# SmashTheState **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 30, 2009, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731 "2009-07-30T01:00:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/101 "2009-07-30T22:54:06Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Oh, that’s a _real_ great idea. :rolleyes: > No, but seriously, you seem to have directly contradicted yourself in that post. Can you clarify? Are there (in your opinion) times when irreverence and sarcasm are acceptable, or should one always strive to avoid them? Because you seem to be arguing for both positions at once, here. It is not very complicated actually. I am, by nature, cynical and ironic. As a personal goal I am attempting to overcome this. Personally I do not feel that this sort of communication has much of a constructive place in human interaction. Your mileage (obviously) will vary. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/102 "2009-07-30T22:57:17Z")
> [@MrSquishy](#): > > Uh, I’m pretty sure those are vertical blinds. > > What? Right, this. ---
**Author:** ![SmashTheState](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@SmashTheState](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmashTheState)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/103 "2009-07-30T23:09:21Z")
What’s most hilarious about all the cigar-chomping, back-slapping, old boys’, country club monocle-popping and mutton-chopped sun-never-sets harrumphing around here is that their unwavering certainty in the naive-materialist shittery squeezing steam-fresh from Dawkins’ holy ass-cheeks to their quavering and prayerful lips is that the very ridicule they level at me – that the views I espouse are “fringe” or “woo” – is generally pointed at _them_ by the vast majority of Western culture. I’m a raving lunatic for supporting neurodiversity? Well guess which one of us would be more welcome at a charismatic christer revival with people jabbering in tongues and twitching all over the floor. It would be sad, pitiful even, watching the local neckbeards french-kiss their Jamie Hyneman blow-up dolls while they circle the wagons against anything unfamiliar except that some of these tossers (I’m looking at you Jackmannii) are actually working professionals whose troglodytic knuckle-dragging over issues which affect real people (like schizophrenics) is pretty horrifying. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/104 "2009-07-30T23:10:35Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > It is not very complicated actually. I am, by nature, cynical and ironic. As a personal goal I am attempting to overcome this. Personally I do not feel that this sort of communication has much of a constructive place in human interaction. Your mileage (obviously) will vary. Okay, but why not? Irony is just as capable a form of communication as sincerity, and is able to more ably convey certain nuances. Additionally, does all communication necessarily have to be constructive? Isn’t simply being amusing a worthy goal in and of itself? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/105 "2009-07-30T23:11:43Z")
> [@SmashTheState](#): > > What’s most hilarious about all the cigar-chomping, back-slapping, old boys’, country club monocle-popping and mutton-chopped sun-never-sets harrumphing around here … is that you assume everyone who argues against you is rich? I sympathize with some of your view and I wish everybody didn’t dismiss them out of hand, but you couldn’t be a worse advocate for them. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/106 "2009-07-30T23:15:05Z")
I chomp cigars and belong to old boys clubs and am most certainly not rich. Nor do I own a monocle or have mutton chops. 😉 I also am not so opposed to SmashtheState’s point of view. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![SmashTheState](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@SmashTheState](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmashTheState)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/107 "2009-07-30T23:18:08Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > … is that you assume everyone who argues against you is rich? > > I sympathize with some of your view and I wish everybody didn’t dismiss them out of hand, but you couldn’t be a worse advocate for them. Oh, I sincerely doubt many of you are rich. The very rich and the very poor have much more in common with each other than either do with the petite bourgeoisie, who comprise the vast majority around here. It’s only the middle class who believe that the laws are fair, the courts are just, the police are friendly, and The System is an equitable compromise. The rich and the poor are quite aware that the system is designed to rape people in the ass; the rich because they get to do the raping, and the poor because they’re the ones being raped. This whole message boards stinks of shopkeepers and factotums. The stench of spiritual death and materialist excess is unmistakable. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/108 "2009-07-30T23:20:31Z")
> [@SmashTheState](#): > > This whole message boards stinks of shopkeepers and factotums. The stench of spiritual death and materialist excess is unmistakable. Sorry. I had cabbage for lunch. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/109 "2009-07-30T23:20:58Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > … is that you assume everyone who argues against you is rich? I’m more inclined to believe that he thinks people who are arguing against him wouldn’t object to _being_ rich. 'Cos that’s the only thing that could possibly keep someone from being motivated to “smash” the “state”. > [@Marley23](#): > > I sympathize with some of your view and I wish everybody didn’t dismiss them out of hand, but you couldn’t be a worse advocate for them. See, thing is, if they turn out to not really be dismissable, someone who doesn’t make such a concerted effort to put everybody’s back up will be along to put them forward again. I agree that his prior well-poisoning can make that a bit problematic. ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/110 "2009-07-30T23:23:55Z")
> [@SmashTheState](#): > > Oh, I sincerely doubt many of you are rich. The very rich and the very poor have much more in common with each other than either do with the petite bourgeoisie, who comprise the vast majority around here. It’s only the middle class who believe that the laws are fair, the courts are just, the police are friendly, and The System is an equitable compromise. The rich and the poor are quite aware that the system is designed to rape people in the ass; the rich because they get to do the raping, and the poor because they’re the ones being raped. > > This whole message boards stinks of shopkeepers and factotums. The stench of spiritual death and materialist excess is unmistakable. You are so totally deep. And angry. Almost forgot angry. Very important. You’re so totally deep and angry. Mustn’t forget the big words either. Deep, angry, and big wordy. That’s what you are. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/111 "2009-07-30T23:35:40Z")
