# Situation in South Africa (Malema and Terre'blanche aftermath) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 7, 2010, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243 "2010-04-07T04:02:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/1 "2010-04-07T04:02:41Z")
Okay, I know every couple months we have a [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=551864) on South Africa in which non-South Africans fret about the future of the country while locals assure us that things are going pretty well, thanks. So apologies in advance if this thread follows that same pattern. …But still, I got to ask. The latest news from the country just seems so grim. First Julius Malema singing the “shoot the Boer” song in Zimbabwe, and expressing his desire to [nationalize](http://www.mg.co.za/article/2010-04-04-malema-we-want-the-mines) SA’s mines and follow parts of Zimbabwe’s economic policies. I’d dismiss him as a buffoon, if I hadn’t read on [Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Malema) that Jacob Zuma called him the “future leader” of South Africa. Then, of course, the murder of [Eugene Terre’blanche](http://www.mg.co.za/article/2010-04-04-zuma-calls-for-calm-after-terreblanche-murder). I can’t imagine he’ll be much missed, but at the same time it doesn’t bode well for race relations. So what’s the truth on the ground, South African dopers? Another case of the foreign media hyping things beyond recognition? How powerful is Malema, how likely is he to hold power in the future, and what would that mean? Are things noticeably more tense since Terre’blanche’s murder? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/2 "2010-04-07T04:35:03Z")
Actually, it was Mathale who called Malema “the future leader” of ZA, not Zuma. ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/3 "2010-04-07T05:19:09Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > Actually, it was Mathale who called Malema “the future leader” of ZA, not Zuma. Well, Wiki’s [source](http://www.sowetan.co.za/Columnists/FrankTalk/Article.aspx?id=1121062) says they both did (though it doesn’t give a full quote), and a Google search has [others](http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/south-africa/100309/south-africa-rocked-high-living-politician) [supporting](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/southafrica/7530497/Zumas-heir-blamed-for-inciting-attacks-on-South-Africas-white-farmers.html) the idea (though, again I don’t see an actual quote). Even so, the news reports show that Zuma is largely supportive of him, though I’d be glad to learn that’s not the case! ---
**Author:** ![Chen019](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f19dbf/32.png) [@Chen019](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chen019)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/4 "2010-04-07T07:10:41Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > Are things noticeably more tense since Terre’blanche’s murder? A South African girl at my work considers that things will get worse as there will be retaliation for the murder. Her family are Afrikaner and she considers Terre’blanche was basically a good man trying to do the right thing for his people. ---
**Author:** ![grimpixie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@grimpixie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grimpixie)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/5 "2010-04-07T08:21:19Z")
I have to say that, from being one of those locals who dismissed foreigner’s worries, I am now becoming increasingly concerned. Malema seems intent on sticking his oar in every available pot and stirring as much as possible and although there are those within the ANC trying to rein him in, he turns that to his advantage with talk of conspiracy to silence him. Because he says such attention grabbing things, he gets lots of coverage in the media (albeit negative) and I wonder whether his influence is over-estimated as a result, but it is concerning nonetheless. The AWB has, so far, reacted maturely and calmly, after some talk of retaliation and retribution straight after the murder, the new leadership has come out and spoken of that being an emotional response and how they want justice to take its course. All that may change if the sentence turns out to be a lenient one - which it may well, the suspects turned themselves in and have confessed and there appears to have been a history of abuse and mistreatment by Terre’Blanche toward his employees. > [@Chen019](#): > > Her family are Afrikaner and she considers Terre’blanche was basically a good man trying to do the right thing for his people. It was very interesting reading interviews with residents of Ventersdorp and its neighbouring township - the black residents could barely contain their joy at the news as they told stories of his horrendous actions, the white residents said things like “he was a difficult man” which I read as code for “yes he was a bastard, but let’s not speak ill of the dead”. I imagine Ventersdorp will be a difficult place to live for the next little while… ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 9:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/6 "2010-04-07T09:54:15Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > A South African girl at my work considers that things will get worse as there will be retaliation for the murder. There might be an incident or two, but Terreblanche was basically a has-been in politics at this point. Completely insignificant. He’s no martyr. > [@](#): > > Her family are Afrikaner and she considers Terre’blanche was basically a good man trying to do the right thing for his people. She’s wrong. He was a racist fuckwit, and a thug at that. I don’t believe in karma, but he did die pretty much as a result of the way he lived. He was _not_ a good man. I’m not particularly worried about the future as far as SA politics goes. Malema is a buffoon, but even if he did become president (which I sincerely doubt), there’s only so much damage he can do, as he’s actively hated by both the Communists and the trade unionists who form the rest of the alliance with the ANC. ---
