# So I'm thinking about becoming a gun owner... **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 17, 2006, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009 "2006-04-17T15:16:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Obsidian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/51bf81/32.png) [@Obsidian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Obsidian)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2006, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/41 "2006-04-20T22:46:17Z")
> [@Ogre](#): > > And if it doesn’t? What then? What if they duck and shoot? You’re fucked, that’s what. Bad idea. Well, I wouldn’t shoot blindly in the general direction of whatever sound happens to be there either. A vocal warning would make just as much of a target out of me. I never said I wouldn’t shoot-- or that I don’t expect to kill if I do. I’d just rather scare someone off if I could do that before I had to kill them. Making gun sounds or threatening to shoot without being able to follow up with bullets seems like a good way to end up dead. I’m sorry my original statement sounded more flip and ditzy than I meant it. **Mr. Krebbs** makes a good point about mechanical fumbling, though I’m not comfortable keeping a loaded gun with it’s safety off. I was just thinking out loud, anyway. Between my roommate and my SO (both in law enforcement), I have my armed-resistance-to-invaders needs covered. My job is to hide and call 911. My boyfriend is certainly far better trained than I ever will be. I just always thought if I had to live alone, a shotgun would be my weapon of choice-- mostly because I don’t think that in the dark and pumped with adrenaline, I could shoot effectively with a pistol. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/42 "2006-04-21T00:15:33Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > In Australia after a natural disaster, people think about ways they can make themselves safer in the future. They might up their insurance or they might reinforce their fences/roofs for protection. _Pfffft_. How barbaric! Building fences and reinforcing roofs, thinking only of themselves! When a natural disaster happens in _my_ country the first thing people do is walk and give hot tea and cookies to their neighbors to make sure they’re OK. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/43 "2006-04-21T01:02:05Z")
> [@UncleBeer](#): > > Me, I got a Browning Bullseye SE .22 target pistol in the nightstand because I **know** I can shoot the pecker off a gnat with that thing. First two shots are shotshells. If those don’t make a guys stop and think, there’s 9 more little hollow points right behind 'em. And then three more magazines. I agree for the most part. But you may have a hard time with a jury it you have to shoot the intruder 5 or 6 times. Ya never know. I disagree that you would shoot with .22 birdshot to get their attention. Same as racking the slide on a shotgun. You are either defending your life, or you are not. I choose a .357. I’m just as concerned with bears as humans. And I have no worries about over penetration as I live far out in the sticks. It’s not only ‘to each his own’ it’s the correct protection for your circumstance. I completely disagree that an AR or carbine would be hard to handle in a house. It may be hard to hide, or get to quickly, but not hard to handle. They are really no bigger than a defensive shotgun. I do think that a short barreled shotgun, or carbine makes a great defensive weapon (ignoring over penetration issues for the carbine). > [@UncleBeer](#): > > Its use is also something I’d rather not have to try to justify in court. (RE: the AR)I agree with this. My Father purchased a Springfield 1911 a number of years ago. An Officers Model. Not a magnum (obviously) or Combat Special (or whatever they are now). His reasoning was the same as yours. Considering how little people seem to know about guns, even In the US, the prosecution, or defense might bring up that the home invader was shot with a .357 magnum….a MAGNUM. Even if it was loaded with .38s. Or, in the case of your Browning .22. The intruder was shot numerous times. I sort of hate this axiom from the show ‘This Old House’, but I think it may apply here. Measure twice, cut once. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/44 "2006-04-21T01:05:36Z")
> [@Obsidian](#): > > **Mr. Krebbs** makes a good point about mechanical fumbling, though I’m not comfortable keeping a loaded gun with it’s safety off. The safety is always off regardless of it’s position. Just like a gun is always loaded. ---
**Author:** ![cerberus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cerberus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cerberus)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/45 "2006-04-21T01:23:06Z")
I like the Armalites, could never warmed up to the .223/5.56mm … Fortunately the AR-10 is chambered for 7.62mm/.308. I have to agree that the AR is a better “riot/zombie”-type weapon. But indoors, a full-size weapon can be clunky. A safe choice for a defensive pistol is to get whatever the police have. PDs tend to go with moderate, conservative choices for their sidearms, due to image and liability issues. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/46 "2006-04-21T01:55:59Z")
> [@UncleBeer](#): > > A .357 loaded with .38 Special’s might be a good compromise. Not that I’d really recommend a handgun for use in the home anyway. All centerfire (and probably most rimfire) handgun loads are gonna penetrate walls and floors And all shot shells will penetrate two pieces of drywall at in home distances. Just more to clean up. Really UncleBeer, have you thought this out at all? ---
