# Sneering progressives are driving young white men into the arms of the GOP **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 4, 2018, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566 "2018-05-04T09:14:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 40
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/782 "2018-05-11T21:33:12Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Those sound like freedoms that are currently enjoyed by white people that minorities do not have as much access to. Can you tell me what harm it caused you to read those words? Oh? You enjoy the freedom of invisible wars? And rape buttons? What the hell are rape buttons? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/783 "2018-05-11T21:34:54Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Oh? You enjoy the freedom of invisible wars? And rape buttons? What the hell are rape buttons? I didn’t see anywhere in that entire article that it said my name. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/784 "2018-05-11T21:40:42Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I didn’t see anywhere in that entire article that it said my name. So a black woman shouldn’t sweat a racist, misogynist rant unless it contained her name? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/785 "2018-05-11T22:07:27Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I didn’t see anywhere in that entire article that it said my name. Don’t play games. You’re white, correct? You said the things in his list “sound like freedoms that are currently enjoyed by white people”. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/786 "2018-05-11T22:11:34Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > In which way? > > As someone else pointed out upthread, the Democrats might not even have to change a single policy position. They could just talk differently, while still keeping 100% of their current policies intact. The party and its leaders can perceived (and yes perception is all about the language and the marketing) as falling over themselves in pursuit a few white voters and shutting down voices that speak to the issues that get lumped as “identity politics” (because those voices somehow may offend these delicate pale flowers), telling them that they have to protest injustices, unjustified police shootings, so on, more _politely_. Don’t talk abut structural or institutional racism either - it annoys some white folk. That message would drive down the turnout in the demographics the Ds need enthused. The response to that would justifiably be “fuck that shit.” The response from folk like me, a straight white guy, would be fuck that shit. Let’s back up some. THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS NOT UNWELCOMING TO WHITES. The majority of those who identify as Democrats [are white](http://news.gallup.com/poll/160373/democrats-racially-diverse-republicans-mostly-white.aspx). A majority of party leadership is white. It is OTOH inclusive of those who are non-white while the GOP is pretty homogeneously white and very unwelcoming to non-whites. That makes certain whites feel more welcome. Overall Democratic [ID and lean](http://www.people-press.org/2016/09/13/2-party-affiliation-among-voters-1992-2016/) is increasing relative to GOP ID and lean. After Obama’s election some whites moved off a Dem ID and mostly into calling themselves Independent. Oh well. Still 39% of white voters ID as D or lean that way. And we feel welcome. No question that a Democratic campaign for a national office has to hit the notes that both enthuse the base and that messages that we are _all_ in this together. The Dems need to get more of their voters to be likely voters while GOP performance right now is doing a fine job keeping their voters to be less likely ones. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/787 "2018-05-11T22:17:13Z")
I feel pretty confident the politicos inside the DNC would be on my side (and Blalron’s, and a couple others). But this pragmatism is part of what the progressive wing disdains about the party, unfortunately. Anyway, I’m off for the weekend. See you Monday afternoon or evening. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/788 "2018-05-11T22:26:07Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > I feel pretty confident the politicos inside the DNC would be on my side (and Blalron’s, and a couple others). But this pragmatism is part of what the progressive wing disdains about the party, unfortunately. I doubt it. My guess is they mostly think along DSeid’s line. The growing base is younger people and people of color. They have to walk a bit of a fine line but generally they know they can’t be seen to be bending over backwards to assuage offended white voters. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/789 "2018-05-11T23:15:39Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Don’t play games. You’re white, correct? You said the things in his list “sound like freedoms that are currently enjoyed by white people”. I’ll jump in, because Coates is usually pretty copacetic to my worldview. I am white. And I absolutely agree with that list. Not de jure, but definitely de facto. If you don’t see it, you’re blind or in denial. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/790 "2018-05-11T23:19:21Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > I’ll jump in, because Coates is usually pretty copacetic to my worldview. I am white. And I absolutely agree with that list. Not de jure, but definitely de facto. If you don’t see it, you’re blind or in denial. Thanks for laying The Truth on me. I will now go forth and start all those invisible wars and install all those rape buttons I didn’t realize were part of my privilege before the Dems screw it all up. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/791 "2018-05-11T23:28:08Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > What the hell are rape buttons? Matt Lauer had a button installed under his desk that allowed him to lock his office door without getting up from his chair. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/792 "2018-05-11T23:37:44Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Matt Lauer had a button installed under his desk that allowed him to lock his office door without getting up from his chair. I had just googled to figure that out. It is rather shameful that a successful black person like Cosby was reduced to using ludes to rape women when white people like Lauer get rape buttons. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/793 "2018-05-11T23:39:11Z")
