So, OP, I guess you don’t want to declare bankruptcy.
There is also the option of just not paying one or more of the debts. Hurts your credit rating, but not as much as bankruptcy. On my he other hand, collection efforts could made for a long time, and that might not be fun.
More like, “Fool Me Once…”
They cheated him, literally stole from him, and then they came back a second time and may well have been planning to cheat him again, given the chance.
Besides, they should consider themselves damn lucky that he didn’t subject them to making them listen to one his many thousands of spellbinding, fascinating, exotic and not-even-a-little-bit-tedious stories about him going to a bar, and him drinking at a bar, or his talking to other people in the bar, or his befriending the owner of the bar, and how very, very much he enjoys spending time in bars.
They’d be begging him for a repayment plan just to get the hell out of his place of business (and then likely head for the nearest bar, doubtless needing a few stiff drinks)
Bankruptcy tries to give all of your creditors at least something to make them whole. That’s why you don’t just get to declare bankruptcy, have you debts wiped, and go on with things. they will take everything that you own that is not legally protected under bankruptcy laws, and will likely allow a garnishment from future earnings to go towards your creditors as well.
Most of that is going to be felt by the agencies that extended you credit in the first place, credit card companies, utilities, banks and the like. They have built into their interest rate the chance that they think that you will default based on a fairly large amount of transactional history they have at their disposal. they don’t like it, but it’s a cost of doing business. Note that after bankruptcy, they will also not deal with you the same way as before. If they extend you credit, it is going to be on more restricted terms with a much higher interest.
If I take a check from someone, I do not get to make a surcharge based on their credit and work history and the chances that they will make good on the check. Instead, if the check does not clear, I am simply out that money, just the same as though it had been stolen out of my cash register.
Bankruptcy or not, there is a reason why merchants have pictures of check kiters for their cashiers to see.
I am not a laywer but I did take a business law class from a very good professor. Based on what I learned in that class I don’t think it is a good idea to hang up bad checks for the public to see. The store that does that could get sued over it. Now I could be wrong on this and if so I guess a lawyer will tell me. ![]()
Checks are rare now and I have not seen any bad checks posted in 20 years or so. Maybe that means what I said above is true and stores know it.
I don’t agree with it being for the public to see either. I do remember such things from my childhood, I think, unless I am conflating that with memories of TV shows.
However, for cashiers, absolutely, they need to know who checks are no longer accepted from.
Checks aren’t that rare. I just did a quick audit on my POS, and 5.5% of my sales are in checks. Not huge, but not insignificant either.
I’ve only had a few bad checks, and only one of those did not make good on it. No, they are not welcome back unless or until they pay up (plus interest at this point).
I recall as a college student local places stopped taking checks near the end of the school year, the reason being that they were afraid of bad checks and then the student would leave town.
Also some places would not take checks numbered 101-200 because that meant a new account and were more likely to bounce a check.
Good idea.
When I first got my first checking account and checkbook, I went to the store for groceries, pulled out my checkbook, and wrote my first check. There was some discussion, the cashier walked away with my check, and came back with a manager. They told me that they would not accept the check, as its number was so low. I dug around in my pockets, pulled out another checkbook, this one starting at 201, and they took it. Threw out the first after that.
Why don’t you just wait until the due date, when the statement balance will be automatically paid in full as usual? ![]()
I think this is the key factor. Declaring bankruptcy is not just something you can do whenever you wish. The question isn’t “In my present situation, why shouldn’t I declare bankruptcy?” It’s “In my present situation, would I be allowed to declare bankruptcy?”
The perspective to look at is that you signed contracts with your creditors. You entered those contracts voluntarily. And now you want to break those contracts.
It’s one thing if you’re saying you can’t fulfill your obligations. But it’s another thing if you’re saying you just don’t want to fulfill your obligations. We wouldn’t have much of an economy if people were able to just decide they didn’t feel like paying for things.
Quick personal anecdote: For various reasons, my credit rating went to shit in my mid-to-late twenties. I desperately needed a car, and I could afford to make payments, but nobody would give me a loan. Finally, I found a dealer who would finance me - at 48%. I bit the bullet and picked out the cheapest four wheels and a seat on the lot. For the next few years I drove around in a vehicle that was - shall we say - less than optimal.
The good news is, paying off that car helped get my credit rating back on track. I did not declare bankruptcy, so I don’t have experience in that regard. But I suspect that if you do, even if the numbers look favorable to you, you’ll spend your life like me with that crappy car - getting by, but not being able to have or do the things you really want.
Not all my cards carry a high balance, that one is an Amazon store card.
The point of my thread is it’ll take about a year to pay all these debts off, and I just kinda wondered if I cleared the debts in bankruptcy, then over the year I’d have about 30k in cash instead.
And with 30k in cash, I wouldn’t need credit for much. I could pay the deposit needed to rent a place to live. I could buy a used car in cash. And so on and so forth.
About the only way I can think of this would hurt me are :
a. Employers giving me the thumbs down because of prior bankruptcy. But many key states, including California, ban employers from considering it.
b. Insurance rates. But would the extra premiums really total to $30,000 over 7 years? Seems like a stretch…
An idea worth considering, especially since in 2019’s America, everyone knows that job security is such a rock solid absolute, and of course no one ought to needlessly feel obligated to honor any debts that they willingly, contractually entered into out of some outdated sense of personal integrity or ethics.
