# Singular, Plural, and Numbers **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [October 9, 2024, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605 "2024-10-09T14:36:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2024, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/21 "2024-10-11T20:59:29Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > It is in Russian that 2 to 4 things are still singular [genitive], I mean e.g. as in две девушки, so it takes at least 5 to be plural… (пять девушек) This reminds me of a joke I heard so long ago that unfortunately I can’t remember the detail. Some Russians stationed in a remote location needed to write back to Moscow to request some supplies. They wanted to ask for 7 fire tongs. After much deliberation, nobody was able to come up with the correct form of the word “семь щипцов? семь щипцы?". So the punchline is that they resorted to asking for “4 fire tongs and 3 fire tongs” because they were confident they knew it was 4 щипца. The actual story may not have been about tongs - I’m just using that as an example. To be funny, it would have to be a word that could plausibly be difficult for native speakers to ask for seven of. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2024, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/22 "2024-10-11T21:05:40Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > This beats even Russian for complexity. I’ll raise you Lithuanian, which has plural numbers. As in, the numerals themselves have plural forms. These are used with objects such as scissors that are plural, but also with years. Three apples is **trys** obuoliai but three years is **treji** metai. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2024, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/23 "2024-10-11T21:13:17Z")
There’s an English version where a zookeeper has to order two new specimens for the mongoose exhibit. He ends up requesting “a mongoose and another mongoose.” ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2024, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/24 "2024-10-11T21:15:43Z")
Lengths of measurement are also confusing. Why do we say somebody is five foot ten rather than five feet ten? ---
**Author:** ![md-2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9d8465/32.png) [@md-2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md-2000)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/25 "2024-10-12T01:38:50Z")
> [@hibernicus](#): > > I’ll raise you Lithuanian, which has plural numbers. As in, the numerals themselves have plural forms. These are used with objects such as scissors that are plural, but also with years. Three apples is **trys** obuoliai but three years is **treji** metai. We have that in English - a collection of groups of three could be referred to as “the class lined up in threes…” ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/26 "2024-10-12T01:59:11Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > A three hour tour, ♫ > …a three hour tour.♪ When my daughter was very young, she would tell us that Gramma had given her a “five dollars bill”. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/27 "2024-10-12T14:38:11Z")
> [@hibernicus](#): > > > [@DPRK](#): > > > > It is in Russian that 2 to 4 things are still singular [genitive], I mean e.g. as in две девушки, so it takes at least 5 to be plural… (пять девушек) > > This reminds me of a joke I heard so long ago that unfortunately I can’t remember the detail. Some Russians stationed in a remote location needed to write back to Moscow to request some supplies. They wanted to ask for 7 fire tongs. After much deliberation, nobody was able to come up with the correct form of the word “семь щипцов? семь щипцы?". So the punchline is that they resorted to asking for “4 fire tongs and 3 fire tongs” because they were confident they knew it was 4 щипца. > > The actual story may not have been about tongs - I’m just using that as an example. To be funny, it would have to be a word that could plausibly be difficult for native speakers to ask for seven of. I guess the point in this case is that with _pluralia tantum_ you have to use collective numerals, not regular cardinals. Or something… but wouldn’t native speakers know all that? In English you would know to ask for pairs of tongs, plus not to refer to a “tong”. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/28 "2024-10-12T15:53:03Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > I guess the point in this case is that with _pluralia tantum_ you have to use collective numerals, not regular cardinals. Or something… but wouldn’t native speakers know all that? In English you would know to ask for pairs of tongs, plus not to refer to a “tong”. I don’t think so, and that’s my fault for choosing an example where that could have been the reason. The story could have been about shovels - семь лопаты? семь лопат? семь лопаток?. The English version of the story about the mongoose is exactly parallel - it hinges on the native speakers not being sure what the correct plural form of a particular word is, because it’s in some way unusual. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/29 "2024-10-12T15:55:19Z")
> [@md-2000](#): > > We have that in English - a collection of groups of three could be referred to as “the class lined up in threes…” Yes, I didn’t explain it correctly because I don’t know the right terminology. It’s not that the number can be pluralised, like “nine threes” or “three nines”, although that is also true. What’s unique in Lithuanian is that there is a complete separate set of numbers used for certain words like pants and tongs. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2024, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605/30 "2024-10-12T19:02:59Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Lengths of measurement are also confusing. Why do we say somebody is five foot ten rather than five feet ten? even more so… if you go the whole nine yards 😉 he is five **foot** ten **inches**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/singular-plural-and-numbers/1008605.md?page=1)