# So let's hold off on stabbing our neighbors in vigilante justice for just a moment... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 20, 2006, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193 "2006-10-20T05:31:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Push\_Up\_Bra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/edb3f5/32.png) [@Freudian\_Push\_Up\_Bra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Push_Up_Bra)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2006, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/21 "2006-10-21T02:35:45Z")
I will not post when hopped up on caffeine. I will not post when hopped up on caffeine. I will not post when hopped up on caffeine. I will not post when hopped up on caffeine. I will not post when hopped up on caffeine. :eek: Just think; I tried to write an essay too! But at least no one else saw that… What I must have meant to say was; acting before you think it through. :smack: How embarrassing… ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2006, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/22 "2006-10-23T18:24:00Z")
[QUOTE=Firebringer] On the one hand I think, ‘hang the fucker’ he killed an innocent man. That’s completely outrageous. On the other hand if the victim had actually abused his daughter I would have had a lot of sympathy. Ie the victim had it coming. [/QUOTE] This problem is why we have a judicial system, rules of evidence, lawyers, and so on, instead of allowing the victim or the victim’s family to go after someone who has committed a crime. ---
**Author:** ![Billdo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/billdo/32/315_2.png) [@Billdo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Billdo)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2006, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/23 "2006-10-23T20:56:24Z")
Here’s today’s episode: [Sailor Kills Marine After Lie About Rape](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061023/ap_on_re_us/marine_slain) Apparently a not particularly swift Petty Officer fancied himself in love with a hotel clerk calling herself Samantha (actually Ashley Elrod, 22). Young Miss Samantha/Ashley apparently told our hero that she had been gang raped by a number of service members, including a Marine named Huff or Huffman. When the sailor found a Marine named Huff, he posed as a Naval investigator, took the Marine for supposed questioning, slit his throat and buired his body. Later it turns out that her name was not the only thing the young woman was lying about – she had made up the rape. Ooops. ---
**Author:** ![Lizard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@Lizard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lizard)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2006, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/24 "2006-10-25T21:44:35Z")
[QUOTE=lissener] It seems to me the wife bears a huge share of responsibility here. Her husband killed a guy bases \*solely \*on her word. Know what I think? She was messin’ around with the neighbor, he dumped her, and she sicced her husband on him. [/QUOTE] I thought that too, but not after reading the story **KSO** links to. The wife has to be in her late 20s to early 30s, while the victim was 59 years old and living with his parents–hardly gigolo material. But this info on the victim being seen hanging around in his room naked by the killer is interesting. My guess? The killer already thought the victim was weird and disgusting, and hearing about possible molestation was just enough to push him over the edge. Sometimes people develop intense, irrational hatred of those who are different from them. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/25 "2006-10-26T01:52:52Z")
[QUOTE=Lizard] I thought that too, but not after reading the story **KSO** links to. The wife has to be in her late 20s to early 30s, while the victim was 59 years old and living with his parents–hardly gigolo material. [/QUOTE] However, there’s never any telling why one person gets hooked up with another. It could’ve been due to her husband’s jealousy (or lack there of), it was easy, she was a nympho/lonely/emotionally or mentally disturbed, or any other of a million different reasons (or combinations). I’m sure we couldn’t guess either way. > [@](#): > > But this info on the victim being seen hanging around in his room naked by the killer is interesting. My guess? The killer already thought the victim was weird and disgusting, and hearing about possible molestation was just enough to push him over the edge. Sometimes people develop intense, irrational hatred of those who are different from them. That part sounds most plausible to me, added with the after-the-fact ‘addition’ of assumptions. Something wasn’t right in this mess, besides the murder. Wonder if it was possible that was the excuse given to cover up any molestation in the home? ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/26 "2006-10-26T04:17:07Z")
[More details here](http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/463557p-389959c.html) [Guy apparently had a big anger management problem](http://www.fairfieldcitizen-news.com/local/ci_4547017) and wife pushed the right buttons > [@](#): > > The bizarre case of mistaken retaliation started with a talk between the little girl and her mother, Christina, while the two were visiting relatives in Rhode Island, a police report said. > > The girl “explained that she did not want to go home because of Barry,” police said in the report. > > When her mother asked her to explain, the girl said “that Barry puts it on her belly and her nose,” the report said. > > When her mother asked her when James did this, she replied, “He comes to me in the starry nights.” > > Edington’s wife called her husband at home on the leafy suburban street where the couple and their two children moved about a year ago when he started work at a Fairfield-based law firm. > > The angry dad broke into James’ home through a window and stabbed him repeatedly with a kitchen knife, police said. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/27 "2006-10-26T12:47:40Z")
> [@](#): > > When her mother asked her when James did this, she replied, “He comes to me in the starry nights.” Sounds like the kid has been listening to too much bad '70s folk rock. Maybe her dad should have killed Dan Fogelberg. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2006, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/28 "2006-10-26T14:31:33Z")
My first thought on reading what the child supposedly said was, does _any_ two-year-old actually speak like that? “He comes to me in the starry night” – does that sound like how a toddler would phrase something? ---
