# silly dedication to one's political beliefs (Bush related) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 26, 2004, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896 "2004-07-26T04:43:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/21 "2004-07-26T12:43:22Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Yeah, we should give a free pass to the FBI and CIA, as well as the intel from the previous administration. I mean, come on people! Bush should be omniscient! And where exactly did I say that _anyone_ should be given a “free pass”? Problem is, as things stand now, that other than Tenet falling on his sword, and the ensuing and rather desperate attempts to scapegoat the intelligence community, people like you are the ones willing to give Dumbya & Co said free pass in the form of a vote for continuity. Nice. For a refresher course on all the Bushit, just in case you’ve ‘conveniently forgotten’ the Iraq Invasion Marketing Campaign: [**Iraq On The Record**](http://www.house.gov/reform/min/features/iraq_on_the_record/) ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/22 "2004-07-26T12:47:15Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Oh, unless you take into account the foreign countries that had intel that led most to beleive taking out Saddam was a good thing. Shit, that history thing is a bitch, huh? You mean all those countries that made up the Security Council and gave Dumbya the green light to go ahead and invade Iraq on the basis of all his Bushit? Oh, wait…that didn’t happen, did it? Revisionist history is, indeed, a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/23 "2004-07-26T12:49:41Z")
Not to belabor the obvious, but you’re sorta missing the point, **duffer**. Bush got the American people to support an invasion of Iraq by telling them that Saddam had biological and chemical weapons, was soon to have nuclear weapons, was a real and present danger to the U.S., was supporting terrorism, and was probably in cahoots with Al Qaeda. Turns out that none of these things was true. History’s sure is a bitch, ain’t it? He got the Congress to go along with his war plans by telling them the same things. If the members of Congress wanted to check out these claims, they could turn to, well, to whom? Members of the Bush administration, of course. No choice. Congress doesn’t have its own intelligence service. There is no “shadow” State Department. And those executive branch folks told the members of Congress pretty much the same fairy tales. I can’t really blame Congress for the Iraq fiasco. They were bamboozled like the rest of us. ---
**Author:** ![Polerius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d78d45/32.png) [@Polerius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polerius)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/24 "2004-07-26T12:55:31Z")
> [@Bill H.](#): > > It wasn’t an SUV, but it was a Mercedes, which is kinda funny in itself some how. And why is it “kinda funny”? Do tell. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/25 "2004-07-26T13:27:43Z")
> [@spooje](#): > > Am I the only one who thought of the old joke about the the guy with tattoo, the 2 nurses and the difference between ‘swan’ and ‘saskatchewan’? Yes, you are. You perv. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/26 "2004-07-26T13:32:41Z")
**Early Out** you really are wrong. Bush didn’t force a war. He went on what the intel said. Some of the intel was provided by Britain. As well as France and Russia in a lesser extent. All of this was presented to the UN and Congress. The UN addes yet another sanction against Iraq, and Congress voted overwhelmingly to use force. This was not the action of one man. WMD not found? Well, 40 years after WWII the Allies were discovering weapons Hitler had stashed. And central Europe is much less isloated than the Iraqi desert. Take that for what you will. I support Bush and will vote for him in Nov. But as I’ve said in previous posts, even I don’t think he’s powerful enough to bring down the Republic. The US is too strong to be dismantled by any one administration. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/27 "2004-07-26T13:57:13Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > **Early Out** you really are wrong. Bush didn’t force a war. Of course not. How could he possibly ignore the fact that Iraq attacked the U.S.? Oh, wait. > [@](#): > > He went on what the intel said. All of it dead wrong. > [@](#): > > Some of the intel was provided by Britain. As well as France and Russia in a lesser extent. All of it based on the same faulty, unreliable sources (forged documents, Chalabi’s stooges). > [@](#): > > All of this was presented to the UN… Which refused to go along with a military action, for good reason. > [@](#): > > … and Congress. Which was misled by the faulty intelligence, and which it had no way of independently verifying. > [@](#): > > WMD not found? Well, 40 years after WWII the Allies were discovering weapons Hitler had stashed. And central Europe is much less isloated than the Iraqi desert. Take that for what you will. I take it as the cry of the truly desperate. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/28 "2004-07-26T14:13:23Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > **Early Out** you really are wrong. Bush didn’t force a war. He went on what the intel said. Some of the intel was provided by Britain. And Bush & co were warned by the CIA that the British intelligence was false. > [@duffer](#): > > As well as France and Russia in a lesser extent. On the assumption that you’ve pulled this from some right-wing blog rather than simply inventing it, cite? > [@duffer](#): > > All of this was presented to the UN and Congress. Yes, it was. We now know that it was complete bullshit. > [@duffer](#): > > The UN addes yet another sanction against Iraq, and Congress voted overwhelmingly to use force. No, congress did not vote so. What congress voted to approve was this: > [@](#): > > [Res 114: Armed Forces Against Iraq](http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/bliraqreshouse.htm) > > SEC. 3. AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF UNITED STATES ARMED FORCES. > > (a) AUTHORIZATION- The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to– > > (1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and > > (2) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq. > > (b) PRESIDENTIAL DETERMINATION- In connection with the exercise of the authority granted in subsection (a) to use force the President shall, prior to such exercise or as soon thereafter as may be feasible, but no later than 48 hours after exercising such authority, make available to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and the President pro tempore of the Senate his determination that– > > (1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic or other peaceful means alone either (A) will not adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq or (B) is not likely to lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq; and > > (2) acting pursuant to this joint resolution is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorist and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001. > > (c) War Powers Resolution Requirements- > > (1) SPECIFIC STATUTORY AUTHORIZATION- Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(b) of the War Powers Resolution. > > (2) APPLICABILITY OF OTHER REQUIREMENTS- Nothing in this joint resolution supersedes any requirement of the War Powers Resolution. They didn’t vote “overwhelmingly to use force”, the stupid assholes handed Bush the loaded gun, and (I assume) expected him to use it sensibly. Bush grabbed the loaded gun and started firing wildly. Congress bears some blame for this, but _it does not exonerate Bush_. > [@duffer](#): > > This was not the action of one man. You’re quite correct. Bush had a number of other fools to assist him. Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, Perle, Feith, Woolsey. All of them stupid venal assholes. But you’re correct, it wasn’t just Bush. > [@duffer](#): > > WMD not found? Well, 40 years after WWII the Allies were discovering weapons Hitler had stashed. And central Europe is much less isloated than the Iraqi desert. Take that for what you will. :rolleyes: Whatever. > [@duffer](#): > > I support Bush and will vote for him in Nov. But as I’ve said in previous posts, even I don’t think he’s powerful enough to bring down the Republic. The US is too strong to be dismantled by any one administration. It’s not a matter of power, it’s a matter of stupidity and complete and utter incompetence. I guess you like Bush coz he’s just like you. That ain’t enough to guarantee the survival of the Union. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/29 "2004-07-26T14:13:57Z")
Yup, I’m desperate. You’ve exposed me for the powerbroker that I am. :rolleyes: Just one problem with your arguments. They have as much sway in the world arena as mine. Unless you have material that trumps what is bandied about in the highest levels of world politics, it’s little more than your opinion. Get over it. Be pissed, it’s your right. But don’t expect to be so far above the rest of us as to be privy to things most won’t know. Sometimes it’s better for a government to have a few secrets. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/30 "2004-07-26T14:24:35Z")
> [@Desmostylus](#): > > I guess you like Bush coz he’s just like you. Man, and this is after 3 days of taking the left-wing poster’s with a grain and seeing their points. Thanks for setting me straight **Desmo.** Judging what you’ve said about Bush, and saying I’m the same, I’ll take it as a personal attack. You warm, fuzzy, accept-all kinda guy you! Bush is just like me? Considering what you’ve said about Bush in the past means you think the same about me. Well, Fuck you, too! You’re too much a pile of shit to get worked up over. **DTC** , **Reeder** and **Elucidator** have taught me not to take anything too personally IRL. You’re little more than a blip on the screen at this point ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/31 "2004-07-26T14:31:56Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Just one problem with your arguments. They have as much sway in the world arena as mine. Unless you have material that trumps what is bandied about in the highest levels of world politics, it’s little more than your opinion. Get over it. Be pissed, it’s your right. But don’t expect to be so far above the rest of us as to be privy to things most won’t know. Sometimes it’s better for a government to have a few secrets. All Hail The Leader! Do NOT question The Leader, for he is infinitely wiser than we! He is privy to _Double Secret Information!_ The “well, they must know what they’re doing” argument is a sure path to disaster. Just look at where it’s gotten us lately. ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/32 "2004-07-26T14:37:03Z")
