# Sneering progressives are driving young white men into the arms of the GOP **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 4, 2018, 9:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566 "2018-05-04T09:14:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 44
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/862 "2018-05-13T18:42:42Z")
There’s a difference between thinking that “they are not worth worrying about” and thinking that they are not worth a massive effort that contradicts fundamental principles. Its not so much that I reject any premise of conservatism, its that I don’t see much to be conservative about. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/863 "2018-05-13T18:43:47Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > . . . What are the actual elected officials doing that justifies associating them with anti-whiteness? > > From this thread, I’ve learned that Dems have the reputation for being pro-minority and anti-white because liberal essayists and bloggers have harsh and unpleasant things to say about white privilege that conservatives take as personal attacks. And also because people on the internet ridicule Trump voters and call them mean names. Okay. . . . > . . . yes > [@k9bfriender](#): > > The problem is, is that the only meaningful alternative that is understandable to someone in that condition is that it is someone else’s fault. They are looking to blame someone for their perceived condition, they are not looking to be told how to improve their condition, or what policies will improve the condition of their children. They don’t even necessarily want their own condition improved. They just want someone to blame. I agree, that they want someone to blame, but I dont agree that they are not really interested in improving their plight. > [@Chimera](#): > > We need to stand firm in our convictions, or we have no character. And those convictions don’t include anti-white male sentiments. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > What do you think that meaningful and understandable alternative would be, that would also be honest and pragmatic? > > Dems could start promising (like Trump did) that they will force companies to source their workforce here rather than overseas. They can also promise to keep dying industries like coal viable forever, again like Trump did. But as attractive as these promises might be, they are impossible to keep. This is what got the GOP elected in2016, though. Should Dems follow suit? > > . . . I don’t blame anyone for feeling bad because they are doing worse than their parents did. But if the GOP is deliberately feeding a sense of entitlement that keeps whites feeling victimized, I don’t know what the Dems can do it to fight that short [sic] of out-lying them. Yes! Being in favor of helping minorities achieve parity in our society **is not the same as** being anti-white! Being in favor of reforming immigration policies to make it easier to enter this country and stay **is not the same as** being anti-native. Being in favor of giving women and homosexuals an equal footing in our society i\*\*s not the same as \*\*being anti-family or anti-christian. Being in favor of expanding protections for genders other than boy or girl \*\*is not the same as \*\*being anti-cisgender. A lot, not all, of the problems that minorities and immigrants and women and queerfolk have are because of their status as minorities and immigrants and women and queerfolk. The problems of lower middle class and poor native white cis/straight males (and I am one of them btw) are not because they are native white cis/straight males, their problems stem from being poor and lower middle class and the Democratic party does indeed address these issues and has ideas on what caused these problems and how to fix them. They aren’t being ignored and their problems are not being sneered at. The fact that they think they are being sneered at and ignored is something we can try to fix; we can try to get the message out better, not by pandering to their hurt feelings. mc ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/864 "2018-05-13T18:54:55Z")
**You with the face** is right when they point out that the sneering on the net is not indicative of policy. Discourse today seems to be ruled by the bbq pit, and it’s a shame. mc ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/865 "2018-05-13T19:04:47Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > The number of people who currently bristle when they hear the term “white privilege” who are reachable through positive messaging about the superiority of the policies offered by democrats is, IMHO, near non-existent. Maybe not 0, but close enough that, no, it’s not worth worrying about. OK. I disagree, but this is not something that either of us is likely to be able to prove, so I won’t press it. If you really think that, then I guess your position is understandable. > [@elucidator](#): > > There’s a difference between thinking that “they are not worth worrying about” and thinking that they are not worth a massive effort that contradicts fundamental principles. Its not so much that I reject any premise of conservatism, its that I don’t see much to be conservative about. I didn’t think folks arguing with the OP were talking about a massive effort, but maybe I missed that. And of course one should not compromise on fundamental principles. If that’s what it takes, then it’s not worth doing. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/866 "2018-05-13T19:06:01Z")
A decline in American power was inevitable. Central fact is that America won WWII and everybody else lost. We became a manufacturing giant not due to the wonderfulness of capital investment, but because everybody else’s factories were bombed out and burned down. Then the Japanese specialized in manufacturing on the cheap. Remember when “Made in Japan” was synonymous with cheap, flimsy, but serviceable and disposable? We didn’t care that they made the cheap pocket radios, because we made the cars. Then they made the TVs, and more, and then, finally, the cars. The decline of American economic clout wasn’t anyone’s “fault”, it was more or less inevitable. The investing class was even pretty much OK with unions having power, long as there was more than enough to go around. It was OK that people of color had better jobs and housing, so long as we had more. “Liberal Republicans” even patted themselves on the back for it, they just claimed that the credit was due to the wonderful system we had created, and must preserve! And not an accident of history, but a product of virtue, thrift and prudence. We still have enough to go around, but we are still distributing according to a gross wealth that could not last. And didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/867 "2018-05-13T19:06:34Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > I agree, that they want someone to blame, but I dont agree that they are not really interested in improving their plight. But they aren’t. Hillary went to coal country, and she talked about how her policies were going to put people back to work in higher paying tech jobs, and all they heard was that she was going to put them out of work. You can disagree with whether her policies would have worked, but that wasn’t what happened. They latched onto one phrase that she used, and just kept going and going on that one phrase, rather the entirety of the rest of the speech which was full of hope for improvement of their condition. Now, will they accept more money for going back to the job that they were laid off of years ago? Sure. They are not adverse to having their condition improved for them, they just have little interest in being a part of that process. In the “Why do you like trump” thread, **SnowboarderBo** posted excerpts from a WaPo article, which I will excerpt here: > [@](#): > > “His comment, the whole thing, **it’s been worn out to death** , that clinging to God and guns, God and guns and afraid of people who don’t look like them, blah, blah, blah. Just quit talking down to me.” Bolding mine. Who is it that has worn that comment out to death? Was it Obama? Did he go around repeating this phrase over and over, or was it the right wing media, who wanted to make sure that people knew who to blame? So, yes, while I am sure they would be happy to have better jobs and more money, they don’t actually want to work for it, and it is a lower priority than feeling the outrage and offense that the right wing media tells them they should feel. > [@](#): > > Being in favor of helping minorities achieve parity in our society **is not the same as** being anti-white! > Being in favor of reforming immigration policies to make it easier to enter this country and stay **is not the same as** being anti-native. > Being in favor of giving women and homosexuals an equal footing in our society i\*\*s not the same as \*\*being anti-family or anti-christian. > Being in favor of expanding protections for genders other than boy or girl \*\*is not the same as \*\*being anti-cisgender. > > A lot, not all, of the problems that minorities and immigrants and women and queerfolk have are because of their status as minorities and immigrants and women and queerfolk. The problems of lower middle class and poor native white cis/straight males (and I am one of them btw) are not because they are native white cis/straight males, their problems stem from being poor and lower middle class and the Democratic party does indeed address these issues and has ideas on what caused these problems and how to fix them. They aren’t being ignored and their problems are not being sneered at. The fact that they think they are being sneered at and ignored is something we can try to fix; we can try to get the message out better, not by pandering to their hurt feelings. > > mc Agreed. > [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK. I disagree, but this is not something that either of us is likely to be able to prove, so I won’t press it. If you really think that, then I guess your position is understandable. Nothing would make me happier than to be proved wrong, we’ll see what the future holds. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/868 "2018-05-13T19:07:04Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > The problem is, is that the only meaningful alternative that is understandable to someone in that condition is that it is someone else’s fault. They are looking to blame someone for their perceived condition, they are not looking to be told how to improve their condition … > [@k9bfriender](#): > > … are reachable through positive messaging about the superiority of the policies offered by democrats is, IMHO, near non-existent. Maybe not 0, but close enough that, no, it’s not worth worrying about. … Detailed policy discussions will not be effective in a general election cycle, agreed. Eyes glaze. Marketing is more about emotions and making connections. Certainly blaming an other, just a _different_ other, can work. To my eye and ear that was Sanders schtick- the other was “the rich” and all the various variations of that. Not my preferred way. > [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > What do you think that meaningful and understandable alternative would be, that would also be honest and pragmatic? … Again, start with the emotional connection, not the policies. Bill Clinton and Obama were both masters of that. Here’s a sample of [Clinton working it](https://www.nytimes.com/1992/03/28/us/1992-campaign-verbatim-heckler-stirs-clinton-anger-excerpts-exchange.html) while