So is it actually bad if people join the military for the bennies?

There’s a bit at the beginning of the first episode of the Band of Brothers miniseries, where they’re talking to some of the surviving veterans from Easy Company. They’re talking about why they joined up to be paratroopers. Most talk about duty, or doing what’s right. But my favorite anecdote goes something like:

“This recruiter comes by our highschool, and says, ‘Who wants to be a paratrooper?’ We didn’t know what that was, so he says, ‘We give you a parachute, and you jump out of a plane.’ We said he was crazy. Who’d sign up for that? Then he said, ‘You get an extra $20 a month…’”

The only issue I could have is if there is a segment of the population (read: poor) that feel the only way to get out of poverty is to join the military. That would create a situation where it’s largely the poor who go off and fight (and die).

I don’t believe that is the situation in the US and I don’t have a problem with the military being ONE of the ways to potentially escape poverty.

People signed up, at least in some cases, for the 82nd Airborne for the same reason.

More dangerous, but more money and prestige.

I remember many years ago someone in the news (I think it was a grandparent) raging against the first Iraq war and how it wasn’t fair his precious grandson was going to be sent into harm’s way because after all he only joined in order to get an education.

I think it’s perfectly fine to join the military for the benefits as long as long as the enlistees keep in mind that they are signing up to possibly be sent into combat. As someone once said, the reason the Army and other armed forces exist is not to be a government benefit program but to break things and kill people. It’s not kosher to whinge (or for a parent or other relative to whinge), when faced with the possibility of combat, to object or feel cheated on the grounds that they only joined for the education, healthcare or whatnot.

Actually, the Navy AND Air Force tend to be big on those points, because for most sailors and airmen, the wartime/peacetime difference isn’t that great, and the skills that you use in either situation as your primary job can be, and often are directly transferrable to civilian life.

For example, I had a friend who I used to work with who’d been an avionics technician on aircraft carriers for years, and essentially in wartime, he’d still be working on F-14 avionics, and manning a fire hose if the ship suffered damage(that was his battle station). When he got out, guess what? He ended up an electronics tech, based on his Navy experience. Another guy I know was/is a diver in the Navy Reserve, and you guessed it, his civilian job is being a diver as well.

The Air Force is much the same. However, a lot of Army/Marine jobs don’t have much direct civilian crossover. If you’re a loader on a tank crew, that doesn’t translate into many civilian jobs. Neither does being a gunlayer, or a machine gunner. However, some do- things like mechanics and signals work tend to transfer to the civilian world pretty easily, but I get the impression that a higher proportion of USAF/USN jobs are more transferrable to civilian life than USMC/USA jobs.

This thread was started to continue an argument begun in a thread that has been closed. We’re “arguing” with the character who started that thread. Or his “co-workers”…

It doesn’t sound especially glorious to hear there are people who don’t fully buy into the serving-my-country rationale and join/stay in the military for the benefits they can use later in life.

Then again, they have to put up with a lot of crap and could wind up as targets for bombs or bullets, so it’s hard to begrudge them the, uh, fabulous pay and benefits.

I can’t see someone enlisting because they like the military lifestyle. I CAN see someone RE-enlisting because they like the military lifestyle.

There are many reasons for someone to join the service. For some, they want a fresh start, a blank slate, or just a change. For others, 3 steady meals a day wasn’t a reality in civvy street. For some, it’s a needful escape. Why one joined wasn’t much of a big deal in my time. I was concerned about whether they did the job or not. And as long as the decks get buffed or the potatoes get peeled while you’re pissing and moaning about the unfairness of it all, I had no problem with it. When you’ve finished and if you’ve done it right, I’ll gladly give you a chit to see the Chaplain.

I don’t ask my doctor if she loves helping people before entrusting her with my health. Presumably I chose her because she’s competent at what she does. Not for having the right amount of love.

I don’t see service people any differently. We need people to defend the country. You don’t have to feel a certain way to do a good job. Which is why I don’t have any problem treating those who serve with the same respect as anyone else. I don’t worship the uniform.

Now, if I had a kid and they wanted to join up, I’d probably want them to join up for something other than benefits. I’d tell them risking life and limb just so you can go to college simply isn’t a smart decision. If they’re that desperate, shit, I’ll take out some loans or bankrupt myself. I’d prefer having to pinch pennies over having to care for someone who’s paralyzed, brain injured or PTSD’d. But if some other person wants to make that choice for themselves, ok.

No benefits is enough if you risk your life. I suspect a foreign power is behind this thread. :smiley:

Why? I mean, what’s the difference?

In my father’s case he didn’t want to end up on the ground in Vietnam. Three of his friends had died there already. He expected to be drafted so instead signed up for the air force. The air force had the lowest odds of being stationed in Vietnam. Instead he ended up in Guam for most the war.

Ah, I see. Thanks.

My dad enlisted in the air force at 17 (during Korea) said it was the next best thing to draft dodging.

You risk you life on a daily basis it’s part of living.

Milton Friedman had a lot to do with us transitioning to an all volunteer service. Apparently some of the Generals were very against the idea and thought the draft was important General Westmorland called volunteers who joined for benefits “mercenaries”. Milton asked him if he liked being a general of a slave army. Westmoreland said that he didn’t like his draftee army called slaves and Milton said he didn’t like his patriotic volunteers called mercenaries.

When you were drafted, sure, they’d let you request what specialty you wanted, they they put you where they wanted to put you. If you enlisted, you could have a specialty school put in your enlistment contract. An enlistee had more options. Also, a draftee was in for 2 years, an enlistee for 3 years, so the Army isn’t going to send a draftee to a longer lasting school. They’d get to keep an enlistee for a year longer than a draftee going to the same school.

My father enlisted at 17 in 1945 for the GI Bill, and he used that to go to college and eventually earned a PhD.

Frankly, I’d probably have a more positive view of someone who saw military service as a means to self-improvement, i.e. they have a goal in mind and see enlisting as a way of furthering that goal, over someone who joined for vague patriotic or idealistic reasons.

Heck, for real mercenary motives, there’s been a century of Americans and Canadians crossing the border to join the other’s wars - Americans going to Canada before 1917 and 1941 and 30,000 Canadians going to the U.S. to enlist during Vietnam. These guys more likely wanted adventure and excitement over some vapid sense of patriotism.

That’s essentially what my Dad did too; he enlisted in the USAF just before graduating college, as his draft number had already been chosen, but he was still in college.

So basically when he graduated and the Army came calling, he was able to say “Sorry… I’m in the Air Force already.”

This probably wouldn’t work in a modern internet world; I suspect the local draft boards would be coordinated with the enlistment systems, so that if he went to enlist in the USAF, they’d look him up and say “Sorry, you’ve already been drafted by the Army. Go see Sgt. So-And-So down the hall.”