**Author:** ![cerberus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cerberus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cerberus)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/47 "2006-04-21T03:13:39Z")
A weapon chambered for .357Magnum can chamber and fire .38special, .38+P, .38P+P …When you buy a .357Magnum, you’re getting a .38 for free. As for the penetration issue…practice the marksmanship. Also, there are now (or will be soon) _frangible_ rounds specifically designed to work on people, but not walls and such. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Robson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gary_robson/32/3448_2.png) [@Gary\_Robson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Robson)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/48 "2006-04-21T04:29:47Z")
> [@Martini Enfield](#): > > That’s not the point I was making- the point I was making is that people in Australia don’t immediately start looting and shooting people as soon as natural disaster strikes- they get together and help each other rebuild, then have a few cold drinks and a barbie when the Red Cross, State Emergency Service, and other Disaster Relief agencies show up a few hours later… Do you live in a city? Perhaps your issue isn’t so much U.S. vs. Australia as urban vs. rural. There’s a big difference between a natural disaster in a place like here (small town Montana, USA) and downtown in a huge urban area. The majority of my neighbors and I have well-stocked larders (it’s a long way to the store), generators to run our well pumps for water, gas and/or diesel tanks on the property, and people tend to know their neighbors. What are we going to do in case of emergency? Pool our resources and get back on our feet, or hoof it to the nearest town to riot and/or loot something? In a big city, there simply aren’t resources there for long-term survival. If the supply chain breaks, people start dying. That’s pretty panic-inducing. I can understand how some people might freak out (although I don’t get the whole vandalism and random violence thing). I’d be frightened in a big city with no power, no water, no sewer, a 3-day supply of food, a one-day supply of water, and thousands of people I don’t know packed into a very small area. If an emergency out here stretched out into weeks or months, we have horses and guns and plenty of people who know how to hunt. It might not be pleasant, but we wouldn’t have to panic the minute we realized there was an emergency. Is that the kind of thing you’re talking about? ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/49 "2006-04-21T06:25:20Z")
> [@Martini Enfield](#): > > Wouldn’t an AR-15 be a bit bulky and awkward to use inside? I would think so, and as others have said, that would be hard to explain to a jury, who are going to look at it and think “Machine gun”. Now, an AR-15 sounds very useful for a Zombie Invasion/Riot situation. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/50 "2006-04-21T14:06:30Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > And all shot shells will penetrate two pieces of drywall at in home distances. Just more to clean up. Really UncleBeer, have you thought this out at all? .22LR shotshells? Thru two pieces of drywall at 10’? Not in my experience. > [@](#): > > I agree for the most part. But you may have a hard time with a jury it you have to shoot the intruder 5 or 6 times. Ya never know. That’s the reason for the the first two shotshells. I can conclusively demonstrate that I made every reasonable effort to avoid a killing shot. Small caliber, target pistol, tiny little projectiles. > [@](#): > > I disagree that you would shoot with .22 birdshot to get their attention. Same as racking the slide on a shotgun. > > You are either defending your life, or you are not. The shotshells are there as a first line deterrent. If being peppered with those, doesn’t make the bad guy stop, then there are plenty of rounds remaining with which to defend myself. Certainly being peppered with a couple dozen little pellets is gonna have more effect than working the action of my pump gun. > [@](#): > > I choose a .357. I’m just as concerned with bears as humans. And I have no worries about over penetration as I live far out in the sticks. It’s not only ‘to each his own’ it’s the correct protection for your circumstance. I won’t argue your choice of firearm, but I really think a jury’s gonna look more acceptingly on me with my .22LR mixed loads, than you blasting some bad guy with the same thing you keep around for bears. So yeah, I’ve thought it out. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [April 21, 2006, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009/51 "2006-04-21T14:15:57Z")
> [@UncleBeer](#): > > .The shotshells are there as a first line deterrent. If being peppered with those, doesn’t make the bad guy stop, then there are plenty of rounds remaining with which to defend myself. Certainly being peppered with a couple dozen little pellets is gonna have more effect than working the action of my pump gun. I guess my point with this is, that I feel I can effectively defend myself without plugging someone with a single first killing projectile. And I rather explain multiple shots to a jury than a big old magnum. After all, it’s all but certain that if you hafta take a first shot, you’re gonna empty at least half the cylinder (or magazine in my case) anyway. The number of shots fired, I believe, is going to be of far less import to a jury than the “scary gun factor,” simply because there may not be that large a difference between the number of shots taken. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-im-thinking-about-becoming-a-gun-owner/353009.md?page=2)