# So Sue Us!( Not happy we shot up your wedding party? Tell it to the judge...) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 20, 2004, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124 "2004-05-20T05:10:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![pervert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bbe5ce/32.png) [@pervert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pervert)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/101 "2004-05-21T06:25:01Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I’m curious about this issue (not being snarky, I mean it). By what right did the US free Kuwait from Iraq? What gives the United States “Right of Conquest,” but not Iraq, or for that matter, Germany or Japan? I could be wrong, but I think you are misunderstanding the term. the “Right of Conquest” is not a right to go out and conquest, it is more along the lines of a “reality of conquest”. So the US did not have the power to invade Kuwait because of the Right of Conquest. However, we did have the power to turn Kuwait back over to its previous regime because of the “Right of Conquest”. I hope I have not misrememberd that. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/102 "2004-05-21T06:29:21Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Nice link. Did you bother reading all of it? > > Because, if you had, you would have seen that keeping women and children in a safe house for foreign fighters is prohibited by those same laws of war. > > Again, like I said, I’m reserving judgement. But if terrorists were keeping women and children in the safe house with them, it’s a clear violation of the rules of war. And it is the terrorists who put the noncombatants at risk. Yes I did read it thanks. So you think it fine to kill human shields? Typical. Whatever happens ‘it’s not our fault’! And you wonder why we’re not winning hearts and minds. Anyway ‘people living in same village as safe house’ does not equal ‘human shields’. ---
**Author:** ![Declan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecae2f/32.png) [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/103 "2004-05-21T08:05:47Z")
> [@Zagadka](#): > > I’m curious about this issue (not being snarky, I mean it). By what right did the US free Kuwait from Iraq? What gives the United States “Right of Conquest,” but not Iraq, or for that matter, Germany or Japan? Kuwait was freed under the auspices of the United Nations , Iraqi forces were retired across the border and kuwait was returned to its rightful government. At no time did the States actively rule either kuwait or Iraq. Right of conquest is pretty much a bad terminology , better off just saying right of might and be done with it. Once you depose a foreign government , you need something to keep the infrastructure going , pay the bills , get the mail delivered and so forth. Since the Iraqi government surrendered to the US , it becomes the defacto government , until such time as the reins of power are returned to the indigs. For the time being , Iraq is an american protectorate , no different from American Samoa , or Peuto Rico. Declan ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/104 "2004-05-21T09:49:27Z")
British newspaper coverage. I’m sorry but this looks like another awful, awful tragedy, if that’s the right word. [‘US soldiers started to shoot us, one by one’](http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1221658,00.html) > [@](#): > > The celebration at Mukaradeeb was to be one of the biggest events of the year for a small village of just 25 houses. Haji Rakat, the father, had finally arranged a long-negotiated tribal union that would bring together two halves of one large extended family, the Rakats and the Sabahs. > [@](#): > > The wedding feast was finished and the women had just led the young bride and groom away to their marriage tent for the night when Haleema Shihab heard the first sounds of the fighter jets screeching through the sky above. > [@](#): > > “We went out of the house and the American soldiers started to shoot us. They were shooting low on the ground and targeting us one by one,” > [@](#): > > Mrs Shibab’s description, backed by other witnesses, of an attack on a sleeping village is at odds with the American claim that they came under fire while targeting a suspected foreign fighter safe house. > > … > > As Mrs Shihab spoke she gestured with hands still daubed red-brown with the henna the women had used to decorate themselves for the wedding. Alongside her in the ward yesterday were three badly injured girls from the Rakat family: Khalood Mohammed, aged just a year and struggling for breath, Moaza Rakat, 12, and Iqbal Rakat, 15, whose right foot doctors had already amputated. > > … > > Among the dead were 27 members of the extended Rakat family, their wedding guests and even the band of musicians hired to play at the ceremony, among them Hussein al-Ali from Ramadi, one of the most popular singers in western Iraq. > … > > Dr Alusi said 11 of the dead were women and 14 