# So If The USA Became A Non-Secular State **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 8, 2005, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014 "2005-11-08T05:23:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/21 "2005-11-09T00:45:21Z")
> [@Digital Stimulus](#): > > What does it matter _how_ it would come about? As **Tuckerfan** said, it’s a hypothetical. Invent your own scenario, as realistic as you can make it. The question is, would the country implode if it became non-secular? > > I’d think not, at least not for at least a generation or two. Even given the will of some to impose their brand of morality on others, I can’t imagine they’d be so stupid as to go whole-hog right off the bat. There would have to be a progression of sorts, first eroding certain things commonly accepted today as rights (e.g., abortion), before imposing more far-reaching laws (e.g., religious tests for public office). Besides, the more moderate religious folk – whom I believe are much more numerous than the nutjobs – would temper the extremes. And by the time a generation or two goes by, there might be enough acclimation of the populace that not only would it be hard to change back, but the state of affairs would be accepted as normal and proper. I’m not so sure; Christian extremists are noted for _not_ accepting the idea of compromise (or even denying that there even _is_ such a thing as middle ground. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/22 "2005-11-09T00:52:05Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I’m not so sure; Christian extremists are noted for _not_ accepting the idea of compromise (or even denying that there even _is_ such a thing as middle ground. What extremists ever are? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/23 "2005-11-09T01:16:44Z")
I realise that was somewhat tautological, however, I think that if they found themselves in a position of power, the more vociferous extreme of evangelical Christianity would waste no time at all in attempting to implement wide-ranging measures; they would probably find the idea of phased introduction offensive. ---
**Author:** ![MelCthefirst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eada6e/32.png) [@MelCthefirst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MelCthefirst)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/24 "2005-11-09T01:40:20Z")
I used to get a great chuckle out of the church names and locations in Maine - there’d be like 3 next to each other all with slightly different names: Church of Jesus, Church of the baby Jesus reform, Church of the weeping baby Jesus reform babtist. My assumption was that one group got pissy with the main group, left and formed their own church, rinse repeat. Would not this happen in the non-sectarian US? Just depends on how pissy they get with each other and if they were into guns? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/25 "2005-11-09T14:01:46Z")
> [@MelCthefirst](#): > > I used to get a great chuckle out of the church names and locations in Maine - there’d be like 3 next to each other all with slightly different names: Church of Jesus, Church of the baby Jesus reform, Church of the weeping baby Jesus reform babtist. My assumption was that one group got pissy with the main group, left and formed their own church, rinse repeat. That’s pretty much the reason for the existence of many of the mainstream denominations; Methodism, for example, broke away from the Anglican tradition when reform within it was impossible/resisted. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/26 "2005-11-09T14:19:27Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > That’s pretty much the reason for the existence of many of the mainstream denominations; Methodism, for example, broke away from the Anglican tradition when reform within it was impossible/resisted. The whole Protestant church as well, with Luther’s 95 Theses on the church door at Wittenberg. Which would tend to imply that the Biblical Values party would shortly have competing political parties, each emphasizing a different agenda. So, depending on the level of popular support for the non-secularity of the US, this would act either as a escape valve for discontent with whatever the new parties disagreed with the BV pary on, or the beginning of the rebellion that restored secularism (or blew the country apart). Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/27 "2005-11-09T14:28:47Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > The whole Protestant church as well, with Luther’s 95 Theses on the church door at Wittenberg. > > Which would tend to imply that the Biblical Values party would shortly have competing political parties, each emphasizing a different agenda. So, depending on the level of popular support for the non-secularity of the US, this would act either as a escape valve for discontent with whatever the new parties disagreed with the BV pary on, or the beginning of the rebellion that restored secularism (or blew the country apart). > > Regards, > Shodan I think we could reasonably infer that the Biblical Values party would start off with a great deal of rigour and enthusiasm, but that it would slide gradually into bland ineffectuality, from which new, rigorous and fervent minority factions would arise and attempt to seize power. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2005, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/28 "2005-11-09T22:43:45Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Which would tend to imply that the Biblical Values party would shortly have competing political parties, each emphasizing a different agenda. So, depending on the level of popular support for the non-secularity of the US, this would act either as a escape valve for discontent with whatever the new parties disagreed with the BV pary on, or the beginning of the rebellion that restored secularism (or blew the country apart). > > Regards, > Shodan I’d guess that the scenario would start not with the election of a president, but with a Constitutional Amendment that would declare the US a Christian nation. That would probably get more support than a particular person. Given that, Congress could start defining competing sects out. Forget atheists - LDS might be the first to go. (Not real Christians, doncha know.) An extremist party would start oppressing other religions. Before you know it, they’d start blowing up things (Iraq would be a good model) and we’d either have total oppression or a full scale rebellion. It won’t matter that the majority of the population is apathetic - a fervent minority can make plenty of trouble. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2005, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014/29 "2005-11-10T05:00:22Z")
“First they came for the gays, but I didn’t speak up because I was straight. Then they came for the Mormons, but I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t Mormon, Then they came for the Catholics, but I didn’t speak up because I was Protestant. By the time they came for me, there was no one left to speak up.” (apologies to Martin Niemöller) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-if-the-usa-became-a-non-secular-state/330014.md?page=1)