I don’t really care if you’re offended. I’m not going to dilute the truth to spare the feelings of people who are in denial about their privilege. And I’m done here, because I personally think that arguing with people like that is a waste of time. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/794 "2018-05-11T23:40:31Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I had just googled to figure that out. It is rather shameful that a successful black person like Cosby was reduced to using ludes to rape women when white people like Lauer get rape buttons. Last thing…you’ll notice that Cosby was convicted, which is the correct outcome. Lauer, Weinstein, Spacey, etc, have not. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/795 "2018-05-11T23:42:21Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Last thing…you’ll notice that Cosby was convicted, which is the correct outcome. Lauer, Weinstein, Spacey, etc, have not. Last thing, Cosby got away with it for 40 years. One other last thing, I’m not remotely offended. I am disagreeing. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2018, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/796 "2018-05-11T23:47:29Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Those sound like freedoms that are currently enjoyed by white people that minorities do not have as much access to. Can you tell me what harm it caused you to read those words? Coates uses words and phrases like “whiteness” in a specific way that’s familiar to his dedicated readers and scholars of black history, but different from what most others expect. Whiteness, and related terms like white freedom, when used by Coates, refer to systems set up with long histories, not based on biology or even skin color (though with some overlap), but based on various other socioeconomic and cultural factors, with overwhelming impacts to society and culture. He’s not talking about white people, he’s talking about systems. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/797 "2018-05-12T00:01:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Coates uses words and phrases like “whiteness” in a specific way that’s familiar to his dedicated readers and scholars of black history, but different from what most others expect. Whiteness, and related terms like white freedom, when used by Coates, refer to systems set up with long histories, not based on biology or even skin color (though with some overlap), but based on various other socioeconomic and cultural factors, with overwhelming impacts to society and culture. He’s not talking about white people, he’s talking about systems. I understand that, but it is still us white people that most benefit from those systems. And it is us white people that allow and even encourage those systems to continue. It is also us white people that look at other people that do not have access to those systems, and think poorly of their successes relative to those who do. That’s my personal, working definition of “white privilege” anyway. I am not sure that there has been another term offered in this thread or elsewhere that better encapsulates it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/798 "2018-05-12T00:03:17Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Coates uses words and phrases like “whiteness” in a specific way that’s familiar to his dedicated readers and scholars of black history, but different from what most others expect. Whiteness, and related terms like white freedom, when used by Coates, refer to systems set up with long histories, not based on biology or even skin color (though with some overlap), but based on various other socioeconomic and cultural factors, with overwhelming impacts to society and culture. He’s not talking about white people, he’s talking about systems. I’m curious, how much study do you need to understand his articles properly then? Like a BA in black history or a couple of years of reading him? Or a Masters/4 years of reading? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/799 "2018-05-12T00:04:43Z")
White privilege is not needing to know how racial sociology works. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/800 "2018-05-12T00:12:21Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > White privilege is not needing to know how racial sociology works. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2018, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/801 "2018-05-12T00:22:53Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > I’m curious, how much study do you need to understand his articles properly then? Like a BA in black history or a couple of years of reading him? Or a Masters/4 years of reading? All it took for me is consistently reading Coates’ articles for the past several years. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566.md?page=39) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566.md?page=41)