# So the .22 ammo "shortage" is still a thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 27, 2015, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164 "2015-03-27T23:46:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/41 "2015-03-30T16:14:24Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > Also, retail managers pay close attention to what they call “turns”, which is how fast they “turn over” their stock - sell it out and refill the shelves. More sales today = quicker turns = bigger bonus check, at least at my company. The problem is that the supply isn’t available, so it’s not “more sales today = quicker turns.” Instead, it’s “more sales today = empty shelves for days or weeks.” Having empty shelves every time a customer comes in results in unhappy customers, and those don’t garner bigger bonus checks. Moreover, as River Hippie notes, if customers think they can’t get .22LR ammo, they’re not going to buy guns that require it, thus depressing product sales. Also, if you don’t ration sales and a competitor does, you may lose customers to that competitor (“I can buy as many boxes as I want at Alpha, but they never have it in stock; I can only buy two boxes at Beta, but I can be pretty sure they’ll have two boxes on the shelf.” If your customers learn they need to go somewhere else to buy their ammo, they may be permanently lost to you, for ammo AND other goods.) ---
**Author:** ![MacTech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MacTech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacTech)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/42 "2015-03-30T18:16:42Z")
Why build up a personal stash of .22 rimfire ammo? First, it doesn’t go bad like perishable produce or canned goods Secondly, the price will ever go down Thirdly, if you planned ahead and built up a stash previous to a shortage, you can ride out the shortage while still shooting, albeit at a reduced rate, to stretch out a difficult to replace supply I have no problem with “hoarders” as long as the following conditions are met 1; the ammo will eventually be used 2; they don’t try to sell it on auction sites at obscene markup 3; they’re not buying out their limit just to resell it on gunbroker/arms list/otherfirearmsauctionsites If they do the last two, they’re no longer hoarders, but that most scum baggy of scumbags, _flippers_ Selling $20-25 brick/bulk pack of ammo for $75-150 or more is just jerkish behavior Thankfully, the solution is easy, just don’t buy from scumbag flippers, let them choke on the piles of ammo they bought for the sole purpose of marking it up to gouging levels ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/43 "2015-03-30T18:51:14Z")
> [@](#): > > Thankfully, the solution is easy, just don’t buy from scumbag flippers, let them choke on the piles of ammo they bought for the sole purpose of marking it up to gouging levels yeah, but in the meantime the rest of us can’t find shit. ---
**Author:** ![Orwell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/dfb087/32.png) [@Orwell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Orwell)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/44 "2015-03-30T19:10:16Z")
> [@MacTech](#): > > Selling $20-25 brick/bulk pack of ammo for $75-150 or more is just jerkish behavior > > Thankfully, the solution is easy, just don’t buy from scumbag flippers, let them choke on the piles of ammo they bought for the sole purpose of marking it up to gouging levels I’ve been doing that for three years. I just checked my records. I bought a Henry lever-action .22 rifle in May 2012. I remember at that time buying two bricks of .22 ammo (one Blazer and one Federal, if I recall correctly) for $16 to $18. I also recall thinking those prices were high, as I was used to buying bricks for $10 to $12 not too many years before. Well, it’s three years later, and I have seen very few bricks of .22 ammo on the shelves of any stores I’ve shopped at. The exception is when Field & Stream opened a new store and they had .22 ammo as a grand opening gesture/ploy. Since the grand opening, of course, they’ve been sold out, as has Dicks, Dunhams, Gander Mountain, Walmart, etc. In any event, I’m very glad I had stockpiled a reasonable amount of .22 ammo several years ago. But I also shoot less than I really want to because I can’t go buy more at a reasonable price, and I refuse to reward the bastards who are lining up at Walmart at 5AM to buy all the ammo and then sell it on gunbroker or online classifieds. I frankly am still surprised that .22 ammo is still not widely available. I’ve heard that Remington is opening a new manufacturing plant, which should certainly help. I can only hope that the market will correct and all of these guys sitting on hundreds of thousands of rounds have to dump them on the market at reasonable prices. I’m pretty sure I’ll never see $10 bricks again, but I’m hoping for $20 ones. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/45 "2015-03-30T20:13:43Z")
If you’re on Facebook, try joining one of the local gun groups. They usually do a pretty good job of self-policing and those that are trying to profiteer are hounded away fairly quickly. Members will often also post where and when a local store has .22 ammo in stock. I gave away ~700 rounds of .22LR at Christmas through one of the Facebook groups, I offered to send boxes of 50 rounds to anyone who bought their kid a .22 for Christmas. I’m sure a couple of them were adults “scamming” me, but I can live with that if they can. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2015, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/46 "2015-03-30T23:43:23Z")
