# Skill that human kind has lost **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 16, 2017, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381 "2017-07-16T09:42:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/21 "2017-07-16T21:47:23Z")
> [@Senegoid](#): > > Cursive handwriting may be well on the way. > > Candidate for Ken Ham’s next big project! And the taxpayers of Kentucky can be repaid from the fees for storing grain! ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/22 "2017-07-16T23:14:02Z")
Making of Stradivarius violins, maybe? I think there are certain sword-forging techniques that we have managed to duplicate. ---
**Author:** ![Claude\_Remains](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/898d66/32.png) [@Claude\_Remains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claude_Remains)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/23 "2017-07-16T23:50:22Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > There are two different kinds of “we don’t know how they did it”. The first is “we can’t think of any way to do this”, and that’s incredibly rare. I don’t know of any specific examples of it, though there might be a few. > > The second is “We can think of lots of ways to do this, but we don’t know which of them they used”. This is quite common, but it certainly doesn’t mean that the ancients were smarter than us. We probably have stumbled on the method they used, but just don’t know it. Would this be a good time to insert Occam’s Razor? ---
**Author:** ![FordPrefect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@FordPrefect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordPrefect)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/24 "2017-07-16T23:53:35Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Making of Stradivarius violins, maybe? I think that has less to do with technique and more to do with the lack of old growth forests. But, I may be completely off my rocker. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/25 "2017-07-17T00:28:58Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > Pyramid-building using technology and methods available 4000 years ago, as well as quarrying and transport of the stones. There are theories, but no definitive answers, and no one is willing now to try a full-scale replica of the process. That falls into the category of ‘we know several ways to do it, but we can’t be entirely sure which one they used’. We know how to quarry stones with what they knew at the time, and how to move and work stone. We don’t use those techniques anymore because we have much better ways to quarry, move, and work stone, but it doesn’t make it a deep mystery. No one is willing to try a full-scale replica of the process because it’s absurdly expensive and would take decades, and in the end all you’d get for the investment is ‘look, we did something we know how to do’. ---
**Author:** ![Claude\_Remains](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/898d66/32.png) [@Claude\_Remains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claude_Remains)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/26 "2017-07-17T00:31:58Z")
> [@FordPrefect](#): > > I think that has less to do with technique and more to do with the lack of old growth forests. But, I may be completely off my rocker. You’r right on for the same reason Gibson guitar snobs are sitting on wet,bunched up panties. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/27 "2017-07-17T00:48:57Z")
> [@wintertime](#): > > 1. If a resource within our environment is not present any longer, we can’t reproduce its result. We might reproduce its function but not the thing itself, not perfectly. Even though it’s been well-documented in Greco-Roman literature, cultivation and use of the herb silphium has been lost, because the plant is extinct. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/28 "2017-07-17T01:15:17Z")
I believe there are some pottery techniques in China that ended up getting lost due to being secret to certain towns or areas. The secrets were kept and eventually disappeared. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/29 "2017-07-17T01:52:47Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Making of Stradivarius violins, maybe? I think there are certain sword-forging techniques that we have managed to duplicate. Blind tests [like this](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/05/08/great-stradivarius-fiddle-modern-violins-sound-good-old-italians/) have found that modern violins sound as good as a Strad. ---
**Author:** ![davida03801](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5e925/32.png) [@davida03801](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davida03801)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/30 "2017-07-17T11:51:58Z")
I believe that certain Roman Concrete mixtures with superior qualities have not yet been replicated. There are other threads that discuss this. I also believe that the art of using hand tools to cut large rock to precise measurements for use in walls, such as the Inca did, is no longer with us. [Such as this… the Twelve Angle Stone:](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twelve_angle_stone) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/31 "2017-07-17T12:10:06Z")
I’m sure that cutting the Twelve-Angle Stone must have required diligent work, but would it really have been any more difficult than cutting [this piece of shaped stone](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_(Michelangelo)) using hand tools? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/32 "2017-07-17T15:01:33Z")
I think the techniques taught to castrati falls in this category. While there is a [recording of a castrato](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLjvfqnD0ws), [modern day counter-tenors](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfrxOKcAkNI) use the [techniques](http://www.voiceteacher.com/counter_Tenor.html) of female sopranos or men sing falsetto. The techniques taught to Baroque castrato take advantage of the full power a man can use to sing that high along with the uniqueness a true castrato’s voice has. The clip to Moreschi above compared to Marian gives but a hint of that difference. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/33 "2017-07-17T15:24:17Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > Doubtful because the general characteristics are pretty well known and anyone duplicating them in the past 1,200 years would have bragged, “Hey! I’ve reinvented Greek fire!” rather than, “Look at this nifty, horrible weapon I’ve invented.” There were lots of types of incendiary weapons “fire” weapons used at the time. We don’t know _what_ the Eastern Romans ( I refuse to call them Byzantines) used; or whether they used multiple types over the centuries. They were not the only ones who used incendiary weapons, the Abbasids also did, and we know they used different types of weapon, whose recipes have survived, from a quicklime based substance for use at sea to a sticky petroleum based one for use in land combat (basically napalm) called _Naft_, delivered by special troops in fire resistant clothing. ---
