# So a woman racially harassed me today...(long) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 24, 2005, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073 "2005-12-24T11:02:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/21 "2005-12-25T01:12:04Z")
> [@TonyF](#): > > As the dedicated boyfriend of **Penchan** - who is waitressing at the moment - I have to point out that she’s going to Davis but works at her family’s restaurant in Berkeley. (You should all go! :D) Ahhhhh, that explains her calling it “a Thai restaurant in an urban city” and why the lady didn’t ask if she rode a bike as a form of Asian solidarity. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/22 "2005-12-25T05:39:27Z")
> [@TonyF](#): > > Very true. Now **Penchan** isn’t a scholar in the Thai language or anything, but she is the first generation born here and her family regularly travels back and forth all over the country. So although that’s a very good point, I don’t think it applies to this jackass/customer - I take **Penchan’s** word that the customer really was butchering the language. I don’t think it applies either to that particular individual. That’s why I said > [@](#): > > Of course, the idiot—er, customers mentioned in the OP were obviously jackasses and probably think that the cute little transliteration into English is the perfect way to say those Thai words. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Penchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/74df32/32.png) [@Penchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penchan)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/23 "2005-12-25T06:09:27Z")
Thanks for all the feedback! I’m glad that I’m not the only one who’s :dubious: about that incident! I also have to add that after that happened last night, guess what happened today? An Asian woman asked me questions about our menu in Thai (I guess to show off or something), and when I responded in Thai, she gave me a :eek: look and said: “You speak Thai!?” I can’t win, it seems! Oh, and if anyone Bay Area Dopers are curious as to which restaurant I work at, just pm me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Penchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/74df32/32.png) [@Penchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penchan)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/24 "2005-12-25T06:33:35Z")
> [@Askia](#): > > Sometimes… people deserve a _look_. You know the _look?_ I’m a teacher, I’m a master of the _look._ The _look_ makes people trail off mid-sentence choking on their words becuase you’ve non-verbally made them aware with a stare of horrified, slightly pitying disapproval just how stupid their opinions sound. become a master of the _look_, Daniel-san. (Apologies if it is racially insensitive of me to make a reference to “The Karate Kid” in a thread about Asian cultural stereotypes. I’m on a roll.) > > Sometimes the harshest remedies are foremost the kindest. As a server, it’s a bit hard to give people _the look_ because you’re making your livelihood from their generosity (e.g. their tips), so you really don’t want to piss them off. I just stood there literally with my mouth open as she asked me those idiotic questions, but I guess my flabbergasted look wasn’t enough to hint to her that maybe she shouldn’t be asking those questions. I was also astounded by her male companion. He kept telling me all these places he’s been to in Thailand and if I ever went there. I politely told him that yes, I’ve been to many of those places, they were very nice, but what does that prove? Does that make me more cultured because I’ve been to a few more temples than he has? He seemed to want to show how cultured he was by telling me that I should travel around Thailand more and get reacquainted with my roots. At this point I was about to sock him, but my manager nudged me to drop it. I should also mention that I am the assistant manager at the restaurant, so I had full authority to kick them out if they got malicious, but I didn’t think they were intentionally being mean to me. If they had meant it in a mean-spirited way, then I would have booted them out before they had a bite. ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/25 "2005-12-25T06:33:50Z")
> [@Penchan](#): > > An Asian woman asked me questions about our menu in Thai (I guess to show off or something), and when I responded in Thai, she gave me a :eek: look and said: > > “You speak Thai!?” > > I can’t win, it seems! I am absolutely amazed that someone would speak in a language and be shocked that the answer was in the same language. I cannot think of any reason for this surprise other than the customer was expecting you not to speak Thai and was just trying to show off. Another situation that calls for expeditious use of “the look”. ---
**Author:** ![Penchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/74df32/32.png) [@Penchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penchan)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/26 "2005-12-25T06:46:04Z")
> [@CynicalGabe](#): > > I am absolutely amazed that someone would speak in a language and be shocked that the answer was in the same language. I cannot think of any reason for this surprise other than the customer was expecting you not to speak Thai and was just trying to show off. > > Another situation that calls for expeditious use of “the look”. Actually, after thinking about it, I guess she wanted to down on me for not being Thai enough since she heard me talking to my manager in fluent English. I get that sometimes from Thai people - when they hear me speak English, they assume I can’t speak Thai and that I’m ‘too American’ (I’ve actually been called that). So when I spoke Thai, I disapproved her notions that you’re either a fob who can’t speak English or you’re totally whitewashed and don’t speak your native language. ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/27 "2005-12-25T18:23:20Z")