being heckled back in '92, this in relation to AIDS, but same technique: > [@](#): > > … You do not have the right to treat any human being, including me, with no respect because of what you’re worried about. I did not cause it. I’m trying to do something about it. I have treated you and all the people who’ve interrupted my rally with a hell of a lot more respect than you’ve treated me, and it’s time you started thinking about that. > > I feel your pain, I feel your pain, but if you want to attack me personally you’re no better than Jerry Brown and all the rest of these people who say whatever sounds good at the moment. If you want something to be done, you ask me a question and you listen. If you don’t agree with me, go support somebody else for President but quit talking to me like that. This is not a matter of personal attack; it’s a matter of human wrong. > > You can be for George Bush, you can be for somebody else, but do not stand up here at my rally, where other people paid to come, and insult me without – listen, that’s fine, I’ll give you your money back if you want it, out of my own pocket. > > **I understand that you’re hurting, but you won’t stop hurting by trying to hurt other people. That’s what I try to tell all you folks. You’re not going to stop hurting by trying to hurt other people.** (Bolding mine of course. Although he may have said it in bold!)) He backed it up with policy so much so that I think “wonk” was created to describe him, but it was not the details of policy that elected him. People, all sorts of people, were convinced that he actually understand the difficulties they were in and that he would work his best to address it. “Details to follow” preferred after that to an intellectual lecture. Obama, policy again little to with it. He _connected_. Whites who voted against HRC voted for him and his message (still unfulfilled dream) of a united America. HRC did not connect. She did not unite. Policy-wise, intellect-wise, I believe she is Bill’s better and close to Obama, but if she has true compassion for others (and I think she does) she is unable to demonstrate such convincingly. In more local elections Democrats can narrowcast. Podcast attention seekers will seek attention. Do not feed. But at a national level the message has to focus on finding our common purpose, our shared desire to be a better society for us all, inclusive of all who may be being left behind, yes you too in Appalachia, and you in the inner city with poor education options. Politics of division will favor the GOP. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/869 "2018-05-13T19:24:50Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > …And of course one should not compromise on fundamental principles. If that’s what it takes, then it’s not worth doing. Well, yes, I repeat, no. Barry Goldwater opposed civil rights legislation on principled ground of state’s rights. He said he agonized about it, and I believe him, but still think he was wrong. I think he did believe that, and also believed that the states would eventually come around. Did he know that the reactionaries would seize his states’ rights principle to resist justice? The situation was so awful, such an emergency, that drastic action was necessary, even so, it was still a ghastly struggle. Given that we have our birth in revolutionary struggle against our oppressors, how do we say that colored Americans didn’t have the same right of violent resistance? We did. Even to this day, I am astonished at the resolute patriotism of colored people who so loved a country that didn’t love them back. Malcolm X saying “By any means necessary” had a point. The right of resistance is a human right, unalienable, comes with the navel. There is nothing wrong with suspending a principle in an emergency, long as you put it back when you can. Ah! The rub… ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/870 "2018-05-13T19:41:09Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > A decline in American power was inevitable. Central fact is that America won WWII and everybody else lost. We became a manufacturing giant not due to the wonderfulness of capital investment, but because everybody else’s factories were bombed out and burned down. Then the Japanese specialized in manufacturing on the cheap. Remember when “Made in Japan” was synonymous with cheap, flimsy, but serviceable and disposable? We didn’t care that they made the cheap pocket radios, because we made the cars. Then they made the TVs, and more, and then, finally, the cars. > > The decline of American economic clout wasn’t anyone’s “fault”, it was more or less inevitable. The investing class was even pretty much OK with unions having power, long as there was more than enough to go around. It was OK that people of color had better jobs and housing, so long as we had more. “Liberal Republicans” even patted themselves on the back for it, they just claimed that the credit was due to the wonderful system we had created, and must preserve! And not an accident of history, but a product of virtue, thrift and prudence. > > We still have enough to go around, but we are still distributing according to a gross wealth that could not last. And didn’t. This is pretty good post. It also highlights, albeit indirectly, why wage floors and unions aren’t as productive or as powerful as once thought. Near limitless foreign labor, in all of its incarnations, undercuts fiat wage points. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/871 "2018-05-13T20:43:42Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Well, yes, I repeat, no. Barry Goldwater opposed civil rights legislation on principled ground of state’s rights. He said he agonized about it, and I believe him, but still think he was wrong. I think he did believe that, and also believed that the states would eventually come around. Did he know that the reactionaries would seize his states’ rights principle to resist justice? I don’t think that is correct. He objected to the imposition of non-discrimination laws on private businesses, but had no problem with imposing those laws on the state governments. > [@](#): > > The situation was so awful, such an emergency, that drastic action was necessary, even so, it was still a ghastly struggle. Given that we have our birth in revolutionary struggle against our oppressors, how do we say that colored Americans didn’t have the same right of violent resistance? We did. Even to this day, I am astonished at the resolute patriotism of colored people who so loved a country that didn’t love them back. While I agree overall, the two situations are not really comparable. The colonies rebelled to form a separate political unit, which would not have been possible for blacks in the US. But I would certainly agree that blacks in the US during the Jim Crow years were oppressed significantly more than the colonists were oppressed by Parliament/The Crown. > [@](#): > > Malcolm X saying “By any means necessary” had a point. The right of resistance is a human right, unalienable, comes with the navel. There is nothing wrong with suspending a principle in an emergency, long as you put it back when you can. > > Ah! The rub… Yes, when you are at the point of rebellion, then the prohibition on the use of violence goes out the window. You just have to hope you win, because rebels who lose usually don’t get to say “oops”. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/872 "2018-05-13T21:22:05Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Again, start with the emotional connection, not the policies. Bill Clinton and Obama were both masters of that. Here’s a sample of [Clinton working it](https://www.nytimes.com/1992/03/28/us/1992-campaign-verbatim-heckler-stirs-clinton-anger-excerpts-exchange.html) while being heckled back in '92, this in relation to AIDS, but same technique:(Bolding mine of course. Although he may have said it in bold!)) So for continuity sake, here is the part you’re saying was emotionally effective: > [@](#): > > I understand that you’re hurting, but you won’t stop hurting by trying to hurt other people. That’s what I try to tell all you folks. You’re not going to stop hurting by trying to hurt other people. I’m honestly trying to imagine Hillary Clinton saying anything like this in 2016 and walking away with her head undecapitated. Maybe I’m just overly cynical right now or maybe I just have no idea what the hell speaks to white men. But insinuating her audience is trying to hurt other people is something I just don’t think would’ve worked for Hillary, even if she’d started out saying she understands their pain in classic Bill fashion. I think we need to be honest and just say that Bill mastered the art of being a “down home” white man, which primed his audience to listen in a way that Hillary couldn’t replicate being who she is. Do you honestly think Hillary could’ve gotten away with saying anything remotely like “that’s what I try to tell all you folks”? Look at that verbiage. _You_ folks? Bill was able to say this only because he could pass as one of them. [So I dug up the speech she gave in Detroit.](https://www.npr.org/2016/08/11/489563362/clinton-to-lay-out-economic-plan-in-contrast-to-trump)If I could fault her for anything, it’s not the lack of empathy. It’s putting perhaps too much of an optimistic and rosy spin on the current economic situation. If someone feels like they are in a perilous place, they want their perspective validated. I get that. But she did acknowledge the frustration that people are feeling. She didn’t vilify anyone for feeling left behind either. She in fact pinned the loss of good jobs to special interests and bad governance. No sneering, no condescension. Plenty of emotional appeals about Americans being hardworking and deserving of success. But Trump’s dooming and glooming was more effective at speaking to angry whites. That’s really all there was to it. Had Clinton used the same approach it’s likely she would’ve lost more votes because negativity wouldnt have brought out hopey changey Obama fans the way a more uplifting message did. Again, not saying she was perfect, but I find this criticism lacking. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/873 "2018-05-13T21:36:07Z")
[This piece in the NYT](https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/05/12/opinion/sunday/liberals-youre-not-as-smart-as-you-think-you-are.html) is echoing some of the same points made in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/874 "2018-05-13T21:41:09Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > … It also highlights, albeit indirectly, why wage floors and unions aren’t as productive or as powerful as once thought. Near limitless foreign labor, in all of its incarnations, undercuts fiat wage points. More to the point, perhaps: automation undercuts fiat wage points. Now work that can’t (yet) be automated is work that can still be unionized. But the GOP is going in the direction of creating a poorly-educated, poorly-trained workforce–you masses can’t expect to get education or training for free! That world will be one in which the masses are unemployable (with work their poor education fits them for being done by automated processes). Many of the major donors are dreaming of a return to feudalism, it would appear–they long to be addressed as ‘my lord’ with much bowing and doffing of caps by the serfs. And the Young White Men the OP is trying to champion may imagine that they’d _like_ that kind of world–but that’s because they see themselves on the golden throne, being bowed to by all those lower in status than themselves (the women, the dark-skinned, the gay, etc.) But the Young White Men don’t realize that in the poor-education/copious-private-prisons world the GOP is building, they themselves will be the ones bowing and doffing their caps. There’s not much room at the top. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/875 "2018-05-13T23:21:21Z")
