# So Star Trek "Enterprise Sucks." Could you do better?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [September 6, 2003, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881 "2003-09-06T03:38:03Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/1 "2003-09-06T03:38:03Z")
The Board seems to have lots of Trekkies/Trekkers, many of them very displeased with various incarnations of Star Trek, be it TOS, TNG, DSN, STV, the half dozen or so motion pictures and, most recently, “Enterprise.”
“Enterprise” especially seems to engender hatred by Board members, which makes me put across this challenge:
Given what you know, love, and respect about the Star Trek series/canon/yadda yadda, do you think that, if Hollywood contacted you, that you could either pen a better series or develop more interesting, fleshed-out characters that wouldn’t make other Trekkers gag?
What talent could you bring to the table? What could you teach the Bermans of the cosmos about writing a crackling good series?
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### Author:  [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/2 "2003-09-06T03:40:14Z")
Needs more panda.
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### Author:  [@bernse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bernse)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/3 "2003-09-06T04:19:53Z")
Actually, I like _Enterprise_.
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### Author:  [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/4 "2003-09-06T04:42:07Z")
My idea when Voyager was finishing up was this. It’s outdated now, but I liked it at the time, and I think it would’ve been great.
> [@](#):
>
> Establish who are all the most popular characters in the otehr series, and cut away those who aren’t likely to want to return to play them again.
>
> So you might get, from Voyager, the Doc, Chakotay, and Seven. From DS:9 maybe Jadzia Dax (I know, but I liked her, and in Trek you can bring back the dead) and Odo and okay, maybe Kira (though I never liked her much). And in TNG you could have Tom Riker, Barclay, ummmm whoever. I dunno, they’re all getting old now. And of course a bunch of new folks.
>
> Here’s the premise.
>
> Voyager returns to the whatever-it-is Quadrant to discover that the Federation is in tatters. There has been a fullscale pangalactic war, and the whole galaxy is in chaos. Everyone, including the standard bad guys like The Dominion, the Romulans, the Klingons, everybody, are all in terrible states of devastation.
>
> And it’s the job of the ragtag Federation survivors to:
>
> - (first season) piece together what happened, and who is responsible.
> - (second season) gather resources, allies, etc to establish a stronghold
> - (third season) make their first vollies, attacks, sorties, to test the waters and learn more about their foe.
>
> Etc etc etc
>
> All through the series of course there are the usual sideline, non-story-arc tales. But what is cool is that there’d be a lot more danger. Nobody would know who was trustworthy and who wasn’t, and there’d be a ton of tension between characters always. Characters could die at any time, absolutely at any time at all. Lots of action (which the trekkers love and want more of) plus room for more character-based tales, and still space for SF allegories etc.
>
> This is the kind of pull-out-all-the-stops action packed fun blockbuster series Trek needs to really define itself again, imho.
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### Author:  [@minty\_green](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minty_green)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/5 "2003-09-06T04:53:04Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Carnac the Magnificent! \*
> What could you teach the Bermans of the cosmos about writing a crackling good series?
One word: Continuity.
That, plus the immediate destruction of all existing copies of that godawful “Enterprise” theme song. I love Trek, but I have not been able to make myself watch a single episode of Enterprise since I heard that damn song. It’s like a jewelry box smeared in feces–there might be a diamond inside the box, but I can’t even contemplate the notion of opening it up.
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### Author:  [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/6 "2003-09-06T05:05:58Z")
Minty, it can be worse. I was in a store where they were not only playing the theme from Enterprise, it was ROD-FUCKING-STEWART singing the theme from Enterprise.
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### Author:  [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/7 "2003-09-06T05:07:19Z")
By the way, if that ship blasted a trough a click deep through Florida, why didn’t it fill with water?
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### Author:  [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/8 "2003-09-06T05:17:16Z")
I kind of like Enterprise when the scripts give them some real meaty problems to solve like how to restrain a sweaty, large breasted, pointy eared Vulcan in heat. The problem is that, unlike previous Enterprise shows, about once every third show the writing gets lazy and falls back the tired premise of some member of the crew (usually the Captain) doing something completely and utterly retarded that digs hole they then have to climb out of.