**Author:** ![yendis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ed8c4c/32.png) [@yendis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yendis)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/7 "2010-04-07T10:01:43Z")
> [@Chen019](#): > > A South African girl at my work considers that things will get worse as there will be retaliation for the murder. > > Her family are Afrikaner and she considers Terre’blanche was basically a good man trying to do the right thing for his people. Terre’Blanche was a bigoted lunatic with questionable horseriding skills. He dropped out of public consciousnes after he went to jail and has only cropped up again because of his death. There may be some violence from whites looking for an excuse but for the bulk of the country this will be forgotten after a week and will merit a brief mention when the murder trial eventually concludes. There have been a number of people in the local press who are going on about this starting some sort of violent anti government movement, one hysterical woman raving about a civil war, but the police have already stepped in to control the situation and even the slightest hint of violence will lead to a crackdown. Asd for Malema, he is the \*elected \*leader of the ANC Youth League, as such has to spout whatever drivel will keep his supporters happy and keep him in power. Once he reaches the age limit for League leadership he will have to try and gain the support of the very politicians he is now pissing off if he hopes to actually get into government. As for nationalising the mines or forceably appropriating farms it will never happen because that will destroy the economy and no business means no taxes which makes politicians unhappy. I have mentioned this in other threads about SA but it bears repeating. The SA press is now just as open and unresricted as in other democratic countries. The result of course is that they go for the sensational, everything is a world ending crisis because that is what the public wants to hear and that is what sells papers. ETA: > [@MrDibble](#): > > He was a racist fuckwit, and a thug at that. I don’t believe in karma, but he did die pretty much as a result of the way he lived. He was _not_ a good man. Or what MrDibble said. ---
**Author:** ![grimpixie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@grimpixie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grimpixie)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 10:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/8 "2010-04-07T10:55:12Z")
> [@yendis](#): > > Once he reaches the age limit for League leadership he will have to try and gain the support of the very politicians he is now pissing off if he hopes to actually get into government. Is there an age limit - their website only says “Membership of the ANCYL is open to all South Africans **above the age of 18 years** , irrespective of race, colour and creed, who accept its principles, policies and programmes and are prepared to abide by its Constitution and rules.” (bolding mine) ---
**Author:** ![yendis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ed8c4c/32.png) [@yendis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yendis)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/9 "2010-04-07T11:56:13Z")
> [@grimpixie](#): > > Is there an age limit - their website only says “Membership of the ANCYL is open to all South Africans **above the age of 18 years** , irrespective of race, colour and creed, who accept its principles, policies and programmes and are prepared to abide by its Constitution and rules.” (bolding mine) I think it is 35, or at least I remember hearing such when the previous YL leader had to step down for being to old but I can’t find an official cite. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/10 "2010-04-07T12:03:10Z")
I think the lesson here is this: if you’re a bigot who considers a certain race inferior, don’t go hiring employees of that race, and if you do, don’t forget to pay them. Terre’blanche was a bit of a Darwin Award nominee, wasn’t he? ---
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/11 "2010-04-07T12:03:12Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I’m not particularly worried about the future as far as SA politics goes. Malema is a buffoon, but even if he did become president (which I sincerely doubt), there’s only so much damage he can do, as he’s actively hated by both the Communists and the trade unionists who form the rest of the alliance with the ANC. Why do the Communists and trade unions hate him? > [@yendis](#): > > As for nationalising the mines or forceably appropriating farms it will never happen because that will destroy the economy and no business means no taxes which makes politicians unhappy. Hopefully, but that hasn’t stopped it happening in other countries! ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/12 "2010-04-07T12:08:18Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I think the lesson here is this: if you’re a bigot who considers a certain race inferior, don’t go hiring employees of that race, and if you do, don’t forget to pay them. > > Terre’blanche was a bit of a Darwin Award nominee, wasn’t he? That is poetic enough to be a [Fark](http://www.fark.com) headline. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/13 "2010-04-07T14:01:39Z")
