# So Much For the South Rising Again **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 3, 2008, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867 "2008-05-03T09:49:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/1 "2008-05-03T09:49:57Z")
[140+ year old Civil War cannonball kills Southerner.](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080502/ap_on_re_us/cannonball_death;_ylt=AmxmAoRrrIlXX_ie88su.pxH2ocA) > [@](#): > > Like many boys in the South, Sam White got hooked on the Civil War early, digging up rusting bullets and military buttons in the battle-scarred earth of his hometown. > > As an adult, he crisscrossed the Virginia countryside in search of wartime relics — weapons, battle flags, even artillery shells buried in the red clay. He sometimes put on diving gear to feel for treasures hidden in the black muck of river bottoms. > > But in February, White’s hobby cost him his life: A cannonball he was restoring exploded, killing him in his driveway. > > More than 140 years after Lee surrendered to Grant, the cannonball was still powerful enough to send a chunk of shrapnel through the front porch of a house a quarter-mile from White’s home in this leafy Richmond suburb. Seems like Grant’s master plan of leaving ordinance laying about to keep Southerners in check is still working. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/2 "2008-05-03T10:17:38Z")
I’ll be sure to use a winking smiling and chortle with glee the next time a Belgian farmer gets killed by a shell he plows up near Ypres, or a French schoolchild is torn apart by old ordinance at Verdun. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/3 "2008-05-03T10:23:42Z")
[QUOTE=Koxinga] I’ll be sure to use a winking smiling and chortle with glee the next time a Belgian farmer gets killed by a shell he plows up near Ypres, or a French schoolchild is torn apart by old ordinance at Verdun. [/QUOTE] If you’re as constantly peppered with folks making comments about the injustice of the war and how the side that (deservedly) lost is somehow going to rise up and throw off the chains of oppression as I am, then knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/4 "2008-05-03T10:35:00Z")
Certainly. I’m always happy to cultivate my sense of petty vengeance upon the occasion of another person’s death. If I ever run into Sam’s son Travis and his widow Brenda, I’ll be sure to laugh at them. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/5 "2008-05-03T11:14:40Z")
[QUOTE=Koxinga] Certainly. I’m always happy to cultivate my sense of petty vengeance upon the occasion of another person’s death. If I ever run into Sam’s son Travis and his widow Brenda, I’ll be sure to laugh at them. [/QUOTE] Which, of course, would make you far worse a human being than you think me to be. Note that Sam wasn’t some poor yutz who got himself killed when his spade hit a bomb that had been laying undisturbed for nearly a century and a half. He actively sought out such things and taught himself how to dismantle them, and kept them around the house in such numbers that his neighbors were forced to evacuate when the bomb squad discovered them so that they could be safely disposed of. Doesn’t strike me as being the kind of person who was really concerned about the safety of others. No doubt he knew that there were risks involved, and took precautions, but they weren’t enough, and certainly his death cost the world a great deal of historical knowledge, but to somehow equate posting a comment on a message board with laughing in the face of those who knew the deceased is a bit much. Interestingly enough, the board where I saw the article posted on (and I made the same comment there about Grant as I did here) was filled with war whoops about how the war was now back on, and the Southerners were going to teach the Yankee oppressors a lesson once and for all. It seems to me that if those folks can have a bit of levity about the situation (considering it killed a Southerner), I’m entitled to a little of my own. Given that the topic of the South rising again and the mistaken notions of the war being strictly about states rights or that Lincoln was the first US President to use troops against the American people, I thought some folks might be able to see a bit of humor in an otherwise tragic situation. Clearly, however, at least some here are not. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/6 "2008-05-03T12:06:19Z")
Okay. I am confused. How does a cannon ball expode? I thought they were lumps of metal rather than high explosive. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/7 "2008-05-03T12:11:04Z")
[QUOTE=Cicero] Okay. I am confused. How does a cannon ball expode? I thought they were lumps of metal rather than high explosive. [/QUOTE] Many of them were simply solid iron balls, but others of them were hollow and filled with gunpowder. The powder inside the ball could be ignited by the blast which fires the ball out of the cannon. Others, like the one responsible for the fatality in the OP had a fuse which could be triggered by impact (if they worked, which they didn’t always). ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/8 "2008-05-03T12:19:54Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Many of them were simply solid iron balls, but others of them were hollow and filled with gunpowder. The powder inside the ball could be ignited by the blast which fires the ball out of the cannon. Others, like the one responsible for the fatality in the OP had a fuse which could be triggered by impact (if they worked, which they didn’t always). [/QUOTE] You learn something new every day. I always assumed they were all solid. Good thing _I_ don’t go looking for old artifacts like that. ---
