# Slimy men and their slimy words. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 21, 2017, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333 "2017-11-21T23:23:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/41 "2017-11-22T16:42:35Z")
> [@Claude\_Remains](#): > > That post demonstrates the fact that I was propositioned by a female manager at work and blew the whistle only to be teased and ridiculed by male co-workers. So you would agree that the problem here is men. Right? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/42 "2017-11-22T17:09:02Z")
> [@Claude\_Remains](#): > > That post demonstrates the fact that I was propositioned by a female manager at work and blew the whistle only to be teased and ridiculed by male co-workers. Hey, me too, sorta. I was propositioned by a male manager, and was the object of frequent jokes and comments about my breasts. I complained, and got pressured into removing my complaint, because it would “cause problems” for the manager. I ended up being moved to a terrible position. The point being that you sound like a whiny child. Clearly the event scarred you, because you mention it everywhere. I want to be sympathetic, but I can’t. The mockery of your peers isn’t even close to enough. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/43 "2017-11-22T18:15:16Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > So you would agree that the problem here is men. Right? When I was working in the entertainment industry, there was one famous celebrity that I was warned about on a couple of occasions. This performer had a reputation for being handsy with women on the crew and not taking no for answer. I never worked with this person so I have no idea if the rumors were true. However, the celebrity under discussion was female. ---
**Author:** ![Crazy\_Canuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazy_canuck/32/5282_2.png) [@Crazy\_Canuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazy_Canuck)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/44 "2017-11-22T18:46:24Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > I want to be sympathetic, but I can’t. This sums up exactly how I feel about the OP. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/45 "2017-11-22T18:50:23Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Yes, Al Franklin. And Charlie Rose. And Lassiter, Weinstein, Spacey. All of them. > > EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. I’m not sure what “every single one” is supposed to mean in this context, but if you’re painting all men with the same broad brush, then I disagree and I think it’s unfortunate because I’m very sympathetic to your basic position and argument. It’s no coincidence that all these revelations are coming out at the same time; it’s a problem that has long existed and there’s been a tremendous amount of coverup going on. All of this is true, and these low-lifes are getting what they richly deserve. I just think it’s unfortunate that your anger is causing you to lump all men into that same category. That’s simply not the case. I just can’t imagine myself, or most men I know, acting that way, and I think most would resent being told that they just don’t know themselves well enough when in fact in their value system any notion of unwanted sexual advances on a woman would be not just wrong, but unthinkable. Yes, sexual abuse is a lot more common than many have previously supposed, but that’s still many long country miles from being universal. To assume that every male is like that is no different than any other kind of offensive prejudice, a personal type categorization set up to be sneered at and feared, even if many or most members of the group are entirely innocent. In the same spirit, while I condemn the things that Al Franken did, it’s counterproductive and undermines the power of your argument to claim that he is the equal of a Weinstein or a Moore, who were actual predators. As someone else said, such false equivalencies hamper progress. If you claim that a murderer and a litterer should both be equally condemned as lawbreakers, your argument has far less value than one that is more appropriately nuanced. Hey, I’m totally on your side. I’m just trying to defuse what appears to be – unless I’ve misread it – an unproductive “I hate all men” argument. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/46 "2017-11-22T19:05:03Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Trump said being a Democrat was worse than being a child-rapist. Unlike most of us, Trump’s been both so we would should respect his judgment on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/47 "2017-11-22T19:09:59Z")
> [@Claude\_Remains](#): > > Too bad folks aren’t this pissed off and talking about events in their own lives instead of jumping on the bandwagon. Sexual harassment is an event in a lot of people’s lives. It just doesn’t make headlines in cases where it doesn’t involve a celebrity. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/48 "2017-11-22T19:38:53Z")
