# so is a book racist if it doesn't explicitly mention that there are some minority characters? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 13, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555 "2013-04-13T01:02:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/1 "2013-04-13T01:02:40Z")
not wanting to de-rail the Harry Potter thread ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/2 "2013-04-13T01:14:26Z")
> [@PSXer](#): > > not wanting to de-rail the Harry Potter thread You mean the [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687957) where the OP says this? > [@HARRY POTTER question: Are there any black students mentioned at Hogwarts?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/harry-potter-question-are-there-any-black-students-mentioned-at-hogwarts/655537/1): > > I am also not accusing J. K. Rowling of racism in her writing. I’m just wondering. > > Anyway: in Rowling’s novels, are any Hogwarts students (or for that matter faculty) specifically mentioned as being black? ---
**Author:** ![PSXer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/48db29/32.png) [@PSXer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PSXer)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/3 "2013-04-13T01:21:28Z")
And I never accused that OP of accusing JK Rowling of racism. Just asking in general ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/4 "2013-04-13T01:30:40Z")
No. ---
**Author:** ![3trew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/13edae/32.png) [@3trew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3trew)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/5 "2013-04-13T01:52:24Z")
Short thread. Well done all. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/6 "2013-04-13T02:50:01Z")
No, of course not. But it is interesting what happens when a book is turned into a movie and [characters](http://jezebel.com/5896408/racist-hunger-games-fans-dont-care-how-much-money-the-movie-made) don’t look the way readers think they should. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/7 "2013-04-13T03:09:25Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > You mean the [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687957) where the OP says this? Which looks just like a mirror image of “I’m not a racist, but…” ---
**Author:** ![shijinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/8 "2013-04-13T03:10:31Z")
i’m thinking of the _Walking Dead_, though i’m also not accusing them of being racist, as it appears to be more of an “issue with the actor whom they couldn’t fire for whatever reason” thing. it is hilarious that they immediately replaced him with another black character when they did finally wrote him off though. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/9 "2013-04-13T03:17:48Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Which looks just like a mirror image of “I’m not a racist, but…” A number of black (and Asian, for that matter) actors appear in the _Harry Potter_ films, so I don’t think it requires any hidden agenda to idly wonder if the race of these characters is specified in the books. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/10 "2013-04-13T03:46:39Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > A number of black (and Asian, for that matter) actors appear in the _Harry Potter_ films, so I don’t think it requires any hidden agenda to idly wonder if the race of these characters is specified in the books. **Skald** made it quite explicit that he had not seen the movies and was not asking about them, so that wasn’t it. In fact, as one would expect, on the matter of characters’ races the movies followed the books quite closely (except that they gave a lot more screen time than the text would warrant to the black kid who did the Quidditch commentary). ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/11 "2013-04-13T04:39:54Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > **Skald** made it quite explicit that he had not seen the movies and was not asking about them, so that wasn’t it. That doesn’t mean he’s never seen any photo of or reference to any of the non-white actors in the cast of the movies. Although looking at the thread again, it seems he may have been asking just because he was aware that the books dealt with prejudice regarding the “blood purity” of wizards and was curious as to whether prejudice based on skin color ever came up. I really don’t see anything in the other thread to suggest that he secretly suspects that J.K. Rowling is a racist. He openly acknowledged that his question might be taken as an accusation of racism but stated that this was not his intention, and I don’t see any reason to doubt him. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/12 "2013-04-13T05:09:46Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > (except that they gave a lot more screen time than the text would warrant to the black kid who did the Quidditch commentary). Well, they were going to give screen time to _somebody_ describing Quidditch, because without the commentary (indeed, even _with_ it) the game makes no sense whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/13 "2013-04-13T05:17:10Z")
Actually I find it worse when they make a point to describe the race of certain characters, as if there is a white default and they must tell us when someone isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Sr\_Siete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Sr\_Siete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sr_Siete)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/14 "2013-04-13T05:27:26Z")
Actually, I can imagine that a book could be racist while not mentioning characters from a racial minority, as long as the race of the characters keeps being mentioned, even if it’s a majority race. Imagine a German book from the 30’s talking about the hero’s “pure arian blood” or mentioning often, and in a positive way his blond hair and blue eyes. ---
**Author:** ![Reverse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@Reverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reverse)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/15 "2013-04-13T05:47:08Z")
Is the reader racist for assuming that all characters are white unless stated otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/16 "2013-04-13T05:56:41Z")
> [@Sr\_Siete](#): > > Actually, I can imagine that a book could be racist while not mentioning characters from a racial minority, as long as the race of the characters keeps being mentioned, even if it’s a majority race. > > Imagine a German book from the 30’s talking about the hero’s “pure arian blood” or mentioning often, and in a positive way his blond hair and blue eyes. Heck, what if the hero is repeatedly described as having marble-like alabaster skin that… y’know… sparkles in sunlight? ---
**Author:** ![Sr\_Siete](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6de8d8/32.png) [@Sr\_Siete](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sr_Siete)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/17 "2013-04-13T05:58:34Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Heck, what if the hero is repeatedly described as having marble-like alabaster skin that… y’know… sparkles in sunlight? There you go. Clearly a book doing such a thing must be evil. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/18 "2013-04-13T06:22:32Z")
You might want to check out Le Guin’s Earthsea books. She doesn’t make a big deal of it, but none of the characters in the first book are white skinned. In the second book a major character is white skinned. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/19 "2013-04-13T13:57:00Z")
If the racial distribution of characters in a book was noticeably off from the real-life racial distribution in a particular area, that could seem strange to me. For instance, if someone wrote a political thriller taking place in Washington D.C. and every single character was black, it would probably strike me that the author had some kind of agenda he’s trying to push (notwithstanding the demographics of Washington D.C.). ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555/20 "2013-04-13T16:26:33Z")
> [@Reverse](#): > > Is the reader racist for assuming that all characters are white unless stated otherwise? I think that’s an interesting question, because I do USUALLY think of “white” as the default skin color when I’m reading. I’m white, and no, I don’t have any black friends - I do have black co-workers, but there aren’t even many of them. I read primarily fantasy and science fiction, and what I find interesting is that when an author takes the time to set up a specific ethnic element in their worldbuilding, then I’m more likely to think of the characters as non-white. Examples where I can’t remember one way or the other, so I’m just going on my mental image: Zelazny’s Amber Cycle - everyone’s white because there’s not an immediate textual reason for them not to be. Zelazny’s Lord of Light - everyone’s Indian (not Native American) because they’re on a planet that’s expressly Hindu. I guess that does make me racist because I default to white, but I’m not too worried about it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-is-a-book-racist-if-it-doesnt-explicitly-mention-that-there-are-some-minority-characters/655555.md?page=2)