Previous Enterprise show scripts may have been unoriginal and formulaic, but they didn’t require that the officer staff have room temperature IQ’s and the emotional self control of 13 year olds.
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### Author:  [@Silentgoldfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silentgoldfish)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/9 "2003-09-06T05:41:22Z")
I would replace the writers. And I would fire whoever decided that the only thing the series needed was more women in spandex uniforms – it’s stupid, pandering, and drives more people away than it attracts.
Also, I would figure out a way of hiring someone that would look back over past episodes and veto new scripts that were too much like them.
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### Author:  [@DreadCthulhu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DreadCthulhu)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/10 "2003-09-06T06:24:28Z")
Well, I think more 1920’s style “Death Rays” would make things much more interesting.
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/11 "2003-09-06T06:24:58Z")
Indeed, I’d get some new writers. Ones who’d take some more “risks” with stories.
And, to keep fans happy, I’d probably find some way of saying, offically, that _Enterprise_ is taking place in an altered timeline. Even if that means writing the series finale so that the “temporal cold war” is resolved by erasing the NX-01 from history, and resetting the timeline back to the TOS-TNG original.
For that matter, there would be a ban on any “time travel” episodes being filmed more than once per season.
I’d make Trip gay. Yeah, the Southern engineer. Like I’m the only one who sees it.
No more “reptilian” aliens, unless they have a full snout. Instead of “generic bumpy head” aliens, I’d either have ones that looked completely human, or that were played by actors with an “unpleasant to look at” physical condition.
I wouldn’t add photon torpedos to the Enterprise’s arsenal, like they’re going to do in the upcoming season…I’d give them nukes. Big, dirty, nukes. Like in “Balance of Terror.”
Add more “cerebral” storylines, but ones that didn’t rely on incomprehensible technobabble. I’d balance these with episodes where they send down companies of Starfleet Marines to “resolve” diplomatic or cultural disputes.
Write episodes that deal with some major social-issue or another…but don’t present any sort of snappy “solution” to said problem.
To hell with “Will they or Won’t They?” sexual tension subplots that stretch the length of the series but never get acted upon or resolved…I’d have Archer and T’Pol have a full, torrid affair.
Come to think of it, I’d probably have T’Pol decide to reject logic about a season and a half before the series ends…and stick with it through the finale. Just to see if I _could_ do that with a main character. I’d have the storyline lead up to that happening for about a season beforehand, of course, so it wouldn’t seem like it was something written up overnight.
OK, maybe it wouldn’t be _better_…but it’d be a lot more fun.
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### Author:  [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/12 "2003-09-06T07:04:03Z")
I like _Enterprise_ so far. However, I am willing to admit that even things I like could probably be made better, so here goes.
I don’t see continuity as a huge problem. I do really enjoy keeping track of minor details and looking for contradictions, but for fun, not because I think they ruin the show. And medium-sized issues don’t bother me, especially if they acknowledge that’s what they’re doing (eg. Klingon makeup); at least we know it’s not due to oversight.
I agree that some of the plotlines could use improvement. But I don’t think it’s as simple as firing the writers and hoping you can find better ones. There are a lot of restrictions, like expense. Action scenes (including space battles) are expensive. Exotic locations are expensive. Sets you can’t reuse are expensive. New aliens that require a heck of a lot of makeup are expensive. They tend to save these things for the season finale/premiere or movies, which is fine by me. I would have a space battle or firefight no more than two or three times a season, because they can’t do them that well anyway; spend that money on the writing.
Here are some kinds of episodes I think they should have more of:[ul][li]Political storylines (eg. “Cease Fire”). DS9 had some good ones, and I think they have enough going in _Enterprise_, for instance with the Andorians, to pull this off.[_]Mini-mysteries (eg. “Terra Nova”, although this particular episode is just okay). These are fun! And they’d make great two-parters.[_]Adventures (eg. “Precious Cargo”). Chase and rescue stories make a pretty solid plot; the challenge is making each adventure new and unique.[/ul]Here are some I think they should have less of:[ul][_]Character development (“Fight or Flight”). Development is important, but I think it works better as the “B” plot. Episodes primarily focused on one or two characters don’t work so well, IMHO.[_]Anything in which the solution to the conflict is flying really fast or shooting a lot (“Singularity”). Not every episode has to be terribly cerebral, but they can do better than this.[/li][/ul]And here are the ones in between:[ul][_]Social or philosophical points (“Cogenitor”). They’re hard to do, because it seems that if people disagree with you, they won’t like it. So they’re good, but they should be used with care.[_]Clever original ideas (“Carbon Creek”). Good, but it must be hard to do on demand.Humor episodes (“Unexpected”). These make good fillers, but I’d hate to see them overused.[/ul]I don’t think “risks”, like killing off characters, would necessarily be any good. Although I do like drama, that’s not what _Star Trek_ is primarily about; it’s about exploration and adventure.