I’ve got to admit I’ve struggled with it lately. On the one hand, I try not to discount anyone’s feeling and experiences. I have a friend that was deeply traumatized by a workplace incident ( her boss putting his hand on her rear) that I felt I would have easily deflected. But I know her feelings were genuine. But it’s hard for me to equate that story to those of women I know that were actually raped - even though some of them tried to shake it off and I know one that tried to turn it into a joke “I said no but he just HELPED HIMSELF” But some of the #me too stuff has given me pause. Like the woman who shared the story of a guy that she met on Match that leaned in and tried to kiss her after the 3rd date even though she had told him she only wanted to be friends. But I think it’s more about power abuse than gender. The stories in my background that make me angry are not the ones about advances I fielded and rejected, they are stories about the women who DID play along and slept with the bosses and got raises and promotions that weren’t available to me because I didn’t put out. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/49 "2017-11-22T19:41:22Z")
> [@outlierrn](#): > > As are you, I believe that conflating Franken and Weinstein hampers progress. Let’s remember that this **OP** is the same poster who, just a month ago, argued adamantly that a teen-age boy should be arrested, charged, and prosecuted for pinching a teen-age girl on the butt. [Here and elsewhere in that thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20546723#post20546723) She also argued in the same post that, with coerced apologies and sufficient groveling, charges could be dropped and everyone could move on. Others in that thread (e.g., [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=20550623#post20550623)) saw a direct line between that kid and Harvey Weinstein. Several other posters likewise saw no distinction between a teen-age butt pinch and all-out criminal sexual assault. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/50 "2017-11-22T19:50:49Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Let’s focus on the progress that’s being made and not how far we still need to go. Uh, so far, the only progress I see being made is that women are free to express how fucking angry they are. Are you breaking out the champagne now? ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/51 "2017-11-22T20:36:45Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Apparently even Franken’s apology (which was about as non-weaselly as you can get without falling to the floor, immediately confessing to everything, and committing seppuku) Franken’s apology is extremely weaselly. The only thing he actually admits to doing is the picture, which there’s really no denying since it’s a picture. He doesn’t confirm or deny either the tongue kissing or butt-grabbing, he just says that he’s sorry they feel bad about whatever it was that he did. The first and last items you list are clearly hyperbole, and the middle one is exactly what he didn’t do - admit to the wrongdoing that is supposedly being apologized for. If I’m accused of stealing cookies and a slice of cake, and there’s a picture of me eating the cake, the Franken-style apology would be something like “It was definitely wrong of me to take that picture of the cake. And I’m sorry that you feel that your cookies are missing, but I don’t remember the cookie presence issue the same way.” See how hollow it is? There’s no apology for the actual action of stealing cookies, just that I’m sorry that you have feelings about the cookies. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/52 "2017-11-22T20:45:04Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > The only thing he actually admits to doing is the picture, which there’s really no denying since it’s a picture. Not been paying much attention to political news, lately? (i.e. “That picture’s ‘fake news’!”) ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/53 "2017-11-22T21:33:48Z")
> [@2nd\_Law](#): > > I hope the OP comes back to clarify regarding Moore. And let’s hear what he has to say about Trump as well. I believe those two belong on the list. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/54 "2017-11-22T22:24:06Z")
You’d think that after YEARS of being told by men, including in threads on this board, that sexual harassment was not really that common, not that big a deal, not even a thing because nobody they knew did stuff like that…that famous video of that walking woman getting the catcalls must’ve been faked, and golly gee, all those women making false rape accusations… After all this, you’d think I’d be THRILLED to be proven right about the prevalence of sexual harassment all along. I’m not. I’m just tired. And disgusted. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/55 "2017-11-22T23:34:35Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > It’s because this attitude screams “witch hunt”. Men aren’t allowed to defend themselves against allegations of sexual harassment. Men aren’t allowed to dispute that that’s what really happened. Apparently even Franken’s apology (which was about as non-weaselly as you can get without falling to the floor, immediately confessing to everything, and committing seppuku) was not good enough, and just slimy words. The pendulum can swing too far. Sez the guy who gets off on and posted regularly about [molesting underage, mentally challenged, gender-confused kids](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=661026%22). Your defense of Franken just shows the kind of pervert you are. And btw: Moore is a fucking douchebag Franken is a fucking douchebag Weinstein is a fucking douchebag Trump is a fucking douchebag. What part of “Don’t fucking harass women”, _REGARDLESS OF YOUR GODDAMN POLITICS_ is so hard for diseased sickos like you to get? ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/56 "2017-11-22T23:43:23Z")
