# Shut the fuck up, Ricky Gervais. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 16, 2015, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851 "2015-04-16T18:17:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/121 "2015-04-17T01:05:45Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Doesn’t really matter to me. What matters is “kills.” Why wouldn’t it matter whether someone “kills with gusto” or “kills reluctantly”? > [@](#): > > It is interesting to me that of all the hunters in the world who post selfies next to their prey, the one that Ricky Gervais tweets about is one of the few hunters that’s a woman. Is it really that hard to find a dude who’s next to his prey? What are the percentages? Yeah that’s a good point. Are there infact a lot of male I-Just-Killed-This selfies on the internet? ---
**Author:** ![tenacious\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/439d5e/32.png) [@tenacious\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tenacious_j)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/122 "2015-04-17T01:17:48Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Why wouldn’t it matter whether someone “kills with gusto” or “kills reluctantly”? > > Yeah that’s a good point. Are there infact a lot of male I-Just-Killed-This selfies on the internet? In Wisconsin, at least in my big extended family, there are many many I-just-killed-this photos. Too many, but I’m done arguing with them about my unpopular position. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/123 "2015-04-17T01:26:16Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > Interesting how the thread became about the moral justification of the hunter, as opposed to that of those engaging in online threats, doxxing, etc. against her or about the OP’s denunciation of the online shaming culture. The thread was whining about Gervais and how he needed to “shut the fuck up”. Gervais didn’t threaten the woman or dox her or whatever. He just gave an opinion on her. Much of why Gervais supposedly needs to “shut the fuck up” was because of this woman’s “reasonable” defense for her actions. So it would seem that discussing this defense is a reasonable thing to do in a thread. If the OP wanted to limit discussion to online shaming or doxxing, then adding in a bunch of nonsense about Gervais being fat or eating meat or how giraffes aren’t endangered was a poor way to go about it. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/124 "2015-04-17T01:30:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > [www.worldanimalfoundation.net/f/Giraffe.pdf](http://www.worldanimalfoundation.net/f/Giraffe.pdf) More accurately, [adult male giraffes](http://www.giraffeworlds.com/giraffe-social-structure/) don’t typically hang out in herds and herding behavior in giraffes is highly fluid anyway. In the context of **MrDibble** ’s post, he is quite correct - giraffes don’t really seem social enough to ostracize. Indeed male dominance, such as it is, seems to be largely a matter of simple size. ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/125 "2015-04-17T01:32:55Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > A lot of people are suggesting that the animals are owed respect. I have pretty conflicting feelings about animal welfare and animal rights–although I’ve got a mouthful of beefy enchilada right now, I wouldn’t be surprised if future generations consider that to be an atrocity–but among my conflicting feelings, I’m absolutely convinced that showing respect to animals is a total irrelevancy. Kill them or don’t kill them, that makes a real difference. But respect them or don’t respect them once you’ve killed them? That’s total anthropomorphism. > > Doesn’t really matter to me. What matters is “kills.” If someone’s going to kill an animal anyway, they may as well enjoy it. Weeping for the oyster–excuse me, giraffe–and deeply sympathizing makes no difference compared to posing next to it for a selfie. I think you’re overlooking the connections between respecting animals, enjoying the kill, and the decision to kill or not kill. If you don’t have respect for animals, and you enjoy killing animals, that will influence your decision of whether or not it should be killed. The respect (or lack of) and enjoyment of killing doesn’t exist apart from that decision. Think about this: Do you think a veterinarian should enjoy putting down an animal? What if vets posted selfies smiling next to the animals they euthanized? Creepy or not? If so, why? As you say, the animals wouldn’t care, and they’re going to be killed anyway. And what about people who kill stray cats and dogs? _If respect for animals is irrelevant, why should they refrain from doing something they enjoy?