# Simple question..Why has the White House stonewalled the 9/11 investigation? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 1, 2004, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969 "2004-02-01T00:41:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/21 "2004-02-01T12:06:03Z")
I suspect politics plays a role. No, really. But given the “dumb luck” factor of the 9/11 attack I doubt anything is to be found that would directly embarass the Bushiviks. The plan was too fantastic for a Tom Clancy novel. I mean, come on! After forty years of airplane hijackings the goddam cockpit doors are _unlocked_?! We were stupid, and we paid for it. If the Bushiviks are smart, they would pour time and energy into this investigation, and rush to present unflattering truths. This will lend some desperately needed credibility when they attempt to keep the investigation into “intelligence failures” exclusively focused _outside_ the White House, as they investigate how Beloved Leader was woefully ill-served by the Intelligence Community. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/22 "2004-02-01T12:17:33Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > If the Bushiviks are smart, they would… So you’re telling us that they’re completely fucked? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/23 "2004-02-01T12:34:37Z")
Oh, dear. Have I stated the blindingly obvious as though it were some sort of revelation? Yes, it would appear that I have. I should certainly thank friend **Demo** for pointing this out. I should. Definitely. My admirers would expect it of me. Both of them. Alas. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/24 "2004-02-01T14:08:09Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Maybe the how is important, but the who? Doesn’t matter who. Besides, it IS Bush’s responsibility, if not his fault. He’s the boss. No matter how much he wants to palm off responsibility on others, it comes down to him, period. On this point I’m not willing to let him get away. The boss is always responsible, and so the boss gets the rap. As it is in the business world that he so loves to say he’s trying to emulate, as it is in this case. > > Realistically, even the how isn’t important. It’s perfectly obvious how it happened. What’s important is that we learn from whatever mistakes we may have made to facilitate the wackos that did it. Other than that? Doesn’t matter. > > You guys want a name? I’ll save you the time. George W. Bush, with a little help from Bill Clinton and George H.W. Bush, and maybe even a little Reagan since he started our little assistance deal to Afghanistan and helped to create the situation that created the monster Osama bin Laden. There, now we don’t have to waste any more time or money on this report trying to name a few names who will inevitably be some second-tier scapegoats like Ollie North was in the Iran/Contra deal. The who is important as well, because intelligence people who dropped the ball need to be evaluated for incompetence, and possible fired. If I screw up at my job, nobody dies but I still might get fired. If someone screws up who has the lives of their countrymen as risk, I think it might be a good idea to find out if they are not up to doing their job properly. ---
**Author:** ![vasyachkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/c5a1d2/32.png) [@vasyachkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vasyachkin)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/25 "2004-02-01T17:36:17Z")
Bush rightfully believes that the american people are idiots. he knows this for a fact because he keeps screwing us over and he’s still the most popular candidate for the 2004 election. In light of this he believes its smartest for him to keep treating us like dumb cattle and just keep lying to us about everything, like 9/11. he is probably right. ---
**Author:** ![Dream\_On](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@Dream\_On](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dream_On)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/26 "2004-02-01T18:15:00Z")
> [@Brutus](#): > > Regardless, [here](http://zapatopi.net/afdb.html) is an effective rebuttal to all those goofy 9-11 conspiracy stories. You obviously didn’t read the story, which is well documented with facts and evidence. I suggest you do that. Also, check out the links to what other news organizations said about it… [http://www.sundayherald.com/37707](http://www.sundayherald.com/37707) Thanks for your time. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/27 "2004-02-01T21:35:00Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > The who is important as well, because intelligence people who dropped the ball need to be evaluated for incompetence, and possible fired. > > If I screw up at my job, nobody dies but I still might get fired. If someone screws up who has the lives of their countrymen as risk, I think it might be a good idea to find out if they are not up to doing their job properly. But you can’t fire the President, and he won’t be impeached over this, so I reiterate that it’s a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/28 "2004-02-01T22:24:05Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > But you can’t fire the President, and he won’t be impeached over this, so I reiterate that it’s a waste of time. The public sure _can_ decide to fire him, if they feel he’s responsible. So I hardly see how it’s a waste of time. There’s an _election_ coming up, you know. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/29 "2004-02-01T22:45:15Z")
> [@Qadgop the Mercotan](#): > > The public sure _can_ decide to fire him, if they feel he’s responsible. So I hardly see how it’s a waste of time. There’s an _election_ coming up, you know. And with proof that he misled the American people about WMDs he still has an approval rating of greater than 50%. Do you really think that this report will greatly damage him by stating the obvious? Unless the Democrats put up a viable candidate, he could mow down everyone in the White House with a submachine gun and still be re-elected. You know it, and I know it. So I ask again, since we already know who’s ultimately responsible for what happened, what difference does it make? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/30 "2004-02-01T23:16:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Realistically, even the how isn’t important. It’s perfectly obvious how it happened. What’s important is that we learn from whatever mistakes we may have made to facilitate the wackos that did it. I guess all the report’s recommendations should be simply as follows, “Ok, you immigration folks, do a better job! This goes for you, too, intel analysts. And pilots, stop letting your planes get hijacked. Spooks, soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen, you guys must do a better job of killing folks before they kill us. Airport screeners, do more screening. In fact, screen the hell out of people. We can never have too much screening. Banks and Western Unions, stop letting terrorists use your services, or you’ll get some of this! [shaking fist]” Yup, I’m sure that will be the totality of the 9-11 commission’s report. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/31 "2004-02-01T23:34:21Z")
