# So my brother was just arrested (a rant) **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 6, 2003, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427 "2003-03-06T04:32:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/21 "2003-03-07T03:23:09Z")
Was the arrested guy gone from the scene? If not, then the question of watching for a violent reaction from family might make a lot more sense and if the non-arrested brother was visibly upset and not shouting that it was a good riddance for the arrested brother to be cuffed, then worrying about family retaliation and getting into a position, (inside enough to see what the non-arrested ) brother was doing sounds like a safety move on the cops part. No matter what is said, the cop should not have turned and replied. Would require a real tough, level headed, secure, well trained, well supervised policeman to not do it though. YMMV ---
**Author:** ![techchick68](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@techchick68](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/techchick68)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/22 "2003-03-07T03:45:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lord Ashtar \* > True. But if the person for whom they have a warrant is arrested outside the house, do they have _any_ reason to come into the house? Well, based on your OP I had no idea that your brother was arrested outside the house. There may have been extenuating circumstances that the cop felt he needed to come in. Since none of us are privy to the reason for your brother’s arrest I think many of us will go on assumptions. Also, I think they can go into a home at the place of arrest to make comments on the arrest report which might be germane to the case. In which case may help your brother, depending upon the reason for his arrest. Keep in mind that in some cases, depending on the arrest warrant, a cop may need to look around enough to ensure that there isn’t any evidence. Since you were hanging out with (regardless if he was your brother or not) a wanted person, they came to arrest him, your property becomes subject to some scrutiny. Do I agree with that? No. However, given the current state of laws, an officer simply walking through your home, while the alleged criminal is being detained by another cop, it is reasonable to figure it may happen. Had he gone through your drawers, closets, etc…then that would be illegal search. Be pissed off all you want but I am sure the cop in question will have a good enough reason for a judge to push it through with little or nothing. I think this would be especially so if drugs, burglary or homocide were involved. All different levels of crimes but especially if it were drugs, a cop wants to see if there’s any visible drug paraphenalia, if so, he scores another one. Unfortunately, with our current justice system, we are guilty until proven innocent. Oh, and telling the cop “Fuck You” is not a wise choice no matter how upset you are. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/23 "2003-03-07T04:09:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lord Ashtar \* > \*\ ***Disclaimer** -Hell hath no fury like that of an intelligent United States citizen with a legitimate lawsuit. \*\* You know you’ve got a point Lord Ashtar. Some might read your missive and think to themselves “Man alive Spanky, you’re lucky the man didn’t beat your silly punk ass like a bongo and take you in along with your brother just for public stupidity”, while others would stand in anxious awe of the thunderclap of righteous justice you will soon unleash on the hapless law prole for unnecessary condescension and making insufficient haste in vacating your domicile. But which position to take? Tsk….decisions, decisions. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/24 "2003-03-07T04:16:45Z")
techchick: Can you provide a cite to show that the major presumption of our justice system has been switched? AFAIK, the prosecution still has to prove the case, not have you disprove it. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/25 "2003-03-07T04:39:38Z")
**Lord Ashtar,** I have some questions. First, did the cops enter your house in pursuit of your brother? I want to be clear on this point, did the police chase your brother into your house? (From your OP it doesn’t sound that way but I have to ask) If not, did you willingly let the cops in? Did the cops have a warrent? If the answer to these questions is ‘no’ you probably have a decent case against the cops. I’ve had some bad experiences with cops, in fact I got three fired a long time ago. Cops can and do often stretch the law. If that is the case sue them. Slee, Though I do appreciate the good cops that are out there. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/26 "2003-03-07T13:40:34Z")
An officer making an arrest is legally permitted to search the person he’s arresting, as well as the area surrounding the person he’s arresting, without a warrant. This is called a “search incident to arrest” and is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement. And since the elusive 28th Amendment, “The right of the people to be free from condescending police officers shall be secure,” does not appear in my copy of the Constitution… I’m still wondering what constitutional violation occured here. - Rick ---
**Author:** ![Meatros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/27 "2003-03-07T14:03:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Troy McClure SF \* > \*\*Am I the only one who saw this? > > Is this, in fact, required? \*\* I second this question. Does anyone know if they have to give out their badge number and name? I would assume they would have to. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/28 "2003-03-07T20:52:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sleestak \* > \*\ ***Lord Ashtar,** > > I have some questions. > > First, did the cops enter your house in pursuit of your brother? I want to be clear on this point, did the police chase your brother into your house? (From your OP it doesn’t sound that way but I have to ask) If not, did you willingly let the cops in? Did the cops have a warrent? If the answer to these questions is ‘no’ you probably have a decent case against the cops.\*\* In answer to your questions, he was picked up in the backyard, where he ran when he saw the cops pull up in front of the house. I have no problem with them going back there to get him, as they did have a warrant for his arrest. They knocked on the front door and pushed right past my other brother, who answered the door. They did not have a search warrant for the house. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2003, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/29 "2003-03-07T20:54:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bricker \* > \*\*An officer making an arrest is legally permitted to search the person he’s arresting, as well as the area surrounding the person he’s arresting, without a warrant. This is called a “search incident to arrest” and is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement. > > - Rick \*\* What exactly constitutes the “area surrounding the person he’s arresting”? If the person is arrested outside, does that mean that they can search the house he came out of? ---
**Author:** ![White\_Lightning](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@White\_Lightning](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/White_Lightning)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/30 "2003-03-08T04:04:06Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by_\* Lord Ashtar \*\*\* > All other things aside, did he really have to be such a condesending prick to people he wasn’t arresting? Not at all. I’m sure he was a gigantic asshole. There’s no law against that, though. And it didn’t violate any of your “constitutional rights,” which was the question my remark was in response to. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/31 "2003-03-08T05:50:14Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lord Ashtar \* > \*\*In answer to your questions, he was picked up in the backyard, where he ran when he saw the cops pull up in front of the house. I have no problem with them going back there to get him, as they did have a warrant for his arrest. > > They knocked on the front door and pushed right past my other brother, who answered the door. They did not have a search warrant for the house. \*\* Well, my understanding is that the cops have a legal right to search the house where they found your brother with the situation you described. The reason is simple, it’s called hot pursuit. If the cops were chasing your brother and he enters a house or could have possibly passed contraband into a house the cops have the right to enter the house. It’s called probable cause. While you are angry with the cops I think you are missing the point. If your brother is accused of doing something illegal and your brother is running from the cops I think your brother is the person you need to be pissed at. Cops do thier jobs. Sometimes they piss off regular peopele. Some times they are wrong. But, from what I have read, it sounds like your brother isn’t an innocent person. Slee ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/32 "2003-03-08T07:02:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by sleestak \* > \*\*Cops do thier jobs. Sometimes they piss off regular peopele. Some times they are wrong. But, from what I have read, it sounds like your brother isn’t an innocent person. > > Slee \*\* I don’t disagree with that, and I am quite pissed at my brother, believe me. I guess I just figure that since “police officer” is the guy’s chosen profession, then he shouldn’t be an asshole to me if he thinks his job sucks. Kind of like the customer service rep who hates his/her job and takes it out on the customer. Sure, you hate your job. I would hate it, too. That’s why I do something else for a living. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 7:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/33 "2003-03-08T07:03:15Z")
And yes, I do remember that I offered him a hearty “fuck you”. That came after he was an asshole, not before. ---
**Author:** ![Ferrous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Ferrous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferrous)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/34 "2003-03-08T07:41:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lord Ashtar \* > \*\*And yes, I do remember that I offered him a hearty “fuck you”. That came after he was an asshole, not before. \*\* Yeah, but it was still a really stupid thing to do. You do realize that, don’t you? ---
**Author:** ![lorinada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5e925/32.png) [@lorinada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorinada)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/35 "2003-03-09T06:36:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Meatros \* > \*\*I second this question. Does anyone know if they have to give out their badge number and name? I would assume they would have to. \*\* In all of our surrounding cities, the uniformed police officers wear clearly visible nametags and their numbered badges on their shirts. Any dealings I have ever had with the police, if the officer is a plainclothes detective, I or another family member has gotten a card with the detective’s name and badge number on it, or a police report with that identification. One time the officer answered a call I made and even though he was uniformed he also gave me card. I know this doesn’t answer your question. My point is that I have never, ever, even had to ask for a name and badge number, it has always been provided one way or another. I would think that would be SOP for any police force in any situation. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/36 "2003-03-09T07:08:07Z")
I’d say you were lucky to get off with a “You wanna try me?” from the officer concerned. It never ceases to amaze me that those who have the most whingey complaints about the coppers are those who are ‘guilty’ of giving them a hard time in the first place. I’m NOT condoning blatant police misbehaviour, but it very rarely happens that a citizen who has done _nothing_ wrong gets the short end of the baton from a walloper. Your brother was arrested on your property. You are at least implicated by association, so giving the cop a mouthful was ill-advised, not only from your perspective but from the angle of your brothers welfare as well. I suggest you drop your belligerence before you have dealings with the constabulary again…it doesn’t help anybody really. ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/37 "2003-03-09T07:50:56Z")
First of all COP stands for “ **C** onstable **O** n **P** atrol”…I know because my uncles ex-wife’s new husband’s mechanic used to be a COP(OK OK enough with that schtick) Did they _chase_ him there? If not they apparently _knew_ he was there… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/38 "2003-03-09T08:03:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ethilrist \* > \*\*… loitering? > > You’re going to sue a cop for loitering? \*\* No, the situation as described is trespassing. And if it happened in New York and the cop was carrying a gun, it’s a felony. sleestak [qoute]If the cops were chasing your brother and he enters a house or could have possibly passed contraband into a house the cops have the right to enter the house. It’s called probable cause. [/quote] How do you get from “possible” to “probable”? ---
**Author:** ![Tony\_Montana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/278dde/32.png) [@Tony\_Montana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tony_Montana)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/39 "2003-03-09T08:21:22Z")
[QUOTE] \*Originally posted by The Ryan \* \*\*No, the situation as described is trespassing. And if it happened in New York and the cop was carrying a gun, it’s a felony. [quote] I dont see that. The C.O.P.'s persued him _through_ the house, no? Or at least _one_ COP figured he entered the backdoor into the house… ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2003, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427/40 "2003-03-09T13:43:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lord Ashtar \* > \*\*In answer to your questions, he was picked up in the backyard, where he ran when he saw the cops pull up in front of the house. I have no problem with them going back there to get him, as they did have a warrant for his arrest. > > They knocked on the front door and pushed right past my other brother, who answered the door. They did not have a search warrant for the house. \*\* If he ran out of the house into the back yard, then a search incident to arrest would include the home. No additional warrant would be needed. **The Ryan** ’s ideas about trespass in that situation are, needless to say, ill-founded. If the police enter your property pursuant to an arrest warrant, there is no trespass. - Rick [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-my-brother-was-just-arrested-a-rant/159427.md?page=3)