> [@slash2k](#): > > The problem is that the supply isn’t available, so it’s not “more sales today = quicker turns.” Instead, it’s “more sales today = empty shelves for days or weeks.” Having empty shelves every time a customer comes in results in unhappy customers, and those don’t garner bigger bonus checks. Moreover, as River Hippie notes, if customers think they can’t get .22LR ammo, they’re not going to buy guns that require it, thus depressing product sales. Also, if you don’t ration sales and a competitor does, you may lose customers to that competitor (“I can buy as many boxes as I want at Alpha, but they never have it in stock; I can only buy two boxes at Beta, but I can be pretty sure they’ll have two boxes on the shelf.” If your customers learn they need to go somewhere else to buy their ammo, they may be permanently lost to you, for ammo AND other goods.) Sure, that’s a valid point - for a gun store. But for the manager of a Walmart or Bass Pro Shops, who might have 100,000 - 150,000 SKUs in her store, having no .22 ammo means she just fills that slot on the shelf with 9mm ammo, or reloading supplies, or camouflage Fruit of the Looms. Stores typically make more profit off small, inexpensive things - screws and nails, for example - than they do off of bigger, high ticket items. Besides, the manager of a big national superstore like Walmart will know that if _she_ can’t get .22 ammo, neither can Mom and Pop’s Firearm Emporium down the street, either. I’m not trying to threadshit or start an argument here, and we can drop this subject if you’d like. Just trying to explain why your average big box retailer doesn’t care about hoarders. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/47 "2015-03-31T01:33:31Z")
The best part about hoarders for retail is they’re a self-reinforcing feedback loop. The harder the stuff is to get the more folks want it. I suspect that if the manufacturers ramped up supply to double the current volume over the course of say a year, the hoarders would absorb all of that and the price would still be going up continuously. To be sure, there IS some upper limit. But IMO we’re nowhere near that point in ammo, .22LR or otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![scootergirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e99b99/32.png) [@scootergirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scootergirl)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/48 "2015-03-31T02:31:51Z")
Where I live it’s sold within hours of it arriving anywhere it’s sold. I have found it, however, at Dick’s Sporting Goods, Big5, Walmart and BiMart - which is a local store in my region. ---
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/49 "2015-03-31T03:05:53Z")
I found a single .22LR on the sidewalk the other day. I felt like I’d just found a $20 bill. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/50 "2015-03-31T15:54:18Z")
It is still happening and it is so annoying. I am so tired of hearing the fearmongering. Everyone hoards it. We actually just found some at the Bass Pro shop a couple of weeks ago. They have a limit to how many boxes you can buy at most places. When we came back through, all gone. I don’t want a Republican president. I’d just like to get some ammo so I can go shooting now and then. - Affirmed liberal and gun owner ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/51 "2015-03-31T16:52:54Z")
I just wish the hysteria would spread to ‘assault weapons’. I’d like to sell most of mine – at a large profit. (Also a liberal and a gun-owner.) ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/52 "2015-03-31T21:15:28Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I just wish the hysteria would spread to ‘assault weapons’. I’d like to sell most of mine – at a large profit. > > (Also a liberal and a gun-owner.) It’s amazing how much easier it is for folks to get hysterical about hoarding stuff that costs $20 versus $200 or 2000. Said another way, given the shape of the income (or assets) distribution curve, the smart money fans the flames at the cheap end and cleans up. There simply aren’t enough jillionaires to start a profitable hoarding frenzy for super-yachts. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/53 "2015-04-01T06:13:44Z")
> [@River\_Hippie](#): > > Is this the new normal? Is it going to last until we get a Republican president again? For the benefit of confused foreigners, the Democrat President is not restricting the production or sale of bullets. The shortage arises as Patriots stock up so they can hold off the Feds when the crypto-terrorist Kenyan Islamo-atheist sends his thugs to take Grannie to the death camp. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/54 "2015-04-01T07:36:37Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > For the benefit of confused foreigners, the Democrat President is not restricting the production or sale of bullets. The shortage arises as Patriots stock up so they can hold off the Feds when the crypto-terrorist Kenyan Islamo-atheist sends his thugs to take Grannie to the death camp. And have you been visiting them in their bunkers for the past month and thus missed the news when the President’s Administration actually tried to restrict the sale of bullets? ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/55 "2015-04-01T15:17:57Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > And have you been visiting them in their bunkers for the past month and thus missed the news when the President’s Administration actually tried to restrict the sale of bullets? Link? ---