were children. “I want to know why the Americans targeted this small village,” he said by telephone. “These people are my patients. I know each one of them. What has caused this disaster?” [One incident. Forty dead. Two stories. What really happened?](http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=523356) > [@](#): > > A tiny bundle of blankets is unwrapped; inside is the body of a baby, its limbs smeared with dried blood. Then the mourners peel back the blanket further to reveal a second dead baby. > > Another blanket is opened; inside are the bodies of a mother and child. The child, six or seven years old, is lying against his or her mother, as if seeking comfort. But the child has no head. > > … > > US forces insist that the attack was on a safe house used by foreign fighters entering Iraq from Syria. They do not dispute that they killed about 40 people, but claim American forces were returning fire and the dead were all foreign fighters. For the video footage that shows dead women and children they have no explanation. > > … > > US forces say they have been watching the border area where the attack took place for some time. They saw a large group of suspicious people moving in the area and sent in ground forces, who came under fire, so the US forces returned fire. > > … > > They are sticking doggedly to this version of events despite growing evidence that a wedding party was hit. More and more eyewitnesses are coming forward. Hussein Ali, a well-known wedding singer, was buried in Baghdad yesterday, alongside his brother Mohammed. Their family said they had been performing at the wedding. > > … > The evidence that the US military has put forward to support its version of events has been seriously undermined. Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt said guns, Syrian passports and a satellite phone had been recovered. But Sheikh Nasrallah Miklif, the head of the Bani Fahd tribe to which most of the dead belonged, said that was to be expected, given that the air strike happened in Makradheeb, a village in the desert, about 10 miles from the Syrian border. > . [As villagers bury their dead, US general insists that group was not wedding party](http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,7374-1118062,00.html) > [@](#): > > Sheikh Naser Alla Miklif, the influential chief of the 100,000-strong al-Bufahed tribe which includes the dead villagers, said yesterday that American helicopters were seen hovering near Maker al-Theeb on Tuesday afternoon as guests gathered to celebrate the wedding. > > He said that the helicopters disappeared and celebrations including music and dancing continued throughout the evening. Shortly before 3am on Wednesday, as the revellers slept, jets and helicopters attacked the village. He said that the strikes continued until American soldiers and armoured vehicles arrived in daylight to search the wreckage. > > “The father of the groom was Rikaad Obeid Hassan,” said Sheikh Miklif, who spoke to survivors and relatives at the victims’ funeral in Ramadi, provincial capital of the restive al-Anbar province. “He is an old, sick man and had left for a neighbouring village at the end of the evening. > > “When he returned in the morning he found that 25 members of the 28 in his family were dead. He collapsed and is now in hospital too.” ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/105 "2004-05-21T09:49:46Z")
This brings together the questions and confusion about this incident quite well. [One incident. Forty dead. Two stories. What really happened?](http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=523356) > [@](#): > > Sheikh Mikfil said he suspected the Americans might have been acting on false intelligence information, given by someone who wanted to increase the tension between Iraqis and Americans. > > It is impossible to reconcile the American and Iraqi versions of events. But with more and more evidence emerging that casts doubt on the American version, and Iraqi anger rising, US forces need to come up with some answers. If this was one of the “bad things” that “happen in wars” - to use General Mattis’s phrase - more explanation is required. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 10:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/106 "2004-05-21T10:20:02Z")
The US really needs to start giving proof of their story. > **['US soldiers started to shoot us, one by one'](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/may/21/iraq.rorymccarthy)** > > Survivors describe wedding massacre as generals refuse to apologise. > [@](#): > > “I fell into the mud and an American soldier came and kicked me. I pretended to be dead so he wouldn’t kill me. My youngest child was alive next to me.” > > Mrs Shibab’s description, backed by other witnesses, of an attack on a sleeping village is at odds with the American claim that they came under fire while targeting a suspected foreign fighter safe house. > > She described how in the hours before dawn she watched as American troops destroyed the Rakat villa and the house next door, reducing the buildings to rubble. ---