“So while it is admirable to think “understanding” can fix this country, it is also naive. Progressives should ask themselves: When’s the last time you heard any Trump supporters talking about the need to understand you? You haven’t — and that ought to tell you something. Here’s the thing: The rest of us have the moral high ground here. We see the same demographic writing on the wall that Trump followers see, but where it makes them angry and fearful, it leaves us energized. Many of us are excited to see the nation that will arise from this cauldron of change. That’s because the idea of change doesn’t threaten us…” [http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-pitts-trump-supporters-understanding-0508-20180506-story.html](http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-pitts-trump-supporters-understanding-0508-20180506-story.html) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/876 "2018-05-13T23:48:51Z")
Given that we’re approaching 900 posts in this thread, can anyone tell me what the Big Examples are of current major Dem/left figures sneering at young (or even not-so-young) white men? Anything more recent than Hillary’s ‘deplorables’? (Because there’s nothing we can do about that one without a time machine.) ETA: The reason I ask is that [Atrios said this](http://www.eschatonblog.com/2018/05/who-exactly.html): > [@](#): > > I agree that Nancy Pelosi probably shouldn’t spend her days going on MSNBC and calling conservative voters stupid racist shitwhistles. > > Also Nancy Pelosi does not do that. Nor do the liberal hosts on MSNBC as far as I am aware of. Nor does anyone except cranky people on twitter (in the old days this was cranky people on blogs, but blogs don’t exist anymore). Is he wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/877 "2018-05-14T00:33:00Z")
Well right. They can’t. They get this idea from right wing media that tells them this is happening, that tells them Obama went on a non-existent ‘Apology tour’, that tells them Obama was a racist Kenyan who hated white people, etc. They’re not listening to what Dems say, they’re listening to Conservatives tell them what Dems are saying, which is bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/878 "2018-05-14T00:58:03Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Well right. They can’t. They get this idea from right wing media that tells them this is happening, that tells them Obama went on a non-existent ‘Apology tour’, that tells them Obama was a racist Kenyan who hated white people, etc. > > They’re not listening to what Dems say, they’re listening to Conservatives tell them what Dems are saying, which is bullshit. Slight correction: a bunch of nobodies are saying mean things about white men. Republican spinmeisters amplify these highly convenient voices to say bullshit things similar to what the OP said, and then to demand that the left waste its energy going on the defensive or else tracking down and fingerwagging at these nobodies. Meanwhile Trump calls entire nations “shitholes,” and his staff mock people dying of cancer, and he calls Nazis good people. But overall you’re right: this is not a case of paying attention to what leftist leaders are saying, it’s a case of fussing about what Republicans say leftists are saying. It’s a waste of energy, and giving into these stupid demands would simply be dancing to the organ grinder’s tune. We don’t need to do that. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/879 "2018-05-14T01:04:40Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Slight correction To late to edit: that’s a douchy way to put it, and I apologize. I mean that I quibble slightly. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/880 "2018-05-14T01:10:26Z")
Popehat Retweeted Myke Cole Verified account @MykeCole Trump: - eats baby - Sane people: JESUS LEAPING CHRIST YOU JUST ATE A BABY Deplorables: Haha! Librul tears! @nytopinion: “If only self-important leftists had kept quiet, these normally anti-baby-eating types would have remained on the fence.” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566/881 "2018-05-14T01:13:07Z")
Angry working-class whites are looking for someone to blame, someone to hate. _ **Give them some alternatives.** _ Blame the union busting pushed by Republicans. Blame the anti-government policies and tax cuts for the rich which are degrading public schools, preventing affordable healthcare and affordable higher education. Blame the pro-corporation anti-regulation culture which looted the Treasury to make banks whole after their greedy gamesmanship during the Bush era while evicting common people from their homes. Give them a different message: someone else to hate. The message is already there, but it needs to be blared louder to match the cacophony of Koch-Hannity lies. Boycott businesses which promote right-wing media or right-wing lies. Yes, the majority of Republicans are too stupid to think beyond their guns and their bigotries. But we don’t need to win them all over, just a few percent to win the coming elections and get the pendulum pointed in a saner direction. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566.md?page=43) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sneering-progressives-are-driving-young-white-men-into-the-arms-of-the-gop/813566.md?page=45)