# Silly Lord of the Rings Thoughts **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** middle-earth\ **Created:** [July 9, 2023, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810 "2023-07-09T11:34:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/81 "2023-07-18T19:45:03Z")
> [@Mollie\_Magill](#): > > As I recall, only one Fire Spirit did not follow Melkor, and that one became the Sun. The Sun itself wasn’t a being, but there was a Maia named Arien who guided the Sun across the sky. [https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Sun](https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Sun) The Sun itself was a vessel that had a flower and a fruit from the Two Trees that used to provide light to the world. Though sometimes Arien (or her other names) was conflated with the Sun itself. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/82 "2023-07-18T20:52:25Z")
The Sun was a fruit of the golden tree, the Moon was a flower of the silver tree. Personally, I thought Tolkien got that backwards. I think the Moon looks more like a fruit than a flower. But, he didn’t ask my opinion. Perhaps he envisioned the waxing of the moon as a flower bud opening into a blossom. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/83 "2023-07-18T21:14:29Z")
Yeah - **Atamasama** jogged my memory. I has conflated Arien and the Fruit of the Golden Tree. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/84 "2023-07-18T23:52:58Z")
Why was Elrond called Half-elven? Weren’t his parents both half-elves? So technically he should be full-elven? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/85 "2023-07-19T00:09:56Z")
Haha! Although I do have a legitimate beef with the title. It’s technically accurate, however, he was given a choice from the Valar whether to live his life as an elf or a human. He chose to be an elf, unlike his [brother](https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Elros) who chose to become human (and was the first King of Numenor). So really, he’s an elf for all intents and purposes. (Elros was still granted a long lifespan and lived to be almost 450, but he was mortal nonetheless.) Elrond hasn’t really been a “half-elf” since the First Age. I wonder if at some point he wondered when people were just going to let it go and stop calling him that. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/86 "2023-07-19T13:46:12Z")
Maybe his ears aren’t pointy enough, and the kids in the playground never let him forget it. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/87 "2023-07-19T15:07:28Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Why was Elrond called Half-elven? Weren’t his parents both half-elves? So technically he should be full-elven? Elrond got ½ total genes from Mom (Elwing), and ½ total genes from Dad (Eärendil). Since they’re both half-elven, that means he got: ¼ elf genes from Mom + ¼ human genes from Mom + ¼ elf genes from Dad + ¼ human genes from Dad That means total ½ elf genes, and ½ human genes, so he’s half-elven, not elven. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/88 "2023-07-19T15:11:22Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > Elrond hasn’t really been a “half-elf” since the First Age. I wonder if at some point he wondered when people were just going to let it go and stop calling him that. Or WHO keeps calling him that. Does he just get an anonymous letter addressed to Elrond Half-Elven every so often and everyone else in Rivendell just assumes that’s his name and he’s not sure how to gently ask that they stop? And how much elven-ness lets you choose which to be, Man or Elf? This is entirely a nonsense question, I don’t need or expect an answer. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/89 "2023-07-19T15:55:08Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Elrond got ½ total genes from Mom (Elwing), and ½ total genes from Dad (Eärendil). > > Since they’re both half-elven, that means he got: > > ¼ elf genes from Mom + ¼ human genes from Mom + ¼ elf genes from Dad + ¼ human genes from Dad > > That means total ½ elf genes, and ½ human genes, so he’s half-elven, not elven. 9/16 elven, 3/8 human, 1/16 maiar, actually. [![](https://www.councilofelrond.com/albums/Elronds-Library/melian_tree.sized.jpg) ](https://www.councilofelrond.com/albums/Elronds-Library/melian_tree.sized.jpg) > [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > This is entirely a nonsense question, I don’t need or expect an answer. Of course you don’t need an answer. But you really should have expected one, from this bunch of nerds. It’s actually a somewhat contentious question, since Elros’ sons resented not having a choice and being stuck with their father’s choice, but Arwen, Elrond’s daughter, claimed that she did have a choice. Personally, I think that Arwen was just deluding herself, and that her fate was still that of the Elves: Notably, her eventual cause of bodily death was grief, which can happen for elves, but not for humans. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/90 "2023-07-19T15:59:47Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > 9/16 elven, okay, but even then “Elrond Half-Elven” is easier to say than “Elrond Nine-Sixteenths Elven”. A little rounding is acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/91 "2023-07-19T16:21:01Z")
“Elrond the Mutt” ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/92 "2023-07-19T16:21:06Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > > [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > > > Why was Elrond called Half-elven? Weren’t his parents both half-elves? So technically he should be full-elven? > > Elrond got ½ total genes from Mom (Elwing), and ½ total genes from Dad (Eärendil). > > Since they’re both half-elven, that means he got: > > ¼ elf genes from Mom + ¼ human genes from Mom + ¼ elf genes from Dad + ¼ human genes from Dad > > That means total ½ elf genes, and ½ human genes, so he’s half-elven, not elven. I’m not convinced that genetics are a thing in Middle Earth. It’s heritage that’s important, as noted by: > [@Chronos](#): > > It’s actually a somewhat contentious question, since Elros’ sons resented not having a choice and being stuck with their father’s choice, but Arwen, Elrond’s daughter, claimed that she did have a choice. That is, who your ancestors are and what they did matters, but there is no biological mechanism involved. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/93 "2023-07-19T17:16:52Z")
At least they don’t call him “Elrond Half a Man.” ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/94 "2023-07-19T17:41:37Z")
My silly LotR thought for the day is that we’ve adopted two kittens, and named them Meringue (Merry) and Pippin. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/95 "2023-07-19T17:44:36Z")
Have you had cause to say “Fool of a Took” yet? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/96 "2023-07-19T17:52:16Z")
No, we just adopted them yesterday. (although we’ve been fostering them for several weeks.) I expect it will come up, though. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/97 "2023-07-19T18:06:02Z")
You’ve had a kitten for a whole day already, and it still hasn’t managed to make a fool of itself? You’re sure this isn’t actually a dog? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/98 "2023-07-19T19:48:59Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > No, we just adopted them yesterday. Did I miss the pictures? Or are you just breaking all laws of God and men by withholding them? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/99 "2023-07-19T21:29:17Z")
I don’t have a photo site to host photos. But @What_Exit kindly posted a few photos for me in the what to name my kittens thread. Hang in and I’ll dig up a link. Eta: > [@Need names for kittens](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/need-names-for-kittens/986364): > > So, we plan to adopt a pair of kittens. We’ve been fostering them, and they came with names, but i don’t particularly like their names, and we’ve just learned that “Richard” is a girl. So I’m looking for something else. Preferably not human names, although my husband suggested “Blanche” for the girl, who is mostly white with little patches of gray tabby. My daughter suggested “Meringue” for that kitten, which would probably be shortened to “Meri”. We plan to keep this one. The others are all b… ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810/100 "2023-07-19T21:45:03Z")
Well, hopefully you won’t run into any Dragons. (I can’t imagine anyone naming a dog or cat Troll or Nazgûl). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/silly-lord-of-the-rings-thoughts/986810.md?page=6)