**Author:** ![Estilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Estilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Estilicon)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/107 "2004-05-21T11:16:13Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > [/list] > This is idiotic. > > What is the basis for your assertion that the terrorists (I thought they were just innocent wedding guests, but never mind) should get all the benefits of the Geneva Convention without incurring any of the obligations? > > Suppose they put a line of children in the front of their army and re-invaded Kuwait. Would you argue that the rest of the world should surrender because they cannot fire on civilians? > > Regards, > Shodan First of all I don’t know if they were wedding guest or terrorist. Many dopers claimed they were terrorist, if that is the case… Your example is idiotic, terrorists don’t have armies in the first place. Then you seem to think that terrorist=Irak’s army. To make a long post short there are so many things wrong with your example that I will wait for you to provide a better one. Then I’ll discuss my POV. regards Estilicon ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/108 "2004-05-21T12:57:51Z")
[QUOTE=tagos] British newspaper coverage. I’m sorry but this looks like another awful, awful tragedy, if that’s the right word. [QUOTE] I believe the correct word is “atrocity” It is so much worse than even the most vile conjecture… I always at least thought it was death from above. I never thought they came through on foot to finish them off… [U ---
**Author:** ![Master\_Wang-Ka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/master_wang-ka/32/3325_2.png) [@Master\_Wang-Ka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Master_Wang-Ka)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/109 "2004-05-21T13:26:31Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#): > > Resolved: The United States should waive sovereign immunity for tort claims arising from its military actions,and open the courts of the united states to litigation on behalf of iraqi citizens -with claims. > > Any other way of dealing with “collateral damage” leaves the malfeasor judging his own restitution > > Whatever the costs such an approach is the only way to demonstrate a sincere desire to compensate for the damage created by our behavior. Anything else is hypocrisy, and quickly branded such by world opinion. Why not? It’ll give Bush a whole new thing to lie to Congress about the projected costs of… ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2004, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/110 "2004-05-21T14:11:01Z")
[QUOTE=alaricthegoth] [QUOTE=tagos] British newspaper coverage. I’m sorry but this looks like another awful, awful tragedy, if that’s the right word. > [@](#): > > I believe the correct word is > > “atrocity” > > It is so much worse than even the most vile conjecture… > > I always at least thought it was death from above. > > I never thought they came through on foot to finish them off… > > [U I know what you mean. It’s like there’s some unit somwhere, deep in the Pentagon, thinking, “What more can we do to make things worse than they are already? Hey, we haven’t bombed a wedding on some half-assed excuse for a few months!” I start to wonder if the Occupation forces are being played for chumps by the ‘informers’ of various parties. This is a tribe of 100,000 - as noted in earlier cites. Great! that’s another 100,000 enemies. And I’m sorry, if ‘rules of engagement’ allow this sort of shit to happen, it’s not an excuse. Get better damn rules already! Better to let hundreds of terrorists live to be whacked another day than have this shit happen, morally and practically. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2004, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/111 "2004-05-22T23:08:48Z")
Well, just saw this snippet on [CNN](http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/22/iraq.main/index.html) . Its mostly about the present raid (or attack) against al-Sadr’s militia in Kufa, but it goes into a bit about the ‘wedding party’. The military is sticking to this story, and supposedly producing evidence that it wasn’t in fact a wedding party at all. No idea whats going on, who is lieing here, but thought I’d put in some of the story anyway. > [@CNN](#): > > Senior coalition military spokesman said that dozens of people killed in a U.S. attack in the Iraqi desert early Wednesday were attending a high-level meeting of foreign fighters, not a wedding. Photos shown to reporters in Baghdad support that contention. > > Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt said six women were among the dead, but he said there is no evidence any children died in the raid near the Syrian border. Coalition officials have said as many as 40 people were killed. > > Kimmitt said that video showing dead children killed was actually recorded in Ramadi, far