I don’t really think there is any potential for really bad news for the WH. The trouble for them is that there is virtually no chance at all of _good_ news. The attack happened, there is no credit to be awarded, only blame. As it happens, I don’t think the WH has any special blameworthiness as regards to 9/11, we were stupid, and we paid for it, a plot too ridiculous for a Tom Clancy novel worked, the Al-Keystone Kops pulled it off. But under present circumstances, any attempt by the Bushiviks to withold _anything_ has got to look bad. They must know this, they’ve got some serious political savvy in thier corner. So if they withold something, one can be forgiven for presuming its because revealing it would be worse damage than appearing to hide something. Oh, by the by, **Airman** …you might want to check some more recent polling. It aint looking so great. Myself, I’m considering ordering some new dancing shoes. I dance like a white boy, spasms of enthusiastic arythmia, but sometimes a patriot’s just _got_ to boogie! ---
**Author:** ![GirlWithATorch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ac8455/32.png) [@GirlWithATorch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GirlWithATorch)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2004, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/32 "2004-02-01T23:40:08Z")
> [@Nightime](#): > > Wouldn’t knowing what went wrong help in fixing it in the future? especially if it comes before November… ---
**Author:** ![pantom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/34f0e0/32.png) [@pantom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pantom)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/33 "2004-02-02T04:10:00Z")
Well, I for one am mostly interested in whether or not the FBI is now sharing its info with local law enforcement to the extent possible, firstly, and if they’re now actually paying attention to and coordinating the stuff that comes out of their field offices. I’m not really interested in apportioning blame at the Presidential level, especially since even without the report I’m quite certain they were asleep at the switch, regardless of whether that would have made any difference on that one day. For proof, look here (no one has any explanation for this, and I’ve never seen a debunking of this anywhere either. I’d actually like to see a debunking, since it really does seem too wacky to be true): [http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm](http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/34 "2004-02-02T04:33:56Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I guess all the report’s recommendations should be simply as follows, “Ok, you immigration folks, do a better job! This goes for you, too, intel analysts. And pilots, stop letting your planes get hijacked. Spooks, soldiers, sailors, Marines, and airmen, you guys must do a better job of killing folks before they kill us. Airport screeners, do more screening. In fact, screen the hell out of people. We can never have too much screening. Banks and Western Unions, stop letting terrorists use your services, or you’ll get some of this! [shaking fist]” > > Yup, I’m sure that will be the totality of the 9-11 commission’s report. > :rolleyes: Yep, that’s exactly it. I’m very impressed by your analysis. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/35 "2004-02-02T04:40:37Z")
As for your post, **pantom** : What’s there to debunk? It happened. Obviously the guy who posted that has his own spin to put on things, but it happened as stated. We actually had a discussion about this a long time ago, and my argument was pretty much this: So what? Since the damage was already done, what could have been gained by an extra five minutes? Gee, he could wring his hands like the rest of us for five whole minutes. Instead he stayed, and I frankly find that more reassuring because it was evidence that we didn’t have a guy who was going to go to pieces at the first sign of trouble. If he had ignored it for a few hours, THAT would have been a big deal, but hanging around for five minutes? Small change. It mattered not one bit. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/36 "2004-02-02T04:45:44Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > But you can’t fire the President, and he won’t be impeached over this, so I reiterate that it’s a waste of time. I was thinking more about FBI/CIA agents and employees. ---
**Author:** ![sinical\_brit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/48db29/32.png) [@sinical\_brit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sinical_brit)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/37 "2004-02-02T14:09:05Z")
Originally Posted by Airman Doors, USAF\> But you can’t fire the President, and he won’t be impeached over this, so I reiterate that it’s a waste of time. Doors - thats nearly as good as the "I, for one, am indifferent. Knowing who screwed up makes not a whit of difference to me. Let them finish the investigation. Or not. Doesn’t really matter. " statement ! Keep em comming lad - youre doing us proud!!! hahah sin ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/38 "2004-02-02T16:13:46Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > But under present circumstances, any attempt by the Bushiviks to withold _anything_ has got to look bad. Not necessarily. We have the precedent of the previous administration to go by, in which investigation after investigation was used simply as a tool of political and even personal harassment. It wouldn’t take all that much work for Cheney and Rove to get the insinuation across through their usual loyal outlets that any demands for investigations are just partisan politics as is now usual, intended mainly to embarrass the President. “Hey, we did it to them, now they’re just trying to do it to us.” ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/39 "2004-02-02T16:29:25Z")
> [@sinical brit](#): > > Originally Posted by Airman Doors, USAF\> > But you can’t fire the President, and he won’t be impeached over this, so I reiterate that it’s a waste of time. > > Doors - thats nearly as good as the "I, for one, am indifferent. Knowing who screwed up makes not a whit of difference to me. Let them finish the investigation. Or not. Doesn’t really matter. " statement ! > Keep em comming lad - youre doing us proud!!! > > hahah > > sin Where do you people come from? I said what I thought and I backed it up. How about you? All I see from you is a thinly veiled insult. Next time I have to read your dreck at least try to make it funny. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2004, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969/40 "2004-02-02T18:58:11Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Unless the Democrats put up a viable candidate, \ could mow down everyone in the White House with a submachine gun and still be re-elected. Hey, now you’re talkin’. If he shoots Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove, Perle, and Wolfowitz, _I’ll_ vote for him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/simple-question-why-has-the-white-house-stonewalled-the-9-11-investigation/226969.md?page=3)