> [@Rodgers01](#): > > So what’s the truth on the ground, South African dopers? Another case of the foreign media hyping things beyond recognition? I don’t get it. Three thousand white farmers have been killed since the end of Apartheid and we hear very little about it. What’s one more boer ? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Excellent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f19dbf/32.png) [@Mr.Excellent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Excellent)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/14 "2010-04-07T14:09:42Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I think the lesson here is this: if you’re a bigot who considers a certain race inferior, don’t go hiring employees of that race, and if you do, don’t forget to pay them. > > Terre’blanche was a bit of a Darwin Award nominee, wasn’t he? Did he have kids? Wikipedia doesn’t say. If so, no Darwin Award. ---
**Author:** ![orcenio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/orcenio/32/1036_2.png) [@orcenio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/orcenio)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/15 "2010-04-07T14:24:52Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > I don’t get it. Three thousand white farmers have been killed since the end of Apartheid and we hear very little about it. What’s one more boer ? You forgot to note that when it comes to South Africa… [ > [@](#): > > But then about 50 people - mostly black - are murdered each day in this country. ]([BBC News - Race hate lives on in 'rainbow nation'](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/8605846.stm)) Also, seeing that this particular murder was about money (a personal, not political, reason) I don’t think it’s “open season” on Boers. ---
**Author:** ![yendis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ed8c4c/32.png) [@yendis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yendis)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/16 "2010-04-07T16:04:14Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > I don’t get it. Three thousand white farmers have been killed since the end of Apartheid and we hear very little about it. What’s one more boer ? Quite a bit was said about it back when it was still happening at epidemic levels. In fact it was so bad that the government even started training a special rapid reaction police unit to deal with it, they even went so far as to look at using paratrooper policeman to speed up reaction times. Farm murders are no longer the serious issue they were _ten+_ years ago. And of course it must be remembered that the attacks on farms also often targeted \*black \*farm employees in adition to the white owners. The precise reasons for the brutal farm attacks are still not known but they where far more complex than angry natives want to kill helpless whites. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/17 "2010-04-07T20:31:44Z")
I knew I dealt with the supposedly shocking farm murder stats [recently](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12123241&postcount=40). Funny how it keeps coming up, though. It’s like there’s some sort of playbook or something… ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/18 "2010-04-09T11:14:50Z")
The ANC just issued [a press release](http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1&click_id=13&art_id=nw20100409120026493C137365) that’s a pretty direct slap-down of Malema: > [@](#): > > The ANC strongly condemns the behaviour of ANC Youth League President, cde Julius Malema, towards a BBC TV journalist, John Fisher (sic), at yesterday (April, 07, 2010) ANC Youth League press briefing. The aggressive and insultive behaviour to the said journalist that culminated with Mr Fisher walking out of the Youth League press briefing cannot be condoned at all. > > The unfortunate outburst by cde Julius Malema did not only reflect negatively on him, but also reflected negatively on the ANC YL, the entire ANC family, our Alliance partners as well as South Africa in the eyes of the international community. > > […] > > The ANC would also like to strongly disagree and distance itself from utterances by the ANC YL at their press conference yesterday that they will support President Robert Mugabe and his Zanu PF to win the forthcoming general elections in Zimbabwe. > > The ANC stance on the Zimbabwe issue is that we fully support the mediation process that is currently underway, which is led and facilitated by President Jacob Zuma. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/19 "2010-04-09T22:02:56Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I knew I dealt with the supposedly shocking farm murder stats [recently](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12123241&postcount=40). Funny how it keeps coming up, though. It’s like there’s some sort of playbook or something… Well I find it shocking. Pick any ethnic minority in my country (Canada), and 3000 murders of a particular ethnic group over a 16 year period would get a hell of a lot of attention, even if money was stolen in the process. And what’s even more shocking is yiour high homicide rate in general. There’s no playbook, my dear, there’s just the horrible facts that won’t go away. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 9, 2010, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243/20 "2010-04-09T22:49:54Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > Well I find it shocking. > > Pick any ethnic minority in my country (Canada), and 3000 murders of a particular ethnic group over a 16 year period would get a hell of a lot of attention, even if money was stolen in the process. The murder rate among aboriginals in Canada is quite a lot higher than among whites in South Africa. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/situation-in-south-africa-malema-and-terreblanche-aftermath/535243.md?page=2)