from the attack scene. > > … > > Kimmitt said troops did not find anything – such as a wedding tent, gifts, musical instruments, decorations or leftover food – that would indicate a wedding had been held. > > Most of the men there were of military age, and there were no elders present to indicate a family event, he said. > > What was found, he said, indicated the building was used as a way station for foreign fighters crossing into Iraq from Syria to battle the coalition. > > “The building seemed to be somewhat of a dormitory,” Kimmitt said. "You had over 300 sets of bedding gear in it. You had a tremendous number of pre-packaged clothing – apparently about a hundred sets of pre-packaged clothing. Anyway, as I said before, there is a lot going on here. Its still unclear exactly what happened. However, I can’t see the military being this stuborn if they didn’t think they had a pretty good case for it NOT being a wedding. On the other hand, we have several Iraqis pretty much stating that it WAS a wedding. So. I’m going to await developments here. -XT ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/112 "2004-05-23T00:27:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Kimmitt said that video showing dead children killed was actually recorded in Ramadi, far from the attack scene. :dubious: Wait a tick, there was a horrible massacre, at the same time? I mean, shooting in the air was the original reason to attack; this is then beginning to sound to me as complete nonsense, if that was a terrorist place and not a wedding. Why would terrorists then broadcast with shots to the air that they where there? If the children’s deaths occurred elsewhere I only see that happening with lots of firepower in the area where that occurred, was that totally invisible to the U.S. forces? ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/113 "2004-05-23T00:41:48Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > :dubious: > Wait a tick, there was a horrible massacre, at the same time? Maybe it was a massacre at a different time. They apparently come a dime a dozen in Iraq these days. Also, the shredded body of a child need not necessarily be due to American firepower. Roadside bombs and mortar shells fired by insurgents have been known to cause their fair share of civilian casualties. This is why [www.iraqbodycount.org](http://www.iraqbodycount.org) and other “official” estimates put the “death toll” at 10,000 - not “civilian death toll,” not “Iraqis killed by Americans” - just “death toll.” It is sometimes impossible to tell who killed who, and when someone was or was not an insurgent. They just know how many bodies pile up at the makeshift Iraqi hospitals. Sometimes they can attribute who did what, sometimes they can’t. But the generally accepted figure is non-official military deaths that were caused by the US invasion, no matter who pulled the trigger. After all, if they drag pretty much any injured Iraqi man in, how can they tell whether or not he was an insurgent other than the words of people around him? Hell, women can most certainly be insurgents, and can certainly aid them, and so can children (there are numbers of reports of children as young as 10 firing weapons at US troops - and this is not isolated to Iraq, in parts of Africa, the adult population has been so decimated by warfare and genocide that parties draft children into military service. The Nazis started to do the same thing, if you will recall, and the Soviets did widespread militarization of women, but that was another matter entirely). So the presence of women and children does not make the target civilian. Hand on heart on all of the above, and I’m totally against this absurd adventure in Bushland. The bodies and videotape does not make it a wedding. On the other hand, the military has not exactly earned the ability to say something and be trusted at its word in the past few weeks… ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/114 "2004-05-23T00:42:03Z")
Or, I suppose it could have been footage shot earlier in the war, or even at some other time. I have no idea, it DOES sound fishy. Then again, it seems easy enough to check out. All they’d have to do is show the bodies to journalists if that many women and children were killed. I’ve seen no photos, nor any independant observers that claim to have seen them and photographed them. It just seems that the military is sticking to this story pretty hard. Just doesn’t seem logical that they would stick so hard if there was hard evidence they were wrong about the ‘safe house’ being an actual wedding. It also seems like it would be easy to verify if it was in fact a wedding…by something other than anacedotal evidence. I’m going to await developments on this one. To me, it sounds fishy all around, and I don’t think we have enough evidence one way or the other to make a sound judgement. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Zagadka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zagadka/32/7272_2.png) [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/115 "2004-05-23T00:46:14Z")