> [@SmashTheState](#): > > Oh, I sincerely doubt many of you are rich. If we’re not rich, who’s paying for the monocles, sideburn trims and the upper-class British accent lessons? I’m just asking! > [@](#): > > It’s only the middle class who believe that the laws are fair, the courts are just, the police are friendly, and The System is an equitable compromise. There’s more of that here than I like, but overall, there isn’t very much of it. Only relative to you do people believe those things. ---
**Author:** ![Wakinyan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wakinyan/32/352_2.png) [@Wakinyan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wakinyan)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/112 "2009-07-30T23:37:23Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > This complaint is also something I don’t get. It boils down to “there are certain currents of thought here, and if you disagree with the most common viewpoint, you’ll most commonly… _have people disagree with you!!!_” > > Yes, if you argue something significantly outside the mainstream you’re much more likely to have a large number of Dopers argue with you in various tones of “nuh unh!!” > So? I don’t agree with you that my post boils down to to have people disagree with me. Certainly not. It boils down to, in my opinion, that there’s no discussion, but ridicule and smug comments, if you’re not airing a “sandbox” opinion, if you excuse my expression; cheap shots and back patting – “now we got him, didn’t we?”. It isn’t “ignorance fighting”, but the group reinforcing its world view, its sandbox of thoughts and conclusions. No big deal for me personally, really, but I insist that this is fact, and this fact is the source of frustration on Smash’s part, I believe. Smash initial intention was intellectually honest, but the response was intellecutally dishonest, in short. He—and other who come from an unexpected angle—can’t get a serious discussion going, because the pack tear him apart instantly, without actually thinking, reading, because you’re supposed to have these and those opinions. And that’s pseudo intellectual, not “ignorance fighting”. Ok, I haven’t read all the Smash threads, and what I’ve read haven’t made me a Smash fan, but please acknowledge that I’m using Smash as an example, because he has a point in his critique of this board. An “ignorance fighting” board should listen to those who criticize it—we all agree I hope, that Smash isn’t a troll, but can argue for himself, and I say his arguing is more honest than most of the dopers’ in these threads—and not just go into the “he’s a dumb asshole” routine. No one thinks Smash is right in every aspect, but the man has a point, whether we like it or not. _That’s_ what it boils down to. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/113 "2009-07-30T23:44:29Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I have no particular animus for anarchy any more than any other political philosophy, but I think of them as hothouse flowers, designed for debate and intellectual exercises but having little if any real value. Libertarianism is my number one candidate, but communism is just as much. They are abstractions, and as such are not directly applicable to how people behave, or how they ought to behave. > > Mostly harmless, unless taken seriously. Many intellectuals who would have made perfectly good leftists were sucked into Marxism and spent far, far too much time trying to defend the practical value of concepts like “urban proletariat”. And, of course, perfectly sensible socialists drowned out by criticism from the right for being too much like Marxists, and criticism from Marxists for refusing to accept classical Marxism’s claim to “history” as a direct and inevitable force. **SmashTheState** has organized the Ottawa Panhandler’s Union. Your political claim to fame is being the SDMB’s resident archnemesis to **Shodan**. Perhaps you’d like to reconsider who is the hothouse flower and who is the heavy lifting of progessive politics. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2009, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/114 "2009-07-30T23:52:05Z")
> [@SmashTheState](#): > > Oh, I sincerely doubt many of you are rich. The very rich and the very poor have much more in common with each other than either do with the petite bourgeoisie, who comprise the vast majority around here. It’s only the middle class who believe that the laws are fair, the courts are just, the police are friendly, and The System is an equitable compromise. The rich and the poor are quite aware that the system is designed to rape people in the ass; the rich because they get to do the raping, and the poor because they’re the ones being raped. > > This whole message boards stinks of shopkeepers and factotums. The stench of spiritual death and materialist excess is unmistakable. A bunch of E-Trade Kulaks the lot of them! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/115 "2009-07-31T00:15:29Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > **SmashTheState** has organized the Ottawa Panhandler’s Union. Your political claim to fame is being the SDMB’s resident archnemesis to **Shodan**. Perhaps you’d like to reconsider who is the hothouse flower and who is the heavy lifting of progessive politics. I am unable to join you in making this all very personal, as I regret I don’t remember who you are. Is there anything interesting about you I might recall? ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/116 "2009-07-31T00:31:03Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I am unable to join you in making this all very personal, as I regret I don’t remember who you are. Is there anything interesting about you I might recall? Remember me as the one who deflated your laughably pompous pretensions to any sort of political relevance, factotum. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/117 "2009-07-31T00:41:02Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I am unable to join you in making this all very personal, as I regret I don’t remember who you are. Is there anything interesting about you I might recall? DJ’s best friend on Full House? I believe DJ said of her, “Kimmy’s not an airhead. She just hates thinking.” So true. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/118 "2009-07-31T00:46:31Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > DJ’s best friend on Full House? I believe DJ said of her, “Kimmy’s not an airhead. She just hates thinking.” So true. I LOLed. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/119 "2009-07-31T00:51:32Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > A bunch of E-Trade Kulaks the lot of them! I still us a PC and AOL. Does that count? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731/120 "2009-07-31T00:55:49Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > I still us a PC and AOL. Does that count? 🙂 How does AOL help you dominate the means of production and keep it out of the hands of the workers? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/smashthestate/504731.md?page=7)