# So, specifically directed toward Bernie supporters... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 24, 2016, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857 "2016-11-24T01:01:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/61 "2016-11-25T02:11:15Z")
In the words of a notorious philanderer (whose name I now forget) when asked about the size of something else: “I’m too busy using it to waste my time measuring it”. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/62 "2016-11-25T02:17:46Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I was replying specifically to your post (my bold): Yes, she lost the election because of the way the electoral college assigns electoral votes. > > BUT, replying to your specific point (which I have bolded), she DID have the political savvy to beat Trump and she did beat him: she got more votes. > > Because of the technicality of THE WAY PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS WORK, she did not, in fact, win the election or become president. But you cannot say that she didn’t beat Trump (well, you can until you’re blue in the face, but you would be wrong). She got more votes. More people voted for her than for him. When the votes are counted, she will have more votes. Try to grasp that. > > Yes. Granted. That’s not the way elections work, because of the electoral college. > > BUT SHE DID WIN THE ELECTION BASED ON NUMBER OF VOTES. Therefore, she DID BEAT TRUMP. > > Her voter base did not melt down, because she got more votes. She lost the election in spite of GETTING MORE VOTES. > > Look at these FACTS any which way you can, and maybe they’ll sink in. > > Clinton. Got. More. Votes. Almost TWO MILLION more than Trump. She. Beat. Him. > > She did not win the election, true, but not because she didn’t get more votes. She DID get more votes. > > I think I’ve covered it. Yes, I’m sure that will be a great consolation for Hillary and all her supporters as they watch Trump take over the White House. Just keep telling yourself ‘we won, we won’, it’s bound to ease the pain. You have an odd conception of victory. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/63 "2016-11-25T02:48:51Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I made my point. Keep arguing among yourselves. She’s trolling, but since it’s from a left wing POV, it won’t be moderated. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/64 "2016-11-25T03:05:01Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > She’s trolling, but since it’s from a left wing POV, it won’t be moderated. That doesn’t explain how you get away with it. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/65 "2016-11-25T03:11:27Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > I made my point. Keep arguing among yourselves. Your point being that you don’t understand the process of how an election for president works? Good company as Hillary doesn’t seem to know as well given that she lostl. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/66 "2016-11-25T03:37:11Z")
If being obviously wrong about something and refusing to admit it (or resorting to some hairsplitting tactic and holding firmly to it) is trolling, ban the entire membership of this board. ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/67 "2016-11-25T03:48:18Z")
There are pretty clear rules on what constitutes winning the presidential election. Claiming a win using non-relevant factors doesn’t get your candidate into the white house. Sent from my SM-N910U using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/68 "2016-11-25T04:36:15Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Claiming that voting for someone else ‘as a protest’ because you live in another state is ignorant, wrongheaded, and utterly futile. I know, big words, try using a dictionary. > > I have a 165 IQ and far more education than even most people here on the board can claim. > > Finally, all you’ve done is troll, adding nothing substantive whatsoever. So fuck off, lugnut. I think he lives in another country. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/69 "2016-11-25T04:57:22Z")
> [@ThelmaLou](#): > > She did\*\* beat\*\* him–she got more votes. She did not win the election, but she **beat** Trump by getting more votes. Two million more people voted for her than for Trump. The public chose her over Trump. > > Notwithstanding that the rules of the game dictated that she did not win the Presidency. > > I wasn’t talking about whether she won the election. I know she didn’t. I was talking about the fact that she did **beat** Trump by two million votes. My bolding. I don’t think the word “beat” means what you think it means. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2016, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/70 "2016-11-25T07:37:30Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Sounds like a bit of projection there, chum. I didn’t assign blame, nor did I claim anything about those Bernie voters swinging the election. > > So maybe the STFU should be yours, ‘cause you’re never going to have any effect on what I say. However, _where_ I say it may be affected. Posts in the Pit are a gigantic waste of time, just a place for trolls to measure their e-peens. I think I’ll stick to posting in others’ threads, in sections where there’s actually some mature discussion. …calm the fuck down dude. JOHNNY ACE: Are all you Bernie supporters who didn’t vote for Hillary happy? MHENDO: All of the Bernie supporters I know voted Hillary. Can you show some examples that demontrate otherwise? JOHNNY ACE: BOO! HISS! ROAR! I think that some Bernie voters didn’t vote Hillary. Shayna on these boards is an obvious example. But I don’t think that it was wide-spread as you might think. The problem was the “depressed Bernie voter”, as described in Michael