_realizes something_ Maybe it was a insurgent wedding. No, seriously. Maybe two insurgents were getting married at a holding point for insurgents. Maybe they all just got drunk and started shooting into the air. This makes the stories of both sides - that it was a wedding, and that it was a terrorist safehouse - true, it accounts for the lack of “evidence” in the form of leftover food, gifts, etc, it accounts for the population being bent towards fighting-aged men… ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/116 "2004-05-23T01:17:46Z")
> [@](#): > > Kimmitt said troops did not find anything – such as a wedding tent, gifts, musical instruments, decorations or leftover food – that would indicate a wedding had been held. There is a link to a video in this article from USA today [http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2004-05-21-wedding-iraq\_x.htm](http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2004-05-21-wedding-iraq_x.htm) The video shows relatives picking the remains of what they say are traditional wedding gifts, and one child appears wounded being treated in a bed. ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/117 "2004-05-23T01:37:16Z")
> **[Iraqis lose right to sue troops over war crimes](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/may/23/iraq.military)** > > Military win immunity pledge in deal on UN vote. One thing we DO know about the government. It does not want to take a chance before an independent tribunal, even if composed of its own citizens (ie, an american jury) . ---
**Author:** ![alaricthegoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4bbf92/32.png) [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/118 "2004-05-23T01:47:36Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > There is a link to a video in this article from USA today > > [http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2004-05-21-wedding-iraq\_x.htm](http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/iraq/2004-05-21-wedding-iraq_x.htm) > > The video shows relatives picking the remains of what they say are traditional wedding gifts, and one child appears wounded being treated in a bed. I would caution my more centrist doper brothers and sisters that we here on the gonzo fringe would really question the provenance of those sundry items of "evidence’ adduced by kimmitt (the 300 travel paks, , etc.) I mean, the THE FUCKING WEDDING SINGER IS DEAD! Wjhat, Adam Sandler is a terrorist? I don’t think so… ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/119 "2004-05-23T01:49:04Z")
> [@USA Today](#): > > It is the first known footage of the aftermath of Wednesday’s attack, which killed up to 45 people, **mostly women and children** from the Bou Fahad tribe in Mogr el-Deeb, a desert village on the Syrian border. (Related video: Survivors dig through the rubble) I don’t know. These guys are saying it was MOSTLY women and children, the military saying there were only a few women and no children. I watched the video btw…you can’t tell a single thing from it. It could be all from the same place, or it could be pieced together. They showed one little boy all banged up ( ☹ !!) and a few other people being treated, but mostly it was footage of people picking through the rubble of one of the buildings. I didn’t see any ‘instruments’ or other wedding stuff thats claimed in the article…but then, you couldn’t really see much of anything except rubble and some tents and a few things obviously on display (looked like pillows to me). So, again, I don’t think we know enough. Right now it seems to be that both sides stories are radically different. So, I’d say that this means someone is lieing, someone is telling the ‘truth’…or at least shades thereof. If both stories are so different, I’d say that the REAL story will eventually come out. -XT ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124/120 "2004-05-23T01:54:41Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#): > > I mean, the THE FUCKING WEDDING SINGER IS DEAD! No, Mr. Goth…they SAY the ‘wedding singer’ is dead. But how do you KNOW that the ‘wedding singer’ is dead? Did you know this wedding singer? Who can verify that he was in fact a wedding singer? Also, was wedding singing ALL he did? I could point at a dead body too and say, ‘That guy was a wedding singer!’ to a reporter. Look, it might be as you say. Perhaps it WAS a wedding and the military fucked up and is not trying to cover up. If they are, it will be found out in the end, so its kind of stupid of them. However, we don’t KNOW much of anything yet. Its all mostly anacedotal evidence at this point. I know you are reflexively mistrustful of anything the military says. However, its not THAT far out for me to advocate a wait and see approach. The evidence I’ve seen thus far is a bit, er, thin, on BOTH sides. -XT [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-sue-us-not-happy-we-shot-up-your-wedding-party-tell-it-to-the-judge/246124.md?page=7)