# So tell me, what defines a True Atheist? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 2, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222 "2017-03-02T18:07:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/21 "2017-03-02T19:02:52Z")
> [@HumbleThinker](#): > > Both questions are silly. Perhaps. I’m willing to drop the “True” part of the question in my own thread, and I certainly haven’t dwelled on it there. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/22 "2017-03-02T19:04:20Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > This: “_a person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God_” is not at all the same as the personal definition I gave in my first post. > By the way, why does your definition of “agnostic” us the term “God”, and not “gods”? Are you agnostic against one particular “god”, and dismissive entirely of all the others, or are you agnostic towards _all_ gods? I quoted a standard internet dictionary definition. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/23 "2017-03-02T19:05:34Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > If my question is silly and rhetorical, why isnt his? No, his is as well. The agnostic/atheist debate is silly as well. As far as I’m concerned, if you think there’s as much evidence for god as there is for little green men on mars or a teapot orbiting on the other side of the sun, you’re an atheist. If you want to call yourself an agnostic to avoid arguments with religious-minded people, that’s your business. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/24 "2017-03-02T19:05:58Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > - atheism is the belief that there are no deities.\* A atheist is\* certain\* there is no god. I disagree. Certainty is not required. I am as certain that there are no gods as I am certain there are no unicorns. Show me a unicorn and I will reevaluate. Same with gods. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/25 "2017-03-02T19:10:25Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I disagree. Certainty is not required. I am as certain that there are no gods as I am certain there are no unicorns. Show me a unicorn and I will reevaluate. Same with gods. Is “Aunicornism” a religion? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/26 "2017-03-02T19:11:25Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > I quoted a standard internet dictionary definition. And my second question? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/27 "2017-03-02T19:15:59Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Czarcasm asked: “What exactly defines one as a “True Christian”, and not one in name only?” so I asked the same. > > If my question is silly and rhetorical, why isnt his? Because the issue of “What is a Christian?” is inherently more complicated. Complicated enough that actual wars have been fought over this exact question. Meanwhile, “Atheist” [has a clear-cut definition](http://www.dictionary.com/browse/atheist), which has only ever been disputed by people trying to score silly points in silly arguments. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/28 "2017-03-02T19:19:52Z")
I just might qualify as a fake atheist. Or a less-than-“True” atheist. I’ve been told by some that I don’t qualify as theistic in their eyes. Or that I’m using the word “God” in a way that doesn’t have legitimate overlap with how the rest of the world uses it, etc. On the other hand, I don’t go forth self-identifying as an atheist. If there’s any meaningful sense in which someone is a “true atheist” it would seem to revolve around them utilizing that definition themselves. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/29 "2017-03-02T19:22:50Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > But isnt that the difference between being agnostic and atheist? There really is no significant difference. An agnostic is by definition an atheist (one who literally lacks belief in a deity). And then there is the other odd hybrid called “apatheism”, which takes the position, _even if the existence of a deity could be conclusively proven, it would make no difference_. Most atheists, as far as I can tell, just do not give a shit. Some have mystical inclinations, which are not, _per se_, contrary to atheism, while others are absolute materialists, with a broad spectrum of views between and beyond those extremes. Generally speaking, atheism means little or no attention is spent on “spiritual” concerns, and religulousness is only a concern whenever it makes efforts to force the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/30 "2017-03-02T19:25:01Z")
I’ve said before, that I think atheism a problematic term. I guess there could be folk out there who reject theism, but believe in alien abduction, witchcraft and magic, unicorns, and ESP… But I haven’t met them. And the difference between a theist and some spiritual goof who sits around in a drum circle? I don’t care. They’re both acting on insufficiently supported belief. The same way atheists only reject one more god than most believers, theism is only one aspect of the supernatural that I reject. A more appropriate term would be nontheist, to stress the irrelevance of the concept to anything i consider important. Or Humanist, should you wish to focus on what you believe, rather than one of many things you reject. Parsing between atheism and agnosticism also strikes me as pretty silly. Sure, no one can prove that no gods exist. We can sit around and think up countless other “possibilities” that cannot be disproven. A common activity among undergrads. But when a concept lacks credible support, and a great deal of evidence consistently supports the opposite conclusion, I suggest there is little meaningful difference between contending “it isn’t” vs “it hasn’t been proven.” Get back to me when he/she/it writes their name across the heavens in the stars. Or stop by and chortle at me as I pitch into the pit of hellfire. Until then, I’m not really interested in your fantasies, and have better things to do - like pretty much anything or nothing! ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/31 "2017-03-02T19:28:13Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > I disagree. Certainty is not required. I am as certain that there are no gods as I am certain there are no unicorns. Show me a unicorn and I will reevaluate. Same with gods. Define a “unicorn”. We can make a unicorn- a goat or a cow with one horn in the center of it’s brow. Rhinos, the source for the mythological unicorn do exist. Narwals the source for unicorn horn, exist. Have _you_ ever seen a Bamboo Lemur? Do you doubt their existence? ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/32 "2017-03-02T19:29:48Z")
“What defines an atheist” has been debated in dozens of threads here on the SDMB. Do we really need one more? Etymologically, “a-theist” simply means “without god(s).” That seems a reasonable definition to me—which means it’s not a matter of what you _do_ believe or _do_ do, as long as you don’t believe in, acknowledge, or worship any sort of god. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/33 "2017-03-02T19:33:15Z")
Is a True Atheist like a True Scotsman? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/34 "2017-03-02T19:37:45Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > It’s a form of Faith or Belief Only in the sense that genetic engineering is. Not going to play any variation of the game that tries to equate the two and then debate them differentially. > [@](#): > > and some Atheists proselytize. Only in the same way Army recruiters do. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/35 "2017-03-02T19:41:00Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > “What defines an atheist” has been debated in dozens of threads here on the SDMB. Do we really need one more? “What defines a Christian” has been debated in dozens of threads here on the SDMB. Do we really need one more? are you posting the same query in Czarcasm’s thread? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/36 "2017-03-02T19:41:53Z")
Heck, I was never a Christian and I still say “Jeez!” and “Christ!” at times when annoyed. It’s just cultural osmosis. And I don’t believe in Heck, either, but it makes a handy way to start a sentence at times. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/37 "2017-03-02T19:45:20Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > “What defines a Christian” has been debated in dozens of threads here on the SDMB. Do we really need one more? > > are you posting the same query in Czarcasm’s thread? I’m not debating the question in my own thread-I’m accepting the answers that are given. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/38 "2017-03-02T19:45:44Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And my second question? which is? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/39 "2017-03-02T19:48:11Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I’m not debating the question in my own thread-I’m accepting the answers that are given. I doubt that and I doubt your stated reason for starting that thread. You have seen countless threads before on the same subject. Did you think the answer had changed or did you forget? Remember what I said- Atheists proselytize. They sometimes do this by the old “Just asking questions”. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2017, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222/40 "2017-03-02T19:52:24Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > which is? The one following the one you already answered. > [@](#): > > Are you agnostic against one particular “god”, and dismissive entirely of all the others, or are you agnostic towards all gods? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-tell-me-what-defines-a-true-atheist/781222.md?page=3)