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### Author:  [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/13 "2003-09-06T12:26:50Z")
Here’s my two cents…
I saw a couple episodes of SNG last night. One was decent, the other stale and trite. After a few dozen episodes, it’s amazing how one-dimensional the characters really are. Heck, even 10-Forward is boring. I’ll also admit that some of my fellow SD posters ruined “Enterprise” for me, by saying it wasn’t worth viewing. Of course, it really may be as bad as some say…
I know TOS looks dated, but some of those episodes are real pearls.
But getting back to my OP, no, I don’t think I could do better. Writing scripts for Star Trek strikes me as a no win situation.
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### Author:  [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/14 "2003-09-06T15:34:11Z")
Some _Enterprise_ eps received good reviews in our threads.
Some didn’t.
:dubious:
For ideas on how to make it better, read the 3127 or so threads we’ve started about different ways to make it better. Lots of jokes, sure, but a ton of very good ideas, too.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/15 "2003-09-06T17:56:27Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Ranchoth \*
> \*\*_Enterprise_ is taking place in an altered timeline.
> \*\*
Too late. There was a USS Archer in Nemesis.
I second the time travel ban, BTW.
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### Author:  [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/16 "2003-09-06T18:37:27Z")
**Enterprise** is, in fact, my favorite version to date. **TOS** was mainly an adventure series; **TNG** and **Voyager** had too much allegory for my taste, and I never warmed up to **DS9**. **Enterprise** (as of the first two seasons) is primarily about making hard decisions without much in the way of experience as a guide. Plus, the steambath scenes rock!
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/17 "2003-09-06T18:40:57Z")
I’d have remade _The Forbidden PLanet_ as the _Enterprise_ pilot.
[http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0049223/](http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0049223/)
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### Author:  [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)
#### Post date: [September 6, 2003, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/18 "2003-09-06T19:19:42Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Krokodil \*
> \*\*
> Plus, the steambath scenes rock! \*\*
Decon.
Panda.
😃
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### Author:  [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2003, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/19 "2003-09-07T00:42:24Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by NoClueBoy \*
> For ideas on how to make it better, read the 3127 or so threads we’ve started about different ways to make it better. Lots of jokes, sure, but a ton of very good ideas, too.
And here they are:
[ul][_][Ideas for enterprise](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=168165), April 2003. This one only got eight replies. It’s basically “More ships, and start building the Federation.” They did say that the NX-02 would be ready in 12 months, in the season 2 finale, so maybe we’ll see this by season 4 or 5. That would be cool, but I also like that the Enterprise is all they’ve got for now.[_][Save Enterprise with your ideas for shows](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=147623), December 2002. A couple of people said war and battles. I said earlier (in this thread) that I wish they would save the money they’d need for that and spend it on writing, but maybe it could work. I dunno. There was actually one serious episode proposal more than a couple of lines, written by **kingpengvin**. Of course, it involves starting a war, and having another human ship. :)[_][The Enterprise Speculation And/Or Wish List Thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=116972), May 2002. This one actually didn’t have any fleshed-out ideas. Some of the one-liners in here are creative, but I think it would take a lot of work to complete them.[_][Write your own Enterprise episode](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=145476), November 2002. Okay, so this thread isn’t serious at all. But it’s people talking about writing for _Enterprise_.[/ul]
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### Author:  [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)
#### Post date: [September 7, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-star-trek-enterprise-sucks-could-you-do-better/199881/20 "2003-09-07T02:06:59Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by NoClueBoy \*
> \*\*Decon.
>
> Panda.
>
> 😃 \*\*
Oh, then it’s not prurient in the least. Damn!
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