The advice given seems to be sound. If you disagree with it, you are welcome to ignore it and see how it goes for you. Who knows, in your situation, it may work out.
Remember, even after they have taken everything that you own that is not covered under bankruptcy protection, they may still go after future wages in the form of wage garnishments. That may cost you a bit.
If they find out that you have hidden assets from them, then you will find yourself in all manner of hot water.
None of your debt is in student loans, is it? Those cannot be discharged with bankruptcy.
Make sure you check back in from time to time to let us know how it is going.
Only discussing this from a practical point of view, it sounds like you may not qualify for Chapter 7 bankruptcy. If you don’t you would have to file for Chapter 13, which requires you to repay
This Experian page give you the guidelines to figure out if you qualify.
This is the main part:
"Only some expenses such as car loan payments and childcare are based on your actual expenses.
"If after deducting all you living costs, your remaining monthly disposable income multiplied by 60 is less than $7,700 you will be allowed to file for Chapter 7.
“If your disposable income is more than $7,700 but less than $12,850 you will only be allowed to file Chapter 7 if you do not have enough disposable to pay back at least 25% of your unsecured debt.”
I see they also now have limits on keeping your home and car. You must have less than $23,675 in equity in your home, and less than $3,775 in equity in your motor vehicle. Don’t you love those odd, precise numbers?
Absolutely, this is a point. Though a third option would be to pay the minimum on the credit cards. Max out the 401k contributions. Then after a year, where about 18k has gone into the 401k and another chunk into a Roth and HSA, suddenly, again, I would have as much as paying off the banks in personal assets (you can access half the 401k funds at any time without a penalty as a loan, or all the funds with a 10% penalty plus paying taxes on them). That is to say, this is about as much as I could realistically borrow anyways, but I’d have it in cash. And then renege like such great men as our President.
Apparently, ethics are outdated, lol.
I mean I see your point but since we live in a world where my employer and the banks have little to no ethics, either, why shouldn’t I take the (legal) action that benefits me the most…
75k divided by 12 is 6250. So your own block of text here suggests that my pre-tax, much less post-tax income is well under this arbitrary threshold.
After reading your clearly well thought out and flawlessly reasoned justifications for your pending actions, I can say with 100% sincerity that your plan is going to turn out to be a very positive thing indeed, specifically for your family, employer, preferred financial institutions and any friends you might conceivably have the chance to learn that you so grandly strive to match the personal and moral integrity of banks, used car dealerships and of course one President Donald J Trump.
I respect people who are not afraid to show others who and what they are.
lol indeed…
They said you have to deduct living expenses and then multiply the amount leftover by 60.
You think you can pay off those debts in A YEAR? 30k cash isn’t going to be worth the stench that bankruptcy will cause (IMHO)
Sam, you really sound like a smart fellow (from other threads we have engaged in). I’m surprised you would even consider this.
I used to date a bankruptcy attorney. She was a nasty little thing that made fun of many of her clients in private. Bankruptcy is very expensive in many ways and a huge hassle. We aren’t just talking a simple court date. It can drag on for years and cost as much money as you are talking about. Bankruptcy is mainly a tool for rich people, corporations or people that can never pay off their debt in a reasonable time.
The solution is hard but simple. You don’t need a debt consolidation service if you know what you are doing. You can do the same things they can do and probably even better once you have some experience.
- Pay off your lowest debt cards first while still paying the minimums on all the others.
- Zero percent interest cards for an introductory rate are a dime a dozen. Apply for those once you have a decent credit score and transfer all or part of your highest rate cards to that and make sure that you can pay it off before the introductory rate expires.
- Rinse and repeat. You need to be more like a sniper rifle and not a shotgun.
- Watch your spending like a hawk and don’t repeat the same mistakes. It isn’t fun but it is satisfying and will teach you some valuable financial lessons.
For things like medical bills and even credit cards, call them and negotiate. They will sometimes reduce the amount owed on the spot because something is better than nothing. Be polite but you can tell them that you are considering bankruptcy (true) but want to see if they can come up with a better arrangement first. They won’t always do it but it doesn’t hurt to try. I saved thousands on some medical bills years ago with one phone call. I just told them that I would give them all the money I had right then if we could call it even and it worked.
Credit cards themselves aren’t evil. I make money off of them and having lots of them helps my credit score. I also pay them off as soon as any charges hit because I hate to see any balance over $0 sticking around. The real problem is changing your overall mindset. Treat everything like cash including credit cards and save in advance for anything you need rather than spend, pray and forget about it. Always know how much money you have available and don’t go beyond that. One mental trick that works for me is to picture the worst parts of my job and ask myself if it is worth however many hours it would take to earn doing just that to go out to an expensive restaurant, buy those new clothes or whatever else. The answer is usually no but I still do plenty of fun things and still have lots of money in the bank. I am perpetually broke if anyone asks though because panhandlers come in all kinds of shapes and sizes.