_ Why is that considered one of the warning signals of criminal sociopathy? Would you tell your students that respect for animals is irrelevant, and enjoying killing doesn’t matter, as you’ve explained it here? I think glorifying the killing of any living thing - whether it is valid to kill it or not - is detrimental to society and individuals. Even the animals we eat should be given more respect than they are currently afforded in factory farms, because it is a reflection of who _we_ are, of our ethics as human beings. I think it is possible to be a hunter and still respect animals and not enjoy killing for the sake of killing. Hunting is a skill, and there are situations where it is valid and useful. But these big game hunters have no reason to be prouder of their kills than a slaughterhouse worker; those game preserves are like shooting fish in a barrel. All it takes is money. ---
**Author:** ![Cazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cazzle/32/75_2.png) [@Cazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cazzle)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/126 "2015-04-17T01:33:30Z")
Rebecca Francis quotes. "[…]I was of the mindset that I would never shoot a giraffe,” she wrote. “[…] the animals I have taken with a bow include: a 10 1/2 ft. brown bear, black bear, shiras moose, alaskan moose,  dall sheep, stone sheep, desert bighorn ram, rocky mountain bighorn ram, mule deer, whitetail deer, elk, mountain goat, antelope, arapawa ram, kudu, zebra, black wildebeest, giraffe, springbuck, blesbuck, lynx, badger, and squirrel. I have also taken many of the same species and more with a rifle.” But she only hunted the giraffe because of the “unique circumstance”. She kills animals for sport, and as distasteful as I personally find it, it’s her choice and right to do so. She should own it. Making up this bullcrap story about killing the giraffe selflessly, to end his suffering and feed a village… That’s really ugly. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/127 "2015-04-17T01:36:13Z")
Someone should get on her for valuing a giraffe more highly than Rocky Mountain bighorn ram that she previously had a line against killing giraffes (unless to save a village). Maybe if they quoted some Carroll at her, she’d see what a big stupid hypocrite she was. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/128 "2015-04-17T01:37:41Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Yeah that’s a good point. Are there infact a lot of male I-Just-Killed-This selfies on the internet? [There’s a few.](https://nyppagesix.files.wordpress.com/2014/01/hunter3.jpg) [Really, more than a few.](http://www.adventure-journal.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/adventure-journal-killing-and-smiling.jpg) [In fairness, this guy really does look like a douchebag.](http://www.theunintelligencer.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/71ecd66cc6fc203e41a855a191791f64.jpg) [I can’t rule out the possibility that this blind guy doesn’t actually know he hit something, but it seems unlikely.](http://whitetailoverload.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/blind-war-hero-hunter-deer-hunting-post.jpg) And my favorite, [Inuits grinning happily after killing a whale.](http://apihtawikosisan.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/bowhead-whale.jpg) Native Americans are, of course, famous for their disrespect of nature. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/129 "2015-04-17T01:46:41Z")
> [@racepug](#): > > Still, I have a question: “How did that woman _know_ that the giraffe was near the end of its life before she finished taking it?” She had a gun. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/130 "2015-04-17T01:48:21Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Why wouldn’t it matter whether someone “kills with gusto” or “kills reluctantly”? To the giraffe? Why **would** it matter? And if it doesn’t matter to the victim, why would it matter to me? > [@camille](#): > > I think you’re overlooking the connections between respecting animals, enjoying the kill, and the decision to kill or not kill. > > If you don’t have respect for animals, and you enjoy killing animals, that will influence your decision of whether or not it should be killed. The respect (or lack of) and enjoyment of killing doesn’t exist apart from that decision. Not really. If someone kills an animal that it’s appropriate to kill, and if they did so for reasons that won’t lead to inappropriate killing, I’m genuinely not going to worry about their enjoyment. I accept that there are folks who are recreational hunters and fishers, and pretty much by definition these are people who derive pleasure from killing certain animals. We’re trumped up bald-ass monkeys, and there’s a certain predatory monkey instinct we’ve got. I exercise it by blowing up aliens in computer games; others exercise it by killing animals for food. Given that I eat meat that someone else killed, I don’t see how I can exercise any moral superiority over them. Yeah, there might be someone who enjoys killing animals _so much_ that they start killing animals in inappropriate circumstances. If they do that, it’s the killing in inappropriate circumstances, not their pleasure, that’s the problem. As for the selfie-euthanasia vet, that would disrespect me as the ex-owner of poor sick Fluffles, and I do care about disrespecting people. Edit: > [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > She had a gun. Damn! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/131 "2015-04-17T01:50:14Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > If the OP wanted to limit discussion to online shaming or doxxing, then adding in a bunch of nonsense about Gervais being fat or eating meat or how giraffes aren’t endangered was a poor way to go about it. Fair enough. The OP does read at times as being a pitting on two distinct subjects using only the one incident and the one personalized pittee so it could have gone in either direction. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/132 "2015-04-17T01:59:26Z")
> [@camille](#): > > I think it is possible to be a hunter and still respect animals and not enjoy killing for the sake of killing. Hunting is a skill, and there are situations where it is valid and useful. But these big game hunters have no reason to be prouder of their kills than a slaughterhouse worker; those game preserves are like shooting fish in a barrel. All it takes is money. Is this based on your extensive hunting experience? ---
**Author:** ![Helena330](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/helena330/32/531_2.png) [@Helena330](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Helena330)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/133 "2015-04-17T01:59:55Z")
Why should we respect animals? They have a lot of the same feelings we do: they feel pain, they suffer, they feel happiness and many form familial bonds. If we’re a superior life form as some have suggested, isn’t it our _responsibility_ to respect them? This includes allowing them dignity and not being joyful over their deaths. [Virtues of the Responsible Hunter](http://wiredtohunt.com/virtues-of-the-responsible-hunter/). > [@](#): > > I love hunting, but unfortunately there are many out there who do not. Even more unfortunate is that many people don’t approve of hunting because of the inappropriate actions of a select few hunters that make the rest of us look very bad. > [@](#): > > 1. Behave in a way that will bring no dishonor to either the hunter, the hunted, or the environment. Going off like bloodthirsty rednecks is only hurting you and your sport. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/134 "2015-04-17T02:09:48Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Why don’t you quote the rest of the post where he explains what he meant? And with all your shit about fighting ignorance, don’t you deal with the experts saying her story is improbable? I quoted the entirety of that post, you moron. And what “experts?” > [@](#): > > You have a problem where “fighting ignorance” means getting everyone to agree with you. Someone voiced a fucking opinion about a situation and you alleged they were being ignorant, as if the story from this woman that you want to believe is scientific fact. If their opinion arises from ignorance, then it’s not on par with an opinion that rests on known facts and the inferences deductible therefrom. > [@](#): > > The fact remains that a lot of people find the enjoyment at killing to be reprehensible. It’s not like our lizard brains differentiate via species. It’s been shown that people who [enjoy crushing bugs](http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20150130-the-man-who-studies-evil) will also volunteer to do things that hurt their fellow human beings. You are truly a simple-minded ignorant fucknugget. > [@](#): > > That’s my OPINION. It doesn’t matter. There are no scientific facts being disputed here. The song of your people. ---
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/135 "2015-04-17T02:11:58Z")
> [@Doctor\_Why\_Bother](#): > > Ms Francis is now having the shit doxxed out of her, and, because our society is awful, is also having to deal with the nowadays obligatory torrent of death threats. Hey, I’m not against her killing the Giraffe but I’m not opposed to her getting death threats. She weapons up and stalks and kills things that mean her no harm. She signs death warrants all the time with no warning. She’s a hunter. It’s pretty damned hypocritical of her to deny a superior hunter the opportunity to put her down. She deals death, she doesn’t get to deny a fellow professional the courtesy if they so desire. That’s cowardly. She needs to put skin in the game or don’t bother playing. She’s already doing that going against bears with a bow and arrow. That takes guts. She should be willing to move up to a more challenging foe. Only if it’s consensual of course or if the loser is used to feed a starving village or something. Hell, I’d pay to see it and would likely bet on her to win. She looks like she can handle her own. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/136 "2015-04-17T02:15:42Z")