**Author:** ![Cicero](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cicero/32/3594_2.png) [@Cicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cicero)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/9 "2008-05-03T12:23:03Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Many of them were simply solid iron balls, but others of them were hollow and filled with gunpowder. The powder inside the ball could be ignited by the blast which fires the ball out of the cannon. Others, like the one responsible for the fatality in the OP had a fuse which could be triggered by impact (if they worked, which they didn’t always). [/QUOTE] Thanks- and I could google this I suppose but you seem to have some recondiite knowledge. Fuses were always a matter of concern (Great War which I know a bit more about) I would imagine that the ones ignited by the blast had a fuse long enough to allow them to not explode inside the cannon. And then it was like shrapnel? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/10 "2008-05-03T13:18:38Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] Given that the topic of the South rising again and the mistaken notions of the war being strictly about states rights or that Lincoln was the first US President to use troops against the American people, [/QUOTE] Just for the record, Washington was; I know he did in the Whiskey Rebellion, but I don’t remember if there were any incidents before then. And states’ rights? Hah! I’ve read the Confederate Constitution, and virtually all of the changes they made were to make damn sure that nobody could ever prohibit slavery. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/11 "2008-05-03T13:40:00Z")
A fellow who’s hobby is playing with old munitions getting blown up? Darwin award territory. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/12 "2008-05-03T15:02:02Z")
[QUOTE=Cicero] I would imagine that the ones ignited by the blast had a fuse long enough to allow them to not explode inside the cannon. And then it was like shrapnel? [/QUOTE] I think the guy found a “mortar shell” or whatever a the explosive round from a mortar is called. There was an episode of _Early Edition_ about that. I wonder how frequently in occurs. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/13 "2008-05-03T15:56:36Z")
[QUOTE=Muffin] A fellow who’s hobby is playing with old munitions getting blown up? Darwin award territory. [/QUOTE] Bingo. That’s exactly what I was going to say. Mess around with explosives long enough and no one is going to be surprised when you eventually explode. It’s just a good thing that he didn’t take any of his innocent neighbors or family members with him. Laughing at this is a far cry from whole “accidentally plowing up a bomb in a field” territory. This guy was an active moron, not an innocent victim. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/14 "2008-05-03T17:27:53Z")
We had a couple of scrap dealers who had acquired of pile of unwanted shells from someplace, they were using cutting torches to open them up and empty them so they could use the metal for scrap. Strangely enough one shell blew up. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/15 "2008-05-03T21:45:03Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] I think the guy found a “mortar shell” or whatever a the explosive round from a mortar is called. There was an episode of _Early Edition_ about that. I wonder how frequently in occurs. [/QUOTE] Supposedly often enough that in the 1970s the US Navy produced a manual for bomb squads on how to properly dispose of the stuff. I don’t think it’s quite as bad as parts of Europe where folks still wind up dead from WWI ordinance every year, but it happens every couple of years, I’m sure. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/16 "2008-05-03T22:15:13Z")
[QUOTE=carnivorousplant] I think the guy found a “mortar shell” or whatever a the explosive round from a mortar is called. [/QUOTE] Nope. From the article: > [@](#): > > Experts suspect White was killed while trying to disarm a 9-inch, 75-pound naval cannonball, a particularly potent explosive with a more complex fuse and many times the destructive power of those used by infantry artillery. > > Biemeck and Peter George, co-author of a book on Civil War ordnance, believe White was using either a drill or a grinder attached to a drill to remove grit from the cannonball, causing a shower of sparks. > > Because of the fuse design, it may have appeared as though the weapon’s powder had already been removed, leading even a veteran like White to conclude mistakenly that the ball was inert. > > The weapon also had to be waterproof because it was designed to skip over the water at 600 mph to strike at the waterline of an enemy ship. The protection against moisture meant the ball could have remained potent longer than an infantry shell. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2008, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-much-for-the-south-rising-again/447867/17 "2008-05-03T23:02:45Z")
Is this 140+ year duration the longest between a munition being made and it eventually killing someone?