Dangerosa \*\*points out, I don’t “get” racism and probably never will. So it was insensitive of me to try to inject some levity to a topic which clearly bothers you on a much deeper level than I understand. I apologize. No worries ! ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2012, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/37 "2012-10-29T00:21:00Z")
Never too early to teach - I was just wondering why a UK class talking about racism would have 3/4 examples be from the US? I would assume that there are some good lessons from the UK that could be applied. If not, you make this into an American / elsewhere issue allowing the kids to assume it isn’t their problem. Same problem we often face in the US where racism education focuses on the South, ignoring race issues in the North or the West. ---
**Author:** ![SomeBodyUK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@SomeBodyUK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SomeBodyUK)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2012, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/38 "2012-10-29T03:18:16Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > No, I was teasing you for using the term African American instead of black, when the OP isn’t talking about any kind of Americans, being British, and is herself averse to the word black. It just seems a bizarre label for British people of African descent to me. I’m male > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > …and this is the point where I’d bet a hundred bucks your brother and sister-in-law are white. One of the awesome parts about being white is that you don’t need to prepare your kids to deal with racism; you can let them be oblivious to it without harming them, because they’re likely not to encounter it directed at them. So, lucky them! > > Just because it won’t affect them, however, doesn’t mean they’re not aware of race, and doesn’t mean they should be ignorant of the history of their country. Can I have a hundred bucks please? My brother and sister in law are both Indian. I mentioned that I’m Indian earlier up the thread.:smack: I’m not trying to say that my niece should never be taught about racism, merely that I feel that she’s a bit too young to learn about it. > [@Lust4Life](#): > > We pretend that only white people can be racists. > . > . > . > > But the losers always are African Americans. How is this relevant to my question? > [@Algher](#): > > Never too early to teach - I was just wondering why a UK class talking about racism would have 3/4 examples be from the US? > > I would assume that there are some good lessons from the UK that could be applied. If not, you make this into an American / elsewhere issue allowing the kids to assume it isn’t their problem. Same problem we often face in the US where racism education focuses on the South, ignoring race issues in the North or the West. No idea, but I can’t remember the name of any black British people who had a similar experience to either of them. Barack Obama - UK has never had a black British prime minister Martin Luther King - there was never a black minister who was as influential as him Rosa Parks - UK never practiced segregation Nelson Mandela - UK never had apartheid ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2012, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/39 "2012-10-29T03:37:20Z")
Learning what prejudice and bigotry look and sound like is vital to learning what’s wrong and what’s right along w/ stealing, hitting, lying, disrespect, etc. Eight is nowhere near too young for that basic morality. Sounds like she understands it and this gives her a tool to use to stand up for herself. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2012, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116/40 "2012-10-29T03:40:18Z")
Except in the UK, aren’t racial tensions more between whites and South Asians, rather than whites and Africans? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-young-children-be-taught-about-racism-black-history-day/639116.md?page=3)