**Author:** ![davida03801](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b5e925/32.png) [@davida03801](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davida03801)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/34 "2017-07-19T11:56:21Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’m sure that cutting the Twelve-Angle Stone must have required diligent work, but would it really have been any more difficult than cutting [this piece of shaped stone](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_(Michelangelo)) using hand tools? Two vastly different skill sets for different functions and with different tools. Michelangelo had iron tools on marble which is a soft stone. Also the David Statue did not have to be moved and set in place and aligned with many other stones. The Inca walls were built with fieldstone which is much harder than marble with stone and copper tools. Once cut to the measurements, then the stones were moved and lifted into place with only man power. They were set in a dry lay, meaning no mortar. Multiples stones in the wall all cut to precise tolerances. I believe that skill set is lost these days. Could we build the walls sure, but with modern tools and machinery. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/35 "2017-07-19T15:10:45Z")
Is anybody still memorizing novel-length epic poems anymore? I mean, I suspect people _could_, if they tried really hard and practiced a lot, but do they? Becoming a Homeric bard was probably a lifetime of work in pre-literate days. Also, I’m not just talking about memorizing a long _written_ text, but memorizing a novel’s worth of what someone _else_ memorized and merely spoke out loud to you on several occasions. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/36 "2017-07-19T15:48:31Z")
There are things that people used to do but we can’t, but that’s because there is no longer any need to learn or train to do it. One example is using an English longbow. To pull a longbow fully takes years of training and is best started at puberty to allow the build up of the proper muscles and the skeleton to support them. In 1363 all Englishmen were ordered to practice archery on Sunday and holidays. ---
**Author:** ![JohnGalt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johngalt/32/184_2.png) [@JohnGalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnGalt)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/37 "2017-07-19T16:00:34Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > There are things that people used to do but we can’t, but that’s because there is no longer any need to learn or train to do it. > > One example is using an English longbow. To pull a longbow fully takes years of training and is best started at puberty to allow the build up of the proper muscles and the skeleton to support them. In 1363 all Englishmen were ordered to practice archery on Sunday and holidays. The Minneapolis-St. Paul Sunday paper this week had an article in their Science section (yay science!) about the lost art of make concrete the way the Romans did, using volcanic ash. There’s something about their materials that’s impervious to salt-water erosion and corrosion that researchers are trying to figure out. They point out that these 2000-year old structures are still standing in saltwater, while modern concrete structures with steel rebars corrode very quickly. The reason for the research is how to build sea walls that can hold back the sea for the expected rise of the oceans. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/38 "2017-07-19T17:38:06Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Is anybody still memorizing novel-length epic poems anymore? I mean, I suspect people _could_, if they tried really hard and practiced a lot, but do they? Becoming a Homeric bard was probably a lifetime of work in pre-literate days. Also, I’m not just talking about memorizing a long _written_ text, but memorizing a novel’s worth of what someone _else_ memorized and merely spoke out loud to you on several occasions. Actors memorize Shakespeare’s plays (and others of course) all the time. They may play only one part, but they usually come to memorize the whole thing with repetition. Our memorization skills have not really atrophied, so much as we simply don’t use them generally. I tend to think that writing and other tech has made us less reliant on memory so we don’t use it as much. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/39 "2017-07-19T18:48:16Z")
Shakespeare’s longest play, Hamlet, has about 30,000 words. In contrast, Homer’s two poems together contain about 270,000 words. Your point stands though, that modern people probably _could_ memorize it, they just don’t. ---
**Author:** ![JR\_Brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d6d6ee/32.png) [@JR\_Brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JR_Brown)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2017, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381/40 "2017-07-19T19:08:22Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > Shakespeare’s longest play, Hamlet, has about 30,000 words. In contrast, Homer’s two poems together contain about 270,000 words. > > Your point stands though, that modern people probably _could_ memorize it, they just don’t. Judging from performances in cultures where people still tell long stories from oral history, it is unlikely anyone memorized more than short passages verbatim (and without the ability to write down what was said, it would be impossible to check anyway). The storyteller would know the plot, and all the important details, and some key scenes or famous lines might be rendered in relatively invariant language, but all the connecting parts would be ad lib’d. We think of the Homeric poems as unitary works because they were passed down to us as a collection of relatively similar documents that appear to have all originated from a single written copy, but that one copy may have been taken down from an oral performance by a single individual on a single occasion, which says nothing about the consistency of performance across people or time. It would still require an impressive feat of memorization, but not nearly to the extent of reciting a couple of book’s worth of content verbatim. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/skill-that-human-kind-has-lost/791381.md?page=3)