**Author:** ![Kansas\_Beekeeper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@Kansas\_Beekeeper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kansas_Beekeeper)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/56 "2015-04-01T15:35:22Z")
> [@River\_Hippie](#): > > Link? There was a bungled attempt to restrict one type of .223 bullet: > **[White House drops plans to ban "green tip" bullets](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/white-house-drops-plans-to-ban-green-tip-bullets/)** > > The Obama administration's proposal to drop the popular ammunition was met with loud criticism from Congress and the public ---
**Author:** ![MacTech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MacTech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacTech)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/57 "2015-04-01T16:39:10Z")
Plus, the “green tip” projectile isn’t even a true Armor Piercing round, true AP rounds have a hard metal core wrapped with a gliding metal jacket, the core could be steel, Depleted Uranium, tungsten or any number of harder than lead alloys, that’s the ENTIRE core of the bullet Green Tip only has a small front section, from the point of the bullet, back to approx. the start of the ogive, where the bullet starts to curve to a point, the rest of the bullet is lead core, both sections wrapped by a gliding metal jacket … Besides, _ANY_ rifle round can defeat the soft body armor used by police, level II and III vests are kevlar vests designed to stop handgun rounds only ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/58 "2015-04-01T17:19:51Z")
> [@thelurkinghorror](#): > > And have you been visiting them in their bunkers for the past month and thus missed the news when the President’s Administration actually tried to restrict the sale of bullets? > [@Kansas Beekeeper](#): > > There was a bungled attempt to restrict one type of .223 bullet: > > [http://www.cbsnews.com/news/white-ho...n-tip-bullets/](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/white-ho...n-tip-bullets/) Thank you for the link, but no, I don’t think **thelurkinghorror** should be let off this one. You made the point, cite it. I really want to know. The fearmongering is annoying. Around here: - Every single gun club is closed to new entrants because everyone joined as soon as Obama got elected - .22 ammo is being hoarded like mad and snatched up, as others have said - I know some gun control laws have been passed, or are being considered, or whatever. None of these have remotely affected me in my day to day life as much as the hoarders have. So? Please cite exactly where the President’s Administration tried to restrict the sale of bullets. How many, what kinds. Did it pass? Sure, I could look it up but I am going to actually do the thing SDMBers are so famous for. Cite??? ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/59 "2015-04-01T17:54:19Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > - I know some gun control laws have been passed, or are being considered, or whatever. None of these have remotely affected me in my day to day life as much as the hoarders have. It really doesn’t have to be about you, and it doesn’t matter whether it “passed” or not. I don’t own a .556/.223 either so it doesn’t affect me directly, but a law doesn’t have to be in my backyard for me to recognize it is stupid at best and troubling otherwise. It is especially insulting to the intelligence that green = bad due to spurious reasons (see **MacTech** ’s post). No cite was given because it was late, and really I thought it was common knowledge, there being a thread and all recently. ---
**Author:** ![River\_Hippie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/river_hippie/32/26_2.png) [@River\_Hippie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/River_Hippie)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2015, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164/60 "2015-04-01T18:15:39Z")
> [@MacTech](#): > > Plus, the “green tip” projectile isn’t even a true Armor Piercing round, true AP rounds have a hard metal core wrapped with a gliding metal jacket, the core could be steel, Depleted Uranium, tungsten or any number of harder than lead alloys, that’s the ENTIRE core of the bullet > > Green Tip only has a small front section, from the point of the bullet, back to approx. the start of the ogive, where the bullet starts to curve to a point, the rest of the bullet is lead core, both sections wrapped by a gliding metal jacket > > … Besides, _ANY_ rifle round can defeat the soft body armor used by police, level II and III vests are kevlar vests designed to stop handgun rounds only Armor piercing rounds are problematic for me as a second amendment supporter. Not so much because they penetrate body armor but because they could be used to wreak havoc on things like oil storage tanks, pipelines, power transmission substations, etc. I know all these things have been shot up from time to time but true AP rounds would be more destructive. If green tip is not true AP, what is it’s intended use? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-the-22-ammo-shortage-is-still-a-thing/716164.md?page=4)