Next time someone acts like that, hide ex-lax in their food. If they notice, say, “It ancient Chinese secret. You be on toilet long time!” (Most of those people don’t seem to be fully aware that different Asian nationalities are actually, you know, different.) ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/28 "2005-12-25T19:32:26Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > Next time someone acts like that, hide ex-lax in their food. If they notice, say, “It ancient Chinese secret. You be on toilet long time!” (Most of those people don’t seem to be fully aware that different Asian nationalities are actually, you know, different.) **DO NOT DO THIS.** **DO NOT DO THIS.** **DO NOT DO THIS.** After 9/11, most states added stronger food/product tampering laws. The news is riddled with stories of what happens to waiters/waitresses who pulled a dumb stunt like this. _And went to jail!_ :smack: ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/29 "2005-12-25T20:21:28Z")
You know, when I read this thread, I said to myself, “You know, this sounds like someone I’d expect to find in my uncle’s humanities class in Berzerkley. Only in a college town could you get the combination of educated… (They tried to speak thai! even if poorly, that’s mildly impressive) and completely socially unaware, with a double helping of the missionary complex, tied in with female liberation.” “But… hell, Berkley’s full of chinese people. What the hell? It’s not even start of semester.” Huh. I guess stupidity lasts. ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/30 "2005-12-25T22:41:13Z")
> [@Penchan](#): > > As a server, it’s a bit hard to give people _the look_ because you’re making your livelihood from their generosity (e.g. their tips), so you really don’t want to piss them off. Oh, you’d be risking your tip, all right, but oftentimes the _look_ is much more satisfying than cash in hand. Which would you rather remember a year from now-- that you held your tongue, or that you gave them an impeccable stinkeye? Heck, they may overcompensate and give you a great big tip out of liberal guilt. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/31 "2005-12-25T23:05:48Z")
It seems most people in this thread blame the ignorant customer for being an ass. Fine. But I"m not letting the OP off the hook. Got lot’s of experience working in restaurants myself. Look, they order the food, you serve it. It’s a little business transaction you’re engaged in. You’re expected to be polite and pleasant. You are not expected to whore yourself out to their nosy, ignorant enquiries into your personal life. Don’t entertain stupid ignorant personal questions about yourself. They can ask about the menu. They can comment on the weather. They may ask about [whatever’s going on locally]. That’s it! You’re a server. You’re not their “let me express my ignorance” bitch. I know you work for tips, but that doesn’t mean being everyone’s bitch. You said you do this during breaks to earn some cash. You need to take some shit. Along the lines of, "my fork’s dirty. I need more ketchup. This isn’t what I think I might have actually intended on, but didn’t actually order. I want some more water. And some more water. And more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and some more napkins for the kids. But you don’t have to let them insult you. If they decide to insult you anyway (and they will) look at them blankly and ask, “was there anything else I could get for you?” ---
**Author:** ![Kythereia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e8c25b/32.png) [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2005, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/32 "2005-12-25T23:09:10Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > Next time someone acts like that, hide ex-lax in their food. If they notice, say, “It ancient Chinese secret. You be on toilet long time!” (Most of those people don’t seem to be fully aware that different Asian nationalities are actually, you know, different.) Not only is this probably illegal, it’s also immature. I wouldn’t recommend it. _many hugs to **Penchan** , and would give her a huge tip if I ever ate at your restaurant_ ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/33 "2005-12-26T00:38:09Z")
You had no business correcting their pronunciation. They’re not going to “you know, learn the language” and all it does is put them on the defensive. You lay out the menu and point to what you think they said; then they point to what they meant and everyone is happy. I think you were being way too sensitive, and I don’t think you suffered “racial harassment.” I think you had a couple dumbass customers seated in your section, and they would have been irritating no matter who you were. If they hadn’t had your ethnicity to question you about (and if you’d stuck to taking the order, there might not have been a conversation at all–what followed their order was definitely an attempt to get a one-up on you) it would have been the university you go to, the region of the country you’re from, your age, or your clothes. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/34 "2005-12-26T03:07:07Z")
How horrifying. I admire your restraint. Seriously. I’m a white guy with two South Korean-born kids. Ahhh, when they were babies. And toddlers. And old enough to know the “kindly, interested” stranger was being a racist moron. My top query? " How old were they when they came?" –6 months, and 4.5 months – " Oh? What language do they speak? " –Stares gape-jawed, walks away.– I suspect that that white couple would angrily deny any accusation of racism. In fact, I bet some of their best friends are Thai. Just ask em. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Brainiac4](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brainiac4/32/3534_2.png) [@Brainiac4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brainiac4)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/35 "2005-12-26T03:46:59Z")