> [@elbows](#): > > Going to take a leave of absence and reflect are you? Didn’t realize you were being inappropriate? Recognise now that your innocent actions _could_ be misinterpreted? What a steaming pile of freshly dumped horseshit you are. > > You think you’re making it better, but your slimy rationalizations and carefully chosen references to missteps, and errors, and over friendliness scream what an oily shit you really are. No one is fooled by your being artistic or comedic, or whatever other lame excuse you’re telling yourself to mitigate your responsibility. > > You are transparently only regretful because you’ve been caught out. And no one believes your horseshit. Any more than they believe it was only a few times, or wasn’t 100% exploitive in every possible way. You attained both power and success and this is what you chose to use it for. CHOSE. You don’t get to back away from that reality you scumbag. > > Dance around it all you want, you piece of shit, we can all see who you really are. I hope the stench of this never leaves you and that you never, ever get to make another piece of art, represent your constituents, or be famous for anything other than the piece of human trash you clearly are. > > You are just as disgusting as the creeper who grooms a kid from a dysfunctional home, in every way, You have power and will exploit it to your sexual advantage, given the opportunity. You are the very worst kind of scum. > > You fully deserve to forfeit your place in the sun for all time. Fuck your art and your career, you deserve to lose it all and I for one am praying to all the Gods that be that you get exactly what you so righteously deserve. You steaming piles of shit! Am I really that transparent? … ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/57 "2017-11-22T23:53:24Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > Sez the guy who gets off on and posted regularly about [molesting underage, mentally challenged, gender-confused kids](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=661026%22). Your defense of Franken just shows the kind of pervert you are. Gimme a break! An 18yo with a 16yo GF, does not a child molester make.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/58 "2017-11-23T00:23:35Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Uh, so far, the only progress I see being made is that women are free to express how fucking angry they are. Are you breaking out the champagne now? And a few weeks later people are complaining that they’re tired of hearing about it, it’s a manufactured controversy, women are sharing their stories just to take part in the frenzy, and not because anything _really_ happened. I wonder how long any one will be empowered to keep sharing. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/59 "2017-11-23T01:06:55Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > Gimme a break! An 18yo with a 16yo GF, does not a child molester make.:rolleyes: Didn’t read the thread, did you? > [@Hun, Please tell me your mom will throw you out for having a boyfriend \_before\_ I become your first](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/hun-please-tell-me-your-mom-will-throw-you-out-for-having-a-boyfriend-_before_-i-become-your-first/630522/44): > > Slight epilogue: she told her mom she wanted to be with me and now I’m not allowed to see her any more. I went to her house to try to say goodbye, and her mom told me “Oh, you’re fine, you’ve done nothing wrong. It’s just that she isn’t ready to have a boyfriend; she has developmental disorders, and she isn’t 15 like she told you”. > > …She told me she was 16… I’m not even going to think too hard about that. So…she’s not 16, she’s not 15, and he doesn’t want to “think too hard” about the fact that she had to be 14 or less. And he’s bragged about other kids he’s done it to. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2017, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333/60 "2017-11-23T06:57:13Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > Didn’t read the thread, did you? > So…she’s not 16, she’s not 15, and he doesn’t want to “think too hard” about the fact that she had to be 14 or less. > > And he’s bragged about other kids he’s done it to. Well then, I take back my rolleyes. My apologies. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/slimy-men-and-their-slimy-words/802333.md?page=4)