> [@Helena330](#): > > Why should we respect animals? They have a lot of the same feelings we do: they feel pain, they suffer, they feel happiness and many form familial bonds. If we’re a superior life form as some have suggested, isn’t it our _responsibility_ to respect them? This includes allowing them dignity and not being joyful over their deaths. > > [Virtues of the Responsible Hunter](http://wiredtohunt.com/virtues-of-the-responsible-hunter/). I’m not seeing “don’t take pictures of yourself smiling with your kill” in that list. And I’m guessing that the photo at the top, of several grinning people gathered around a dead deer, includes the author of that blog? > [@](#): > > Going off like bloodthirsty rednecks is only hurting you and your sport. In what way did the woman in the OP behave like a bloodthirsty redneck? ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/137 "2015-04-17T02:20:05Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > If someone kills an animal that it’s appropriate to kill, and if they did so for reasons that won’t lead to inappropriate killing, I’m genuinely not going to worry about their enjoyment. > > I accept that there are folks who are recreational hunters and fishers, and pretty much by definition these are people who derive pleasure from killing certain animals. We’re trumped up bald-ass monkeys, and there’s a certain predatory monkey instinct we’ve got. I exercise it by blowing up aliens in computer games; others exercise it by killing animals for food. Given that I eat meat that someone else killed, I don’t see how I can exercise any moral superiority over them. > > Yeah, there might be someone who enjoys killing animals _so much_ that they start killing animals in inappropriate circumstances. If they do that, it’s the killing in inappropriate circumstances, not their pleasure, that’s the problem. > > As for the selfie-euthanasia vet, that would disrespect me as the ex-owner of poor sick Fluffles, and I do care about disrespecting people. So you’d be okay with a vet who posted a selfie of a _stray_ animal that was euthanized? :dubious: And I still think you’re discounting the harmful effects of not respecting animals and the enjoyment of killing animals. It’s the pleasure that _precipitates_ the killing in inappropriate circumstances, so why isn’t that a primary concern? Why not deter that inappropriate enjoyment by promoting respect for living things? You didn’t respond to my other question, but I am doubtful you’d be this blithe about it if your students asked you for your opinion. I have seen firsthand in my own students how there is a correlation between respect for animals and respect for other people. Yes, we are trumped up monkeys, but the goal should be to strive to make ethical decisions with the part of our brain that has evolved beyond that. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/138 "2015-04-17T02:28:41Z")
Who knew that **Bricker** was an expert in giraffe social behavior and in laws regarding permitted giraffe hunting in Africa? Truly, there is nothing the man does not know! ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/139 "2015-04-17T02:37:15Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > Who knew that **Bricker** was an expert in giraffe social behavior and in laws regarding permitted giraffe hunting in Africa? > > Truly, there is nothing the man does not know! Ad hominem, and poisoning the well. ---
**Author:** ![Bumbershoot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bumbershoot/32/3428_2.png) [@Bumbershoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bumbershoot)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2015, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851/140 "2015-04-17T02:47:19Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Why don’t you quote the rest of the post where he explains what he meant? … > [@Bricker](#): > > I quoted the entirety of that post, you moron… I think you’re being disingenuous here, Bricker. I think you’re fully aware that Mr. Dibble followed this post > [@MrDibble](#): > > **Giraffes don’t have HERDS.** with this post > [@MrDibble](#): > > Not in the sense of any continuous cohesive group, anyway. just 3 minutes later. I also think you’re fully aware the second post was the post BigT was talking about. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shut-the-fuck-up-ricky-gervais/717851.md?page=8)