**Penchan** , I admire your restraint. Those are some deeply stupid and insensitive people you had to deal with. My condolences. **Excalibre** , that was some bad advice. **Sattua** , WTF? In every Korean, Thai, Japanese or Chinese restaurant I have ever been in, the items on the menu are numbered. If you’re saying “I’d like the Pad Med Mamuang Himaphane” instead of “I’d like #36” then you are attempting to use the language. Repeating it back to you correctly is an attempt to help, not to insult. And there is no excuse for the kind of obnoxious racial insensitivity they demonstrated. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/36 "2005-12-26T03:55:01Z")
I used to date a Thai restaurant waitress. Maybe you know her. Her name was Sue. ---
**Author:** ![Penchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/74df32/32.png) [@Penchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penchan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/37 "2005-12-26T04:21:58Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > It seems most people in this thread blame the ignorant customer for being an ass. Fine. But I"m not letting the OP off the hook. Got lot’s of experience working in restaurants myself. > > Look, they order the food, you serve it. It’s a little business transaction you’re engaged in. You’re expected to be polite and pleasant. You are not expected to whore yourself out to their nosy, ignorant enquiries into your personal life. > > Don’t entertain stupid ignorant personal questions about yourself. They can ask about the menu. They can comment on the weather. They may ask about [whatever’s going on locally]. That’s it! > > You’re a server. You’re not their “let me express my ignorance” bitch. I know you work for tips, but that doesn’t mean being everyone’s bitch. You said you do this during breaks to earn some cash. You need to take some shit. Along the lines of, "my fork’s dirty. I need more ketchup. This isn’t what I think I might have actually intended on, but didn’t actually order. I want some more water. And some more water. And more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and more water, and some more napkins for the kids. > > But you don’t have to let them insult you. If they decide to insult you anyway (and they will) look at them blankly and ask, “was there anything else I could get for you?” True, I didn’t have to take it, but in hindsight, I know I should have just ignored them and moved on without taking it personally. But as it’s happening you can’t help but try to reason with some people. I guess I should have picked my battles and this one wasn’t worth it. > [@Sattua](#): > > I think you were being way too sensitive, and I don’t think you suffered “racial harassment.” I think you had a couple dumbass customers seated in your section, and they would have been irritating no matter who you were. If they hadn’t had your ethnicity to question you about (and if you’d stuck to taking the order, there might not have been a conversation at all–what followed their order was definitely an attempt to get a one-up on you) it would have been the university you go to, the region of the country you’re from, your age, or your clothes. Eh, differences in opinion, I suppose. I have experienced a lot during my years of waitressing, and this seemed to me too big to just blow off, at least without venting first. What they asked and the way they asked them were too pushy for me to ignore or chalk to sheer ignorance. I mean, would you ask a complete stranger those questions? They were naive, but unforgiveably rude. ---
**Author:** ![Penchan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/74df32/32.png) [@Penchan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penchan)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/38 "2005-12-26T04:34:40Z")
> [@Brainiac4](#): > > In every Korean, Thai, Japanese or Chinese restaurant I have ever been in, the items on the menu are numbered. If you’re saying “I’d like the Pad Med Mamuang Himaphane” instead of “I’d like #36” then you are attempting to use the language. Repeating it back to you correctly is an attempt to help, not to insult. And there is no excuse for the kind of obnoxious racial insensitivity they demonstrated. I should have added that it’s also to ensure that I’m understanding what they’re ordering so I don’t mess up the order to the kitchen. Every once in a while someone orders something in Thai and when I bring their food, they insist that’s not what they meant. So now I re-read every dish that people order so at least they’ll know it’s their fault for ordering the wrong thing, not that I misheard them. And you should have heard the lady order. I honestly had no idea what she was trying to ask for, so I had to guess and repeat it to her to make sense of what she wanted. ---
**Author:** ![kushiel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbce88/32.png) [@kushiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kushiel)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/39 "2005-12-26T05:44:53Z")
> [@Amazon Floozy Goddess](#): > > There are ten kinds of stupid out there. This particular kind is one of the most annoying. I’ve always wanted to scream when I hear the “But you don’t fit into the stereotype of Race X? How can that BE??” talk. > > I’m Metis and have gotten my share of dumbass questions like: > > “So you probably own a horse, right?” > > “Can you speak Indian?” > > “Wow, so your last name is X? I know a Native guy from Alberta whose last name is X. Do you know him?” > > And my answers usually sent them for a loop: > > “No. I think I’ve sat on a horse twice in my life.” > > “Depends which language you mean. Ojibway? Mohawk? Salish? Inuit? Michif? I know like 3 words in Cree, which is my background. But that’s only in the Y dialect.” > > “Nope.” So, do you know the Pocha’s from Saskatoon? The Merasty’s from La Ronge? The Ahenakew’s? The Bear’s? :o Well, I do live in the city with the highest Aboriginal population rate (29%), so I can crack bad jokes. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2005, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073/40 "2005-12-26T07:27:11Z")
The Ex-Lax would be a no no, but “promoting” their one-star hotness to five-star might have been OK. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-a-woman-racially-harassed-me-today-long/337073.md?page=3)