> [@Early Out](#): > > All Hail The Leader! Do NOT question The Leader, for he is infinitely wiser than we! He is privy to _Double Secret Information!_ > > The “well, they must know what they’re doing” argument is a sure path to disaster. Just look at where it’s gotten us lately. Goddammit, forgot I was in the Pit. Flame away. I’ll backtrack to forums that matter. (No, leaving is not a concession). Try another tact. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/33 "2004-07-26T14:51:08Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Try another tact. And if you can’t manage that, how about some simple courtesy? Maybe even a dash of politesse? Oh, wait – this is the Pit. Flame on. ---
**Author:** ![Early\_Out](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/34 "2004-07-26T14:51:49Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Goddammit, forgot I was in the Pit. Flame away. I’ll backtrack to forums that matter. (No, leaving is not a concession). Try another tact. It’s never dishonorable to retreat in the face of overwhelmingly superior forces. And in The Pit, tact is rarely called for, and even more rarely practiced. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/35 "2004-07-26T15:30:48Z")
> [@duffer](#): > > Goddammit, forgot I was in the Pit. Flame away. I’ll backtrack to forums that matter. (No, leaving is not a concession). Try another tact. You ought to follow your own advice since: 1-Spouting the same old tired Party Line. 2-Having it shot down immediatedly and as a result, 3-Getting indignant, flinging a lame-ass insult or two in lieu of any sort of rebuttal and 4-Fleeing with tail between legs… …is not exactly a great ‘tact’ either. Then again, I understand. You’ve got nothing else. Twit. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/36 "2004-07-26T16:23:55Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Twit. Not to be critical or anything, but I think you accidentally put an ‘i’ instead of an ‘a’. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/37 "2004-07-26T17:01:00Z")
You know, **duffer** , this was a moderately interesting and amusing thread until you hijacked with your rabid defense of Bush. OK, so you apparently think Bush is the greatest thing that happened to this country, and we should all get down on our knees and thank Jesus Christ, Himself that He saw fit to bless this country with such a marvelous and blessed leader (yes, I realize I’m probably exaggerating). I happen to disagree. On the other hand, people have been disagreeing with the idea that the current president is doing a wonderful job since the original George W., the guy who got stuck with the job of president the first time around. Look, I’m an independent whose just realized that I remain royally sick of _both_ major parties. I swear I might just see if I can locate a button which says “Vote Cthulu! Why settle for only the lesser of two evils?” People are going to disagree about Bush, just as they did about Clinton, Bush I, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, and so on back to Washington. Get over it, please! Oh, and **Mockingbird** , as the owner of one, I’d prefer **Red Fury** let the spelling stand. I may have a twat, but I assure you I’m not a twit. CJ Counting the days until yet another election is laid to rest, preferably with a stake through its heart! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![MrTuffPaws](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f475e1/32.png) [@MrTuffPaws](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrTuffPaws)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/38 "2004-07-26T17:26:38Z")
Honestly saw a plate on, of all things, a SUV that said “BUSH4MO” ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a5b964/32.png) [@Bill\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_H)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/39 "2004-07-26T17:34:28Z")
Well, the real answer isn’t “No Bush didn’t lie”, and it’s not “there were other people to blame as well”. The real answer is that Bush took some hard steps, against strong opposition, and as a direct result, the world is a better place. The real answer is that in a few years the mideast will have one of it’s first real democracies, where people have basic freedoms and don’t live in fear, as they did for decades. But… Can we please get back to talking about the silly person who hated Bush so much that he got a special license plate made to commemorate his ideas? I wonder if he named his kids Bush and Lied. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [July 26, 2004, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896/40 "2004-07-26T17:38:19Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > What make and model was the car? I’ve always been a bit curious as to what **Reeder** drives… Probably a Volkswagen bus with flowers all over it and smoke coming from the windows. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-dedication-to-ones-political-beliefs-bush-related/256896.md?page=3)