**Author:** ![Martiju](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e8c25b/32.png) [@Martiju](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martiju)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/29 "2006-11-03T13:06:38Z")
[QUOTE=Eve] Sounds like the kid has been listening to too much bad '70s folk rock. Maybe her dad should have killed Dan Fogelberg. [/QUOTE] With such a serious story, I am so going to hell for laughing out loud at this! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/30 "2006-11-03T14:59:34Z")
[QUOTE=Eve] Sounds like the kid has been listening to too much bad '70s folk rock. Maybe her dad should have killed Dan Fogelberg. [/QUOTE] Gack! That’s Tom McClean-not Fogelberg… I agree that there is much more to this story. And how close together are these houses that they can see the now deceased walking around naked? And why are they looking in other people’s windows? And how do you explain this to this 2 year old daughter–Daddy’s in jail because he killed a man to protect you. Turns out you weren’t in danger? Sooner or later, the kid/teen/young woman will figure this out. This guy needs the book thrown at him-he needs to be tried for murder and sent to prison, attempts at pulling heart strings should not be admitted into court. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/31 "2006-11-03T15:43:18Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] Gack! That’s Tom McClean-not Fogelberg… [/QUOTE] :: cough :: That would be [Don McLean](http://www.rareexception.com/Garden/Pie.php) ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/32 "2006-11-03T16:17:31Z")
[QUOTE=glee] Presumably the family of the murdered man can now kill the attorney. :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] And then have it discovered that the attorney had never stabbed their loved one to death in the first place? How embarassing would that be? Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![LilyoftheValley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/54ee81/32.png) [@LilyoftheValley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LilyoftheValley)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/33 "2006-11-03T17:03:44Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] And how close together are these houses that they can see the now deceased walking around naked? [/QUOTE] :eek: Most self-respecting zombies at least wear torn clothes covering their nether regions. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/34 "2006-11-03T17:11:09Z")
[QUOTE=eleanorigby] And how close together are these houses that they can see the now deceased walking around naked? And why are they looking in other people’s windows? [/QUOTE] Dunno about there, but here in Denver the trend has been to build huge houses on small lots. In many developments, one could almost reach out the window and touch the house next door. ---
**Author:** ![lisacurl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/41988e/32.png) [@lisacurl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisacurl)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/35 "2006-11-03T21:10:53Z")
[QUOTE=lissener] It seems to me the wife bears a huge share of responsibility here. Her husband killed a guy bases \*solely \*on her word. Know what I think? She was messin’ around with the neighbor, he dumped her, and she sicced her husband on him. [/QUOTE] Actually, that sounds like a really good plot for my NaNoWriMo novel if you don’t mind my borrowing it? ---
**Author:** ![buttonjockey308](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bcef8e/32.png) [@buttonjockey308](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buttonjockey308)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/36 "2006-11-03T22:16:12Z")
That’s why you wait until AFTER the trial to exact vigilante justice. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/37 "2006-11-03T22:57:48Z")
[QUOTE=lisacurl] Actually, that sounds like a really good plot for my NaNoWriMo novel if you don’t mind my borrowing it? [/QUOTE] Been done - in fact, the very first **Alfred Hitchcock Presents** had exactly this plot. (The first episode of the remake series did too.) A man and his wife, who has gone through a trauma, move into a trailer park. When he comes back from work one day, he finds she has been raped. Enraged, he asks her to point out the guilty party. They drive around, and then she points to a man on the street and says “he did it!” The husband murders him in revenge. Then his revenge achieved, they are driving around again, when she points to another man walking on the street and cries "he did it! That’s the one. The end. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2006, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/38 "2006-11-03T23:31:56Z")
[QUOTE=Frank] Dunno about there, but here in Denver the trend has been to build huge houses on small lots. In many developments, one could almost reach out the window and touch the house next door. [/QUOTE] where I grew up some 50 years ago, there was very little space between houses. ---
**Author:** ![CanvasShoes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/74df32/32.png) [@CanvasShoes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CanvasShoes)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2006, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193/39 "2006-11-05T05:55:25Z")
[QUOTE=Li’l Pluck] …snip…should have done better simply by giving the legal system a chance to take its course. … [/QUOTE] Here is a big part of the problem. This in NO way excuses what the father did, but after seeing what our poor excuse for a justice system often does in these cases, one can see where people would feel (wrongly of course, but it’s understandable) the need to take justice into their own hands. Too often the animals that are actually guilty of this, get a stern lecture, perhaps a few months in jail and then get put on a list, Great big whoop, this hardly helps the parents know which are the dangerous ones, as anyone who ever got caught peeing in a park can get slapped on the sex offenders registry (sarcasm, peeing probably isn’t a sex offender offense, but I’ve heard of some pretty mild ones that had nothing to do with minors). So while I don’t agree with the man’s actions, the courts (and their inaction regarding punishing sex offenders) own a big part in having created the atmosphere in which people think this is their only option. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-lets-hold-off-on-stabbing-our-neighbors-in-vigilante-justice-for-just-a-moment/377193.md?page=1)