Moore’s July article where he predicted Trumps win: > [@](#): > > Stop fretting about Bernie’s supporters not voting for Clinton – we’re voting for Clinton! The polls already show that more Sanders voters will vote for Hillary this year than the number of Hillary primary voters in ’08 who then voted for Obama. This is not the problem. The fire alarm that should be going off is that while the average Bernie backer will drag him/herself to the polls that day to somewhat reluctantly vote for Hillary, it will be what’s called a “depressed vote” – meaning the voter doesn’t bring five people to vote with her. He doesn’t volunteer 10 hours in the month leading up to the election. She never talks in an excited voice when asked why she’s voting for Hillary. A depressed voter. [http://michaelmoore.com/trumpwillwin/](http://michaelmoore.com/trumpwillwin/) If this were a rant against the people who are claiming that Bernie would have beaten Trump I’d be behind it 100%. (I don’t think he would have.) Bernie supporters didn’t win nor loose this election. Neither did Hillary supporters. I don’t always agree with Moore: but I think he nailed the reasons why he predicted a Trump win quite accurately. The signs were all there beforehand. But as it is your rant is kinda weak. And your rant against mhendo was uncalled for. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2016, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/71 "2016-11-29T20:30:01Z")
Is it too late to say, “Ha Ha! You losers lost!” It is? Ok. Check ya later losers. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2016, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/72 "2016-11-29T21:53:03Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > It was whites with a high school education who did this. Blame them. They are the ones that turned the northern midwest red. A vulgar con man offered them easy answers and dog whistles and they ate it up. Blame them for this mess. Blame the ones in PA, MI and WI for this mess, Hillary would’ve won with those 3 states. That’s total garbage. It’s quite understandable that the less educated were taken in by a con man. Instead the problem is that white college graduates preferred Trump over Hillary by 4%: > **[Behind Trump’s victory: Divisions by race, gender, education](https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2016/11/09/behind-trumps-victory-divisions-by-race-gender-education/)** > > Donald Trump's win followed a campaign that revealed deep divisions that were as wide and in some cases wider than in previous elections. Think about what this means. When the “best and the brightest” prefer gutting environmental/safety/consumer/labor protections, tax cuts for the rich, foreign policy craziness… ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2016, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/73 "2016-11-29T21:58:12Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > Is it too late to say, “Ha Ha! You losers lost!” > > It is? Ok. Check ya later losers. Check back with us in about a year, after YOUR boy Trump has started really fucking you. No health care, no Medicare, no unemployment, etc etc etc ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2016, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/74 "2016-11-29T23:16:19Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Check back with us in about a year, after YOUR boy Trump has started really fucking you. No health care, no Medicare, no unemployment, etc etc etc At that point, they’ll blame it on Obama. Or the evil media. Or they just won’t believe the factual evidence in front of them. Any way you cut it, no Trump voter will admit they fucked up, no matter what kind of shit show we’re in for in the next few years. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2016, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/75 "2016-11-29T23:35:38Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > I literally do not know a single Bernie supporter, among the dozens that i know, who stayed home or voted third party as some sort of protest or statement of principle. That includes my wife, and would have included me also, if i were an American citizen and eligible to vote. I know several, flesh and blood, IRL people who would not vote for Hillary, and instead sat out or went to Jill whatever her name is. My anecdote wins! A little more seriously though, yeah, the tide did turn once Bernie lost. Before California, something like 80% of Bernie supporters polled said they’d back Hillary. By the convention (despite sensationalist news coverage), that number was sitting at 90. I’m sure the needle moved even more as time passed, but I stopped paying attention those particular polls after that. But anyway… wake me up in 2020. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2016, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/76 "2016-11-30T13:34:07Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The message being that they should be ignored. And that they destroy their own cause. Continue to ignore them and you will continue to lose elections. The Democratic party has moved too far right on issues related to corporatism and multi-nationalism. You can safely ignore the keystone pipeline crowd, they are irrational and stupid, and appeasing them costs you a lot of net votes. You can safely ignore the gun control crowd, they are irrational and stupid and appeasing them costs you a lot of net votes. You can safely ignore the anti-GMO crowd, they are irrational and stupid and they cost you a few net votes. You can safely ignore the anti-vaccination crowd, they are irrational and stupid. You CANNOT ignore the votes of people who have been displaced by foreign trade when their numbers have reached the millions. You CANNOT safely ignore the votes of people who are disgusted at the fact that now BOTH parties are in the pocket of big business. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/77 "2016-11-30T13:39:11Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’m a Sanders supporter. During the primaries, I thought he was the best option available, and so I voted for him. Once the primaries were over, he was no longer the best option available, because he wasn’t available any more. At that time, Clinton became the best option available, and so I voted for her, too. > > Now, there are certainly some Sanders supporters who will loudly proclaim that this wouldn’t have happened if we had nominated him (I’m not among this group; this election has been weird enough that I honestly have no clue what would have happened). But that’s still not inconsistent with them having voted for Clinton. I also voted for Bernie in the primary and Hillary in the general. I AM, however, in the camp that says Bernie would have been a better candidate. He certainly wouldn’t have been any worse. This is no one fault but Hillary. If you lose to Donald fucking Trump, you have no one to blame but yourself and if you supported her and blame anyone but her for her failure, then you are being deliberately blind to her faults. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2016, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/78 "2016-11-30T13:50:33Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I also voted for Bernie in the primary and Hillary in the general. I AM, however, in the camp that says Bernie would have been a better candidate. He certainly wouldn’t have been any worse. > > This is no one fault but Hillary. If you lose to Donald fucking Trump, you have no one to blame but yourself and if you supported her and blame anyone but her for her failure, then you are being deliberately blind to her faults. It’s reasonable to blame her, but it’s also reasonable to blame those that voted for Trump. Support for and tolerance of bigotry isn’t okay, and it’s reasonable to put those things into the basket of things to blame (along with Hillary and her campaign) for her loss. It wasn’t just one factor – there were many things that went wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2016, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/79 "2016-11-30T13:53:15Z")
> [@Johnny\_Ace](#): > > Claiming that voting for someone else ‘as a protest’ because you live in another state is ignorant, wrongheaded, and utterly futile. I know, big words, try using a dictionary. > > I have a 165 IQ and far more education than even most people here on the board can claim. > > Finally, all you’ve done is troll, adding nothing substantive whatsoever. So fuck off, lugnut. LOL ROFLMAO OMG I’m embarrassed for you. Citing your purported IQ? ROFLMAO. A masters degree would probably put you ahead of the curve on this board but that doesn’t mean you’re not stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2016, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857/80 "2016-11-30T14:13:28Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Nope, it’s the fault of the voters who supported Donald Trump. I don’t care how much you disagree with Clinton: there is simply no way that a reasonably rational informed voter could imagine that Trump would be a better president than Clinton would. You mean there is no way that someone who has had his job shipped overseas because of free trade deals, his home repossessed by the banks that pay huge speaking fees to Hillary for secret speeches, his confidence in the Democratic primary process undermined by Debbie Wasserman Schultz and Donna Brazile, could think that the woman whose primary political achievement was marrying Bill Clinton wouldn’t make a better president than the brazen liar and reality TV star who says that the trade deals are unfair, that financed his own primary and who bucked the odds to defeat the Republican political establishment? No doubt Hillary is hard working, competent and intelligent. Those adjectives describe the highest non-political employees at just about every federal agency. The DC area is literally awash in competent people being bossed around by political people. No doubt, Trump is a charlatan and huckster. But noonoe is blind to that. What does it say about Hillary that people were desperate enough to pick him over the alternative? There is a solid core of maybe 40% of the electorate that was going to vote for whoever had the R next to their name but a lot of people who voted for a black dude with a funny name TWICE just couldn’t pick Hillary over a guy who is so thoroughly dishonest that no one is surprised that he is walking back most of the shit he said on the campaign trail. > [@](#): > > 😕 You are raving. Clinton, whatever one thinks of her candidacy and her brand of insider politics (and she wasn’t my first choice in the primary either), is indisputably extremely well qualified to be president in terms of experience, political savvy, policy sense, and principles (for a politician, at least). Political savvy? No. Her political skills suck. She has never won an election where the skids weren’t greased for her. > [@](#): > > No apology forthcoming. I can’t believe that you are seriously trying to persuade us that because a candidate who was in many ways mediocre but fundamentally thoroughly competent and professional happened to lose the Electoral College (despite a substantial popular vote victory) to a lying egomaniacal huckster with a voter base melting down from demographic/economic angst, it’s the **competent** candidate who should be apologizing. No way; fuck that noise. She should apologize for sucking so bad. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-specifically-directed-toward-bernie-supporters/772857.md?page=5)