# So if I have a hardware router, I don't need a software firewall? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 22, 2006, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165 "2006-01-22T23:17:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/1 "2006-01-22T23:17:20Z")
So I just installed myself a brand new Netgear wireless G router, since I have a desktop and laptop and wouldn’t mind having tem both online at the same time…more because I can than because I need to. But I heard that, since this router has a hardware firewall built in, that means i can safely disable my software firewall? Occaisionally I have a few internet accessing software that gets buggered up from my firewall, even though they are permitted to use the internet by the firewall. Plus, it does suck up a small amount of RAM and CPU cycles. Not a lot, mind you, but still…it’s there. So is there any reason to keep my Sygate firewall? ---
**Author:** ![chrisk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@chrisk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chrisk)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/2 "2006-01-22T23:22:34Z")
Don’t think there’s any good reason to put up two firewall layers in sequence. Unless your software one has any useful features that the router doesn’t, yeah, you should probably turn it off. Note that a hardware firewall could also bugger up software, and it’s a little harder to tweak. ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/3 "2006-01-22T23:31:55Z")
> [@chrisk](#): > > Note that a hardware firewall could also bugger up software, and it’s a little harder to tweak. Yeah, I’ve noticed any time I try to use bit torrent, it can’t connect. Any recomendations on how to fix it? ---
**Author:** ![St\_Ides](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@St\_Ides](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/St_Ides)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/4 "2006-01-22T23:34:59Z")
You should be fine once you configure it to your needs. Many programs may have issues connecting, and you’ll need to open certain ports for them to use. As far as BitTorrent goes, [this should help.](http://userpages.umbc.edu/~hamilton/btclientconfig.html) ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/5 "2006-01-22T23:35:42Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > Yeah, I’ve noticed any time I try to use bit torrent, it can’t connect. Any recommendations on how to fix it? You need to configure your hardware fire wall to transmit connections to the bit torrent port to you computer. There should be some method of configuring this in the hardware firewall look at the documentation. You will need to get the port number from your bit torrent client. I believe that the actual port number is user configurable. ---
**Author:** ![St\_Ides](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@St\_Ides](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/St_Ides)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2006, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/6 "2006-01-22T23:39:25Z")
Hit post too soon. If you want to find out if your firewall is working, [ShieldsUp](https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2). You want to be “stealth”, or at least “closed” ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/7 "2006-01-23T00:05:41Z")
OK, so software firewall is off, and in theory I opened up the ports on my router for BT, but still not working. I got an error (that I actually didn’t get before opening the ports) saying that it failed UPnP. I went into my router and disabled UPnP, and now BT just sits there not downloading anything. It has a status indicator saying it has not received any incoming connections, possibly because I am behind a firewall. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/8 "2006-01-23T00:09:42Z")
How does the hardware firewall stop things the way a software one does? ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/9 "2006-01-23T00:22:53Z")
Scratch that, it’s working ok, just took a little while to connect properly. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/10 "2006-01-23T00:34:48Z")
Software firewalls are able to catch programs that phone home (e.g. “Program XYZ is trying to act as a server. Is this ok?”). I’m not exactly sure how much to worry about that though. ---
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/11 "2006-01-23T00:59:44Z")
Well, ok, not entirely properly…the DL speed is very slow. I’m not sure if it’s just what I’m downloading though, because no other application seems slow. ---
**Author:** ![Sgt.Pepper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f04885/32.png) [@Sgt.Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sgt.Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/12 "2006-01-23T01:14:18Z")
Regarding BT downloads, some ISP’s are limiting BT activity over their networks to save bandwidth that’s being used by BT user’s. I had the same problem two weeks ago and finally took the time to configure my router. Turns out it’s my ISP not my router. To confirm I went from my modem straight to my PC and still couldn’t get any decent download speeds. Anyway, this is a wiki link to a BT client, Azureus, and on that page they have a number of ISP’s that have apperantly slowed BT access somehow. My ISP is on there so it does explain my problem, and it may be why your getting slow d/l speeds. [Wiki ISP list](http://azureus.aelitis.com/wiki/index.php/Internet_service_providers_that_do_not_like_file_sharing) ---
**Author:** ![Spiny\_Norman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@Spiny\_Norman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiny_Norman)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/13 "2006-01-23T01:27:39Z")
> [@minor7flat5](#): > > Software firewalls are able to catch programs that phone home (e.g. “Program XYZ is trying to act as a server. Is this ok?”). I’m not exactly sure how much to worry about that though. A very good point, and I would worry. Hardware firewalls will generally speaking protect you from any access attempts from the outside, but they won’t stop you from downloading a Trojan. (Well, some will - Cisco IDS comes to mind - but then we’re talking enterprise-level stuff.) Once there’s malicious code on your PC, your hardware firewall will happily let it initiate traffic to the outside world and your security will be breached. As **minor** points out, the software firewall will be able to alert you that something is amiss and it’ll be time to run a scan. I’d keep it. ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2006, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-i-have-a-hardware-router-i-dont-need-a-software-firewall/341165/14 "2006-01-23T01:28:24Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > … > So is there any reason to keep my Sygate firewall? You may want to keep your software firewall if you aren’t careful about the places you visit, the things you download, or if there are untrusted people or computers on your network. The router won’t protect you from threats initiated from within your network. I certainly wouldn’t dump it if I had kids or amateur computer users in my house. Other than that, yes, you can eliminate the software firewall as long as the router has NAT and basic firewall capabilities. I’ve been running that way for some years; I don’t even keep full-time virus protection running (I scan from a separate disk and the web occasionally to insure that I’m not being overconfident, but I haven’t had a